It's with *much* reluctance that I've rejoined this mailing list. But
since Dr. Richard Stallman has seemingly forgot events of the past 3
months, I figure I'll share a recap of our discussion for all of our
benefit.
> I raised this issue as soon as I became aware of the campaign, which
> was when
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> > I raised this issue as soon as I became aware of the campaign, which
> > was
>
>
> The issue at hand is what to say to the public.
>
Which is a policy issue... GNOME are responsible for establishing its
policies and GNOME has not seen fit to establish any concrete policy on
this (for whatever reason). Not establishing concrete policy and guidance
to cover these sorts of re
On 01/03/2015 07:48 AM, Richard Stallman wrote:
> That's because the several crowdfunding sites I had investigated all
> had the same unethical practice of requiring donors to run nonfree
> software. There was not one that we could use without contradicting
> the principles of the free software mo
On Mon, Jan 5, 2015 at 12:35 PM, Christian Hergert
wrote:
The problem is that it takes *months* to prepare a proper crowdfunding
campaign. So if you didn't suggest crowdsupply to me back at the
hackfest, it was simply *too late* to be reasonably actionable
(despite
that I might agree it would
Hi all,
Whist this is a bit entertaining, I think we can all see where it is
headed... On balance, there really is only one practical reason to bring up
the past and that is for the sake of being able to reliably anticipate the
future. So, I have to urge people again to try to move the discussion
On 01/05/2015 03:44 PM, Magdalen Berns wrote:
> To elaborate on the point about fundraisers a little further: Also
> though I have to wonder whether future fundraisers could maybe be
> handled in the same way as the groupon fundraiser was managed.
> http://www.gnome.org/groupon/ since that did not
Hi,
On Mon, Jan 5, 2015 at 7:05 PM, Christian Hergert
wrote:
> On 01/05/2015 03:44 PM, Magdalen Berns wrote:
> > To elaborate on the point about fundraisers a little further: Also
> > though I have to wonder whether future fundraisers could maybe be
> > handled in the same way as the groupon fund
>
> If crowdfunding was a service that the GNOME foundation offered it's
> members, I would be in favor of that. However, as it stands today, I
> believe this would cause undue burden on the board.
>
It's hard to say without thrashing it out but I definitely think it's worth
thrashing it out, othe
On Tue, Jan 6, 2015 at 1:12 AM, meg ford wrote:
> Hi,
> On Mon, Jan 5, 2015 at 7:05 PM, Christian Hergert
> wrote:
>
>> On 01/05/2015 03:44 PM, Magdalen Berns wrote:
>> > To elaborate on the point about fundraisers a little further: Also
>> > though I have to wonder whether future fundraisers co
Hi Magdalen,
On Mon, Jan 5, 2015 at 8:40 PM, Magdalen Berns
wrote:
> I think you have agreed with me on the wiki and the blog but seem to not
> realise that, for some strange reason. To clarify, I agreed that
> individuals should be able to make their own choices for how they blog and
> pointed
I told myself I would not get involved in this subject, but I have to
say a couple of things.
First, there's a lot of talk (here and the earlier thread) that loosely
equivocates fundraising with crowdfunding. They're not the same. To
tell a project that it should simply accept donations rath
> I understood you to be talking about labelling links as non-free even on
> wiki pages and Planet GNOME. Were you only talking about links to
> fundraising pages?
>
In physics, problem solving is seen as a case of starting with the most
simple model of a given system, stating assumptions to accou
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[[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]]
> The problem is that it takes *months* to prepare a proper crowdfunding
> campai
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> I hadn't realized others had used indiegogo to crowdfund for your travel
> thou
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> Does crowdsupply accept software projects at all?
I will ask them.
