Re: Escaping from the world of 3p Flatland

2013-01-20 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 17 Jan 2013, at 23:17, Russell Standish wrote: Hi John, My suspicion is that Roger is so keen to impose a Piercean triadic view on things that he has omitted to make the necessary connection with the normal meaning of 1p/3p as standing for subjective/objective. I agree. It is always

Re: Algorithmic Thermodynamics

2013-01-20 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 18 Jan 2013, at 05:34, Russell Standish wrote: On Thu, Jan 17, 2013 at 09:25:20PM -0500, Stephen P. King wrote: On 1/17/2013 4:21 PM, Russell Standish wrote: From just the abstract alone, I can't see how this differs from the Solomonff universal prior? Hi Russell, OK, is that a good

Re: A God-limited God - My Theodicy

2013-01-20 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 18 Jan 2013, at 10:19, Roger Clough wrote: A God-limited God - My Theodicy A theodicy is a justification of God's ways to man. This is my theodicy, based on the Bible and reason. Comments appreciated. Most of the so-called contradictions in the Bible, such as a loving God lashing out at

Re: Escaping from the world of 3p Flatland

2013-01-20 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 18 Jan 2013, at 13:29, Roger Clough wrote: Hi Russell Standish Firstness is the mode of being of that which is such as it is, positively and without reference to anything else. This can make sense. We can relate this with the common notion of subjectivity. Secondness is the mode

Re: A God-limited God - My Theodicy

2013-01-20 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 18 Jan 2013, at 23:12, meekerdb wrote: On 1/18/2013 1:19 AM, Roger Clough wrote: A God-limited God - My Theodicy A theodicy is a justification of God's ways to man. This is my theodicy, based on the Bible and reason. Comments appreciated. Most of the so-called contradictions in the

Re: Math- Computation- Mind - Geometry - Space - Matter

2013-01-20 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 19 Jan 2013, at 00:15, Stephen P. King wrote: On 1/18/2013 1:08 PM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 17 Jan 2013, at 19:05, Stephen P. King wrote: Dear Bruno, I am discussing ontology, there is no such a process as Turing or 'realities' or objects yet at such a level. All is abstracted

Re: The unpredictability of solar energy

2013-01-20 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 18 Jan 2013, at 23:37, meekerdb wrote: On 1/18/2013 10:23 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 17 Jan 2013, at 19:14, Stephen P. King wrote: On 1/17/2013 9:14 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: Coming back to hemp should be the good idea. Oil and wood have replaced Hemp (for textile, fuel, paper and

Re: Is there an aether ?

2013-01-20 Thread Telmo Menezes
Hi Craig, On Sun, Jan 20, 2013 at 4:37 AM, Craig Weinberg whatsons...@gmail.comwrote: The whole worldview is built on the mistaken assumption that it is possible for something to exist without sensory participation. When you fail to factor that critically important physical reality into

Does energy obey the laws of materialism ?

2013-01-20 Thread Roger Clough
Does energy obey the laws of materialism ? Energy presents us with an argument against materialism, (or at least materialism as I understand it) since is conserved, regardess of form or physical location. Thus the electrical energy created in a generating station at one location can be

Does energy obey the laws of materialism ?

2013-01-20 Thread Roger Clough
Does energy obey the laws of materialism ? Energy presents us with an argument against materialism, (or at least materialism as I understand it) since is conserved, regardess of form or physical location. Thus the electrical energy created in a generating station at one location can be

Re: Does energy obey the laws of materialism ?

2013-01-20 Thread Telmo Menezes
Hi Roger, I would say the opposite - energy not being conserved would pose a harder challenge to materialism, because then you'd have to ask where it comes from and where it goes. On Sun, Jan 20, 2013 at 3:40 PM, Roger Clough rclo...@verizon.net wrote: Does energy obey the laws of

Re: HOW YOU CAN BECOME A LIBERAL THEOLOGIAN IN JUST 4 STEPS.

2013-01-20 Thread John Clark
On Sun, Jan 20, 2013 at 8:23 AM, Bruno Marchal marc...@ulb.ac.be wrote: There is no field of theology, removing the fairy tale aspect of it would be like removing the skin of a toy balloon. To say that there is no field of theology is equivalent to say I know the answer to the fundamental

Re: Idealism, theology, and the world of science Options

2013-01-20 Thread socra...@bezeqint.net
Question. What is DNA ? DNA consist on atoms and electromagnetic fields. In 1904 Lorentz proved: there isn’t em field without Electron It means the source of this em field must be an Electron Then we need to write : DNA is atoms, electron (s) and electromagnetic fields. The simplest particle -

Re: Math- Computation- Mind - Geometry - Space - Matter

2013-01-20 Thread Stephen P. King
On 1/20/2013 7:53 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 19 Jan 2013, at 00:15, Stephen P. King wrote: On 1/18/2013 1:08 PM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 17 Jan 2013, at 19:05, Stephen P. King wrote: Dear Bruno, I am discussing ontology, there is no such a process as Turing or 'realities' or objects

