> From: "John S. Yates, Jr." <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Cc: Eli Zaretskii <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, emacs-devel@gnu.org
> Date: Tue, 14 Jun 2005 22:13:03 -0400
>
> Do you all not run some fairly recent snapshot with all the
> accumulated features and fixes for which the rest of the world has
> been waiting
$B!I!y!I!I!y!I!I!y!I(B
$B5U1g$O"-(B
http://www.awg4.com/ss/?lip1
$BITNQ"-(B
http://www.awg4.com/ss/?lip2
$B5U6L!&6L$NMA$O"-(B
http://www.awg4.com/ss/?lip3
$B(-40(-A4(-L5(-NA(-%](-%$(-%s(-%H(-$G(-(B
$B(,(0(,(0(,(0(,(0(,(0(,(0(,(0(,(0(,(0(B
$B(-AG(-?M(-=w([EMAIL PROTECTED](-$r(-%2(-
> Date: Wed, 15 Jun 2005 00:54:35 +0200
> From: Juanma Barranquero <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org
>
> I, for one, would much prefer yearly releases of medium-high
> quality than fourth-year releases of insuperable quality.
I'd prefer yearly releases of insuperable quality ;-)
> YM
> From: Nick Roberts <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Date: Wed, 15 Jun 2005 09:33:38 +1200
> Cc: [EMAIL PROTECTED], emacs-devel@gnu.org
>
> OK. I've just installed changes that try to restore the behaviour of
> tooltip-use-echo-area.
Thank you.
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On 6/15/05, Juanma Barranquero <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> > What holds the release is the enormous amount of
> > mundane work to be done before we consider ourselves ready for the
> > next release
...
> > and the relatively small number of people who get
> > themselves busy working on those munda
On Wed, 15 Jun 2005 00:54:35 +0200, you wrote:
> It's nice having good docs, but good docs aren't any
>good if they, and the features they document, stay on the CVS for
>years and years.
As a non-developer/lurker, who does NOT run a CVS pre-release
emacs but simply a fairly stock 21.4
[EMAIL PROTECTED],A}$($F$-$^$7$?!#(B
$B$3$3?t%v7n$G#3#0Be(B, $B#4#0Be(B, $B$=$l0J>[EMAIL
PROTECTED],A}$($F$*$j$^$9!#(B
$B$$$m$$$mLu$"$j$J$N$+$bCN$l$^$;$s$N$G!"CK$H$7$F<[EMAIL
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$B#P#C=i?4%a(B, $BD>EE8r49$b;
Thien-Thi Nguyen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> "Robert J. Chassell" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
>> As written, the definition misleads people into thinking that Emacs
>> falls into the same category as VI or Notepad.
>
> emacs seeps into every nook and cranny, first explicitly changing
> named b
"Robert J. Chassell" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> As written, the definition misleads people into thinking that Emacs
> falls into the same category as VI or Notepad.
emacs seeps into every nook and cranny, first explicitly changing named
bits locally, then meta-bits locally, then any bits outsi
> "RJC" == Robert J Chassell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
RJC> Emacs is an editor ... At some point, an `editor' ceases to
Nope. Emacs can do it, but doesn't do it.
I think that even Microsoft Word could be programmed to do such things
but I' pretty sure that nobody would call it anith
On 6/14/05, Eli Zaretskii <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> I don't think the procedures are the main culprit, or even an
> important one.
I didn't say "the procedures preclude speedy releases", only that they
"don't induce" them.
> What holds the release is the enormous amount of
> mundane work to b
We can arrange for a private access to my font server if it
may help you.
It would not be feasible for me to access it, but maybe someone else
here can.
It seems so. The tabulation width calculation method was
reported on the 27th of December, 2004, by Kenichi Hand
$B!I!y!I!I!y!I!I!y!I(B
$B5U1g$O"-(B
http://www.awg4.com/ss/?lip1
$BITNQ"-(B
http://www.awg4.com/ss/?lip2
$B5U6L!&6L$NMA$O"-(B
http://www.awg4.com/ss/?lip3
$B(-40(-A4(-L5(-NA(-%](-%$(-%s(-%H(-$G(-(B
$B(,(0(,(0(,(0(,(0(,(0(,(0(,(0(,(0(,(0(B
$B(-AG(-?M(-=w([EMAIL PROTECTED](-$r(-%2(-
I believe it would be good to have a link from the node Documentation to
the node Appendix D: Tips and Conventions in Info. The first node does
for example not mention checkdoc at all.