--
Dr Richa
>
> First, there's a lot of talk (here and the earlier thread) that loosely
> equivocates fundraising with crowdfunding. They're not the same. To tell
> a project that it should simply accept donations rather than use a
> crowdfunding platform is a false equivocation. Crowdfunding's mixture of
>
On Tue, Jan 06, 2015 at 06:41:23PM +, Magdalen Berns wrote:
> The point about that really is that the recent campaign seems to have
> demonstrated that in principle, GNOME already has the infrastructure which
> could allow them to accept money for any given crowdfunding campaign on
> behalf of
...it seems totally reasonable that people might loosely refer to
crowdfunding as fundraising in this sort of context. If you were
confused, then you only needed to ask for specifics. :D
I wasn't confused, and I wasn't speaking about the recent Groupon
fundraiser. There's been a few calls h
>
> > The point about that really is that the recent campaign seems to have
> > demonstrated that in principle, GNOME already has the infrastructure
> which
> > could allow them to accept money for any given crowdfunding campaign on
> > behalf of community driven projects (and any general fundraisi
On 01/06/2015 10:24 AM, Richard Stallman wrote:
> I understand that you can't move the campaign now. But can you post a
> bitcoin address, and invite people to send money that way if they
> don't want to run nonfree JS code?
I've added a section to the campaign borrowed from crowdsupply.
Alter
>
> I wasn't confused, and I wasn't speaking about the recent Groupon
> fundraiser. There's been a few calls here for free software alternatives
> to Indiegogo as well as GNOME becoming involved with those alternatives.
> Many of the proposed alternatives were not crowdfunding and shouldn't be
> t
>
> > I understand that you can't move the campaign now. But can you post a
> > bitcoin address, and invite people to send money that way if they
> > don't want to run nonfree JS code?
>
> I've added a section to the campaign borrowed from crowdsupply.
>
It's great this is resolved.
> As for bi
On 01/06/2015 02:54 PM, Magdalen Berns wrote:
> The stigma related to bitcoin is just the media doing their thing to try
> and discredit it, in my humble view. A lot of people do not buy into that
> stuff. With that said, it is reasonable for anyone to be uncomfortable with
> something and not be m
> Now, to the subject of whether GNOME should or should not link to non-free
> websites
The expression "nonfree website" is one we do not use, because it is
not clear what that would mean. Web sites raise various kinds of
ethical issues.
The issue here is very specific: a web site requires v
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[[[ foreign or domestic, requires you to follow Snowden's example. ]]]
> Second, linking to a web site is not an automatic endorsement of its
> script
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> 1. In what situations can any published link on GNOME's servers be
> representa
On Tue, Jan 06, 2015 at 10:28:02PM +, Magdalen Berns wrote:
> >
> > > The point about that really is that the recent campaign seems to have
> > > demonstrated that in principle, GNOME already has the infrastructure
> > which
> > > could allow them to accept money for any given crowdfunding camp
> > The same set up as what?
>
> Something similar to IndieGoGo.
>
It does not need to be similar to indieGoGo. Let's review:
GNOME is a charity. IndiGoGo is a business. They do not have the same tax
set up, no. As far as I am aware, they do not need to have the same tax set
up either. GNOME does
On Wed, Jan 07, 2015 at 02:47:00PM +, Magdalen Berns wrote:
> So the GNOME infrastructure can't figure that one out but Christian, an
> already overburdened volunteer who is trying to scape funds for his
> project, somehow can do it all by himself? That makes absolutely no sense.
>From your r
On Wed, Jan 7, 2015 at 4:26 AM, Richard Stallman wrote:
> > Now, to the subject of whether GNOME should or should not link to
> non-free
> > websites
>
> The expression "nonfree website" is one we do not use, because it is
> not clear what that would mean. Web sites raise various kinds of
>
The issue at hand is not a matter of endorsement. At least, not in the
> usual sense of the word.
>
I am not sure I agree.
It seems like what we are talking about here is whether or not we should be
using certain services and advertising that we use those services on GNOME
websites.
If a link s
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> I've added a section to the campaign borrowed from crowdsupply.
> Alternativ
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> I think that a banner ad for Builder endorses Builder. (That's fine.)
> > It d
>
> Because the issue is so specific, it is ethically simple -- it's wrong
> to recommend the operation if the operation requires running nonfree
> software (including JS code).
>
That makes sense. It is a lot easier than dealing with sites that run
non-free software but who don't require it so I
> On Jan 6, 2015, at 2:54 PM, Magdalen Berns wrote:
>
> The stigma related to bitcoin is just the media doing their thing to try and
> discredit it, in my humble view. A lot of people do not buy into that stuff.
> With that said, it is reasonable for anyone to be uncomfortable with
> something
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