Re: Two Schrodinger cats

2013-01-20 Thread Bruno Marchal
On 19 Jan 2013, at 13:42, Telmo Menezes wrote: On Thu, Jan 17, 2013 at 5:47 PM, Bruno Marchal marc...@ulb.ac.be wrote: On 17 Jan 2013, at 16:01, Telmo Menezes wrote: On Thu, Jan 17, 2013 at 3:01 PM, Bruno Marchal marc...@ulb.ac.be wrote: On 17 Jan 2013, at 13:32, Telmo Menezes

Third person NDE

2013-01-20 Thread Bruno Marchal
Hi, Here is a crash investigation video. They are always about death or near death experiences, in the third person way, and this one reminds me the video on people having done a Tabernanthe iboga experience, or a so called Near Death Experience (an expression commonly interpreted as a

Re: the curse of materialism

2013-01-20 Thread Craig Weinberg
On Friday, January 18, 2013 1:15:09 PM UTC-5, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 17 Jan 2013, at 18:50, Craig Weinberg wrote: On Wednesday, January 16, 2013 7:06:03 PM UTC-5, Stephen Paul King wrote: On 1/16/2013 5:32 PM, Alberto G. Corona wrote: That is the most clear demosnstration that what

Re: Two Schrodinger cats

2013-01-20 Thread Richard Ruquist
On Sun, Jan 20, 2013 at 12:53 PM, Bruno Marchal marc...@ulb.ac.be wrote: On 19 Jan 2013, at 13:42, Telmo Menezes wrote: On Thu, Jan 17, 2013 at 5:47 PM, Bruno Marchal marc...@ulb.ac.be wrote: On 17 Jan 2013, at 16:01, Telmo Menezes wrote: On Thu, Jan 17, 2013 at 3:01 PM, Bruno

Re: HOW YOU CAN BECOME A LIBERAL THEOLOGIAN IN JUST 4 STEPS.

2013-01-20 Thread Craig Weinberg
On Saturday, January 19, 2013 6:50:19 PM UTC-5, stathisp wrote: On Fri, Jan 18, 2013 at 8:23 AM, Craig Weinberg whats...@gmail.comjavascript: wrote: There are those who believe that the very atoms are necessary in order to preserve a consciousness: making an arbitrarily close copy

Re: Re: Re: A God-limited God - My Theodicy

2013-01-20 Thread Roger Clough
Hi Craig Weinberg Then you believe that God exists. That's a good start. - Receiving the following content - From: Craig Weinberg Receiver: everything-list Time: 2013-01-19, 09:55:18 Subject: Re: Re: A God-limited God - My Theodicy On Saturday, January 19, 2013 6:22:38 AM

Re: Re: Re: A God-limited God - My Theodicy

2013-01-20 Thread Craig Weinberg
On Sunday, January 20, 2013 2:08:09 PM UTC-5, rclough wrote: Hi Craig Weinberg Then you believe that God exists. That's a good start. Can't I point out the absurdity of a belief without being accused of having it? - Receiving the following content - *From:*

Re: Re: Holy Smokes ! Automobile exhausts are causing polar icecapstoalso melt on Mars, Jupiter and Pluto

2013-01-20 Thread Roger Clough
Hi meekerdb Lead me to the proof. - Receiving the following content - From: meekerdb Receiver: everything-list Time: 2013-01-19, 15:22:30 Subject: Re: Holy Smokes ! Automobile exhausts are causing polar icecapstoalso melt on Mars, Jupiter and Pluto On 1/19/2013 3:52 AM, Roger

Re: Escaping from the world of 3p Flatland

2013-01-20 Thread meekerdb
On 1/20/2013 3:41 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: I agree. It is always better to stick to the most common sense of the words. That's funny coming from a guy who used God to designate abstract computations. Brent -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups

Re: Re: Does energy obey the laws of materialism ?

2013-01-20 Thread Roger Clough
Hi Telmo Menezes Good point. The answer is the same source that the universe came from. - Receiving the following content - From: Telmo Menezes Receiver: everything-list Time: 2013-01-20, 10:37:56 Subject: Re: Does energy obey the laws of materialism ? Hi Roger, I would say the

Re: Re: Escaping from the world of 3p Flatland

2013-01-20 Thread Roger Clough
Hi meekerdb All computations are abstract. - Receiving the following content - From: meekerdb Receiver: everything-list Time: 2013-01-20, 14:44:33 Subject: Re: Escaping from the world of 3p Flatland On 1/20/2013 3:41 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: I agree. It is always better to stick

Re: A God-limited God - My Theodicy

2013-01-20 Thread meekerdb
On 1/20/2013 3:57 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: Even God cannot make 17 into a prime. And He cannot make it not prime either. So I guess he doesn't exist. Brent -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything List group. To post to this group, send email

Re: Re: Re: Re: A God-limited God - My Theodicy

2013-01-20 Thread Craig Weinberg
On Sunday, January 20, 2013 2:43:42 PM UTC-5, rclough wrote: Hi Craig Weinberg So you belong to the liberal thought police then. Haha of course. How could it be possible for anyone to see the contradiction of the concept of God without 'belonging to the liberal thought police'? Not