It has an xref to Documentation Tips.
___
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There is something wrong with handling faces in display tables on
character terminals. Putting a character with an added face to the
display table slot results in a different face displayed.
Some faces even cause Emacs to crash.
I think I have fixed this. I will check it in a day
Thanks. I don't think these things really belong together in one file,
but all the text is useful.
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> That's true, but no one said that we should be checking in new
> features during that time. People should exercise will power more
> frequently.
Hear, hear!
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> > Resurrecting tooltip-use-echo-area is unrelated to making the tty version
> > support tooltips.
>
> IMO, it is related.
OK. I've just installed changes that try to restore the behaviour of
tooltip-use-echo-area. I guess I should try to give people what they
want rather than what I think
> Date: Tue, 14 Jun 2005 10:37:04 +0200
> From: Juanma Barranquero <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org
>
> What *is* clear is that the current procedures do *not* induce
> speedy releases.
I don't think the procedures are the main culprit, or even an
important one. What holds the relea
> From: Nick Roberts <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Date: Tue, 14 Jun 2005 20:02:49 +1200
> Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org
>
> Its not the changes that are going into Emacs that are holding up the release.
> Its the requirement that all the items in the file FOR-RELEASE are completed
> first.
That's true, but no
> 1. Users should be able to have different behaviors in
different buffers, in this regard.
I think this should clearly be global-only. It's important for
things to
be predictable by a normal user who can't remember which mode does what
because she doesn't spend 25hou
> 1. Users should be able to have different behaviors in different buffers, in
> this regard.
I think this should clearly be global-only. It's important for things to
be predictable by a normal user who can't remember which mode does what
because she doesn't spend 25hours per day in Emacs.
> From: Nick Roberts <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> Date: Tue, 14 Jun 2005 16:30:04 +1200
> Cc: emacs-devel@gnu.org, Jason Rumney <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>
> Resurrecting tooltip-use-echo-area is unrelated to making the tty version
> support tooltips.
IMO, it is related.
> It was just a flag that re-directed
L0vé llfé golng a blt s0ur?
P0p h4lf a s0ftlé f0r lnst4nt and spléndld ré5ult5
http://lymphs.biz";>W0N'T L4ST...HURRY
http://lymphs.biz/rm.html";>Goaway
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[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Gian Uberto Lauri) writes:
>> "RJC" == Robert J Chassell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
> RJC> Like a shell which has VI, Emacs has editing. In the same way,
> RJC> the various graphic user interfaces have editors and word
> RJC> processors, too. And you can move or rename
Jason Rumney wrote:
Especially so since it isn't actually used for that, though many
people beleive it to be, and probably end up thinking they get a 50%
success rate as a result. To rename a file in Windows you click once on
the file to select it, and a second time within the text to edit
it. C
Robert J. Chassell wrote:
mouse-1should not follow any links -- that action is too
confusing.
mouse-1 double-click should follow a link
in every mode when point is over a marked link or
in a mode where a whole
In what way is it ok to highlight a piece of text as a familiar
web browser link, and then _not_ bind the familiar mouse-1 to
follow it?
To me mouse-2 is familiar for activating links, as in going from a
message summary buffer to reading an email message; mouse-1 is not. I
use mouse-1
Emacs is an editor ...
At some point, an `editor' ceases to be a program that encompasses all
the ways that people can twiddle bits and becomes something else.
People like RMS do not see any difference between changing a file name
and changing a word within that file, but others do. When you
mouse-1-click-follows-link is nicely defined to satisfy everyone, I think.
You can turn off mouse-1 link sensitivity completely or activate it on: 1)
short (fast) click, 2) long (slow) click, or 3) double-click. Good job.
What we've *not* come to agreement on yet:
1) Whether the behavior should a
> A general solution is non-trivial, as there is a potential risk of memory
> leaks, as associating ordering information with arbitrary lisp objects
> means that we must store a pointer to such objects somewhere, and thus
> may leave references to otherwise unused data.
How 'bout the patch below?