Robot reading vs human reading

2013-01-20 Thread Roger Clough
Hi Bruno Marchal The triads are based on epistemology. Without Secondness everything is impersonal. Without Secondness you cannot understand how the final expression was obtained (what it means to YOU, and how it was affected by the interprent. It's just wham bam ! that's a cat I see ! Van

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: A God-limited God - My Theodicy

2013-01-20 Thread Roger Clough
Hi Craig Weinberg They don't make sense to you but they do make make sense to me. Could it be that you are a low information, low understanding person ? - Receiving the following content - From: Craig Weinberg Receiver: everything-list Time: 2013-01-20, 15:00:34 Subject: Re: Re:

Re: The unpredictability of solar energy

2013-01-20 Thread meekerdb
On 1/20/2013 5:13 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 18 Jan 2013, at 23:37, meekerdb wrote: On 1/18/2013 10:23 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 17 Jan 2013, at 19:14, Stephen P. King wrote: On 1/17/2013 9:14 AM, Bruno Marchal wrote: Coming back to hemp should be the good idea. Oil and wood have

Re: Does energy obey the laws of materialism ?

2013-01-20 Thread meekerdb
Energy is conserved because we want our theories to be time translation invariant (c.f. Noether's theorem). Brent On 1/20/2013 7:37 AM, Telmo Menezes wrote: Hi Roger, I would say the opposite - energy not being conserved would pose a harder challenge to materialism, because then you'd have

Re: Holy Smokes ! Automobile exhausts are causing polar icecapstoalso melt on Mars, Jupiter and Pluto

2013-01-20 Thread meekerdb
You can lead a man to knowledge, but you can't make him think. Brent On 1/20/2013 11:36 AM, Roger Clough wrote: Hi meekerdb Lead me to the proof. - Receiving the following content - *From:* meekerdb mailto:meeke...@verizon.net *Receiver:* everything-list

Re: Re: Re: Re: Re: A God-limited God - My Theodicy

2013-01-20 Thread Craig Weinberg
On Sunday, January 20, 2013 3:06:07 PM UTC-5, rclough wrote: Hi Craig Weinberg They don't make sense to you but they do make make sense to me. Could it be that you are a low information, low understanding person ? You can say that it makes sense to you, but I think that you just

Re: Re: Is there an aether ?

2013-01-20 Thread Craig Weinberg
On Sunday, January 20, 2013 2:40:53 PM UTC-5, rclough wrote: Hi Craig Weinberg So the world did not exist before man ? The world existed before man, but not before experience. Man does not define all experience in the universe. - Receiving the following content -

Science is a religion by itself.

2013-01-20 Thread socra...@bezeqint.net
I believe . . . . .you believe your opinion . . . my opinion . ... . . your meaning . . . my meaning . .. . . . The opinion of opinion . . . . . The meaning of meaning . . . . . And so is endless. ===. I Believe in Order to Understand. St. Augustine, the Bishop of Hippo, said, “I believe in

Re: Math- Computation- Mind - Geometry - Space - Matter

2013-01-20 Thread Russell Standish
On Sun, Jan 20, 2013 at 01:53:49PM +0100, Bruno Marchal wrote: On 19 Jan 2013, at 00:15, Stephen P. King wrote: You seem to not understand a simple idea that is axiomatic for me. I am trying to understand why this is. Do you understand the thesis of Russell Standish's book and the

Re: Science is a religion by itself.

2013-01-20 Thread meekerdb
Men become civilized, not in proportion to their willingness to believe, but in proportion to their readiness to doubt. The more stupid the man the heavier his load of faith. --- H. L. Mencken On 1/20/2013 1:31 PM, socra...@bezeqint.net wrote: I believe . . . . .you believe your opinion

Re: Third person NDE

2013-01-20 Thread Spudboy100
This may be totally irrelavent, but NDE studlier, Raymond Moody, has a book published about 3 years ago, called Glimpses of Eternity, in which NDE's and passings-on are a shared experience, including a life review, seen by family and friends.Supposedly, such family and friends, are not under

Re: Does energy obey the laws of materialism ?

2013-01-20 Thread Spudboy100
Is it fair, to call energy, matter in motion? Is it matter with momentum? Since Photons are massless and so are neutrinos, are they just types of energy, or primal energy, or proto-matter (wanna-be?). -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups Everything

Re: A God-limited God - My Theodicy

2013-01-20 Thread Spudboy100
Does anyone have an issue with thinking about God as an alien intelligence, which created the Hibble Volume (aka Universe)? Michael Shermer sort of put this concept together, perhaps in the hope of getting people to think, or possibly, to tick-off Christian Fundamentalist? I have no problem

Re: A God-limited God - My Theodicy

2013-01-20 Thread Craig Weinberg
What would an alien intelligence help explain the origin of the universe? Wouldn't you just have to explain the origin of this alien intelligence? On Sunday, January 20, 2013 9:11:13 PM UTC-5, spudb...@aol.com wrote: Does anyone have an issue with thinking about God as an alien