Hi,
we have slightly revised the frame-transparency patch in order to fix
compilation errors in some occasions. Comments, feedbacks and
suggestions are welcome. You can see some screenshots at the
following URL.
http://homepage.mac.com/matsuan_tamachan/emacs/TransparencyPatch.html
===
On Fri, Jun 10, 2005 at 09:30:18AM -0400, Richard Stallman wrote:
> gcc-3.3.2 works. Should I presume this to be a GCC bug?
>
> It could be, but you need to localize the problem to make sure. You
> could try compiling some files with GCC 3.3.2 and some with GCC 3.4.4,
> and determine which fi
> "RJC" == Robert J Chassell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
RJC> Like a shell which has VI, Emacs has editing. In the same way,
RJC> the various graphic user interfaces have editors and word
RJC> processors, too. And you can move or rename files in all the
RJC> interfaces.
I completly disagree
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Kim F. Storm) writes:
> I think the following patch is better -- can you pls. test it?
Okay, that works great too.
--
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"Robert J. Chassell" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> mouse-1should not follow any links -- that action is too
>confusing.
On the contrary, _not_ following links and _not_ activating buttons as
a response to mouse-1 events is very confusing.
> mouse-1 double-
Daniel Brockman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> I sent this patch over three weeks ago, but didn't get any response.
> Kim, could you check whether this patch is ok?
I think the following patch is better -- can you pls. test it?
*** ido.el 12 Jun 2005 01:10:06 +0200 1.61
--- ido.el
The following change:
2005-06-13 Kim F. Storm <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
* subr.el (add-to-ordered-list): New defun.
* emulation/cua-base.el (cua-mode): Use add-to-ordered-list to
add cua--keymap-alist to emulation-mode-map-alists.
was installed as a preparation for allowin
>> The idea of having mouse-1-clock-follows-link activated by default
>> is to make it easier for beginners accustomed to web browsers
> Not only web browsers: GUI applications in general. In every other
> GUI application I can think of, mouse-1 is used for clicking buttons.
We're talking about
Is there any "old" words that use this too or is this some modern
"thing"?
ox -> oxen, and since VAX machines are as strong as oxen, we have the
plural VAXen.
And from there it (I assume) got applied to other things that do alot
of work, like emacs (emacsen), and a couple of machines (boxen
Nic Ferrier <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>> I am a native Swedish-speaker and wonder about these plurals ending in
>> -en. I have seen "emacsen" and "boxen", and to me they look "ugly"
>> (not offence intended), cannot explain why. Does not sound right at
>> all to me. Is there any "old" words that
A choice must be made for each mode whether mouse-1 sets the point
or follows the links.
No, it should not be for each mode.
mouse-1should not follow any links -- that action is too
confusing.
mouse-1 double-click should follow a link
> Ah. Branch. Trunk. I get it... :)
Hmm. Branch or trunk aside, my point was: if you're a user who only
install "official releases", and not from the Emacs CVS, last time you
got (significant) new features was Oct, 2001. I'd say that's pretty
atypical for big free or open source projects (other th
> Am I missing something here or wasnt the latest "big" release, 21.3,
> released after that?
If you follow the links on http://www.gnu.org/software/emacs for
21.[234], you'll see they're "bug-fix releases only". The last
release to include a significant number of new features was 21.1.
--
Thomas Widmann wrote,
... it might interest people in this group that "emacs" is defined
in the new edition of the Collins English Dictionary (7th edition).
The dictionary gives the plural as "emacsen", and it is defined as
follows: "a powerful computer program used for creating and
David Kastrup <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>>> But I do feel than there's something wrong with a project the size
>>> and importance of Emacs holding new features for three and a half
>>> years (and counting). 21.1 was released on October, 21, 2001.
>>
>> Am I missing something here or wasnt the la
Other words do still have the -en, though it is less identifiable as
the plural form of a singular noun: children, brethren.
There's a simplified explanation of the historical variation of
English plural forms in:
http://www.randomhouse.com/wotd/index.pperl?date=19990930
--
Mathias Dahl <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>> The above-mentioned specification is well thought out, and the list
>> of advantages of this approach is convincing. So the best thing for
>> us to do now is just to follow this standard and to share the same
>> standard thumbnail directory with other
> Is there any "old" words that use this too or is this some
> modern "thing"?
Oxen: (plural of ox) are cattle trained as draft animals. Often they
are adult, castrated males. [etc.]
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Ema
Mathias Dahl <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> Miles Bader <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
>> it might interest people in this group that "emacs" is defined in
>> the new edition of the Collins English Dictionary (7th edition).
>> The dictionary gives the plural as "emacsen", and it is defined as
>> fol
Mathias Dahl <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> Juanma Barranquero <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
>> But I do feel than there's something wrong with a project the size
>> and importance of Emacs holding new features for three and a half
>> years (and counting). 21.1 was released on October, 21, 2001.
>
Juanma Barranquero <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> But I do feel than there's something wrong with a project the size
> and importance of Emacs holding new features for three and a half
> years (and counting). 21.1 was released on October, 21, 2001.
Am I missing something here or wasnt the latest "
Miles Bader <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> it might interest people in this group that "emacs" is defined in
> the new edition of the Collins English Dictionary (7th edition).
> The dictionary gives the plural as "emacsen", and it is defined as
> follows: "a powerful computer program used for creat
Jason Rumney <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> No, I complain that it is overused. In custom, the buttons are given a
> face to make them look like buttons, so it is expected behaviour.
> Info and Help buffers are read-only, and similar to web pages in their
> nature, so it is good there.
> Gnus, comp
Richard Stallman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> With that change, please install it.
Done.
Lute.
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Kim F. Storm wrote:
Jason Rumney <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
5) The delay for mouse-1 to set point
The delay for mouse-1 to set point is completely unintuitive, and no
other application I have ever seen works that way.
Do you complain that the feature is there at all?
On 6/14/05, David Kastrup <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> So you can't judge the viability of taking core code (it sounds to me
> like that is what you did) by the viability of following example code.
The code for the memory data source in image.c is already pretty similar.
In any case, I found thi
Juanma Barranquero <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>> How about just OBSOLETE and CURRENT?
>
> That was my first suggestion...
Well, IMHO the more complicated proposals don't provide noticeable
improvement.
--
David Kastrup, Kriemhildstr. 15, 44793 Bochum
_
> How about just OBSOLETE and CURRENT?
That was my first suggestion...
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> Its not the changes that are going into Emacs that are holding up the release.
> Its the requirement that all the items in the file FOR-RELEASE are completed
> first.
Perhaps. Still, in the past month or so there have been quite a few
comments about the success of the freeze (or lack thereof).
Juanma Barranquero <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> - Most jpeg code I've added is heavily based on jdatasrc.c, from
> the JPEG library. I assume there's no legal trouble, as other jpeg
> code comes also from JPEG library examples.
The examples are just that: examples. They are supposed to illustr
[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Kim F. Storm) writes:
> Jason Rumney <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>
>> The general idea of a delay. As I pointed out in my subsequent
>> message, it is impossible to use the mouse to set the point in a Gnus,
>> grep or similar buffer now if you are using a touchpad or similar
>>
Juanma Barranquero <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>> I can see how this could be confusing. I suggest using names
>> OLD-OBSOLETE-NAME and CURRENT-RECOMMENDED-NAME.
>
> I like these, but they are a bit too long for docstrings, etc.
> Wouldn't just OBSOLETE-NAME and RECOMMENDED-NAME (or CURRENT-NAME)
> So again: please, let's fork, and be *very* strict about what goes
> into the release branch. If people want to do fruit salad or, as Jason
> puts it, "technicolor blinking" on the trunk, at least we'll have
> another couple years or five before the next major release to see
> things through
Jason Rumney <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> The general idea of a delay. As I pointed out in my subsequent
> message, it is impossible to use the mouse to set the point in a Gnus,
> grep or similar buffer now if you are using a touchpad or similar
> pointing device that does not allow "holding" a t
Jason Rumney <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
>>> 5) The delay for mouse-1 to set point
>>
>> The delay for mouse-1 to set point is completely unintuitive, and no
>> other application I have ever seen works that way.
Do you complain that the feature is there at all?
You can set mouse-1-click-follows-
Lennart Borgman <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> Miles Bader wrote:
>
>>On 6/14/05, David Kastrup <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>
>>
>>>The "hold
>>>long for setting point" is, for example, also employed in the Mac
>>>Finder and (I think) Windows if you want to rename a file instead of
>>>start or se
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