On Sat, 28 Aug 1999, Sergey Babkin wrote:
Mark Ovens wrote:
On Fri, Aug 27, 1999 at 08:45:31PM -0400, Sergey Babkin wrote:
A funny thing is that Microsoft is porting essentially a
32-bit version of Windows to Merced. All the programs for
Windows that want to use 64-bit support
On Sun, 29 Aug 1999, Wes Peters wrote:
Trying to model the IA64 would have been a Manhattan Project sized task.
But they've had PLENTY of time. HP had the 64-bit architecture defined
and a simulator underway in 1994, when Intel joined the project. The
Merced, which is a specific chip
"Jay West" [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote:
The merced executes PA-RISC instructions natively. It also executes x86
instructions natively. If the chip you get doesn't do one or the other, it's
because that section has been lobotomized for marketing/contract reasons due
to where you get the chip
Jay West jlw...@tseinc.com wrote:
The merced executes PA-RISC instructions natively. It also executes x86
instructions natively. If the chip you get doesn't do one or the other, it's
because that section has been lobotomized for marketing/contract reasons due
to where you get the chip from.
Wilko Bulte wrote:
As Wes Peters wrote ...
If you think Microsoft doesn't have 64-bit NT in development for Merced,
you're being awfully gullible. Compaq was insisting that Alpha remained
the development platform for NT64 while dropping support for NT32 on the
Alpha last week, while
Chuck Robey wrote:
When I was in the computer architecture classes, I did a lot of
modeling of various kinds of things that could be done to speed up a
processor (the least of which is cache memory, but it stands as a good
for instance thing here). One thing that impressed me, when doing
On Sun, 29 Aug 1999, Wes Peters wrote:
Uh, no, HP has already admitted that when Merced ships it will be slower
than current-generation PA-RISC CPUs. Which means it will also be slower
than Alpha, PowerPC, and UltraSPARC processors you can buy now.
Which is just going to make *everyone*
On Fri, 27 Aug 1999, Thomas David Rivers wrote:
First - let me point out that FreeBSD already runs on the Alpha,
so there's some 64-bit experience.
Very good point, which ought to be brought out more than once, it's good
for the rep.
And - let me add - Intel has been down this path
The trade rags here insist it has already happened: M$ stopped 64 bit Alpha
NT. Beats me if it is true or not.
Here's the confusing part: they say M$ stopped making 64 bit Alpha
NT, but some say they are actually developing Win2000 64 bit for Alpha's.
Since 2000 is NT based, you'd think
Mark Ovens wrote:
On Fri, Aug 27, 1999 at 08:45:31PM -0400, Sergey Babkin wrote:
A funny thing is that Microsoft is porting essentially a
32-bit version of Windows to Merced. All the programs for
Windows that want to use 64-bit support will have to be
modified because the MS compiler
On Fri, 27 Aug 1999, Thomas David Rivers wrote:
First - let me point out that FreeBSD already runs on the Alpha,
so there's some 64-bit experience.
Very good point, which ought to be brought out more than once, it's good
for the rep.
And - let me add - Intel has been down this path
As Kenny Drobnack wrote ...
Lately i have seen a lot of speculation as to what will happen when the
Intel Merced comes out. Will people wait 12-18 months for a 64 bit
Windows (that's the amount of time I keep hearing it will take them to get
Win2000 running on it) or will they just buy it
Kenny Drobnack [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:
Lately i have seen a lot of speculation as to what will happen when the
Intel Merced comes out. Will people wait 12-18 months for a 64 bit
Windows (that's the amount of time I keep hearing it will take them to get
Win2000 running on it) or will they
Hi,
The IA64 (merced) is a kind of VLIW (Very Large Instruction Word)
processor. It is basically a complete new kind of systems architecture
with a i686 (and of course a i586, ..., 4004) slapped on the side. The
original processor design was done by HP. See:
The IA-64 Architecture at
But - for "Intel to hit it big" - they need Merced to become
the next consumer architecture. Since they are continuing with
plans for the IA32 line (what x86 got renamed to with the
advent of IA64, nee' merced) they are hedging their bets.
I don't believe they are convinced
On Fri, 27 Aug 1999, Mitch Collinsworth wrote:
?? I thought we had already established that neither Linux or NT runs
on Merced, only HP-UX so far.
"Merced silicon happens: Linux runs, NT doesn't"
http://www.theregister.co.uk/990826-03.html
--
Ben
UNIX Systems Engineer, Skunk Group
?? I thought we had already established that neither Linux or NT runs
on Merced, only HP-UX so far.
"Merced silicon happens: Linux runs, NT doesn't"
http://www.theregister.co.uk/990826-03.html
I sit corrected. Thanks!
-Mitch
To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
with
Actually, I was reading in a newsgroup, the VMS newsgroup I think it was,
that the PA-RISC chip is on the Merced chip. Basically, Intel will sell
Merced's with the chip disabled (kind of like the math co-processor on the
486 SX's) and HP will sell it with the PA-RISC chip enabled so it can run
Well, hobbyists and savvy bang-for-the-buck may take 32 over 64 if the
bang isn't there, but nowadays that is far from the entire market of
purchasers. You're overlooking the status symbol buyers who just have to
have the latest/greatest and/or something better than the guy next door.
I
Date: Fri, 27 Aug 1999 09:20:16 -0400 (EDT)
From: Kenny Drobnack [EMAIL PROTECTED]
And - let me add - Intel has been down this path before
(the i860) - and didn't see the success it wanted (although
the i860 is popping up in some interesting places now...)
Um, which chip was this?
On Fri, 27 Aug 1999, David Wolfskill wrote:
Date: Fri, 27 Aug 1999 09:20:16 -0400 (EDT)
From: Kenny Drobnack [EMAIL PROTECTED]
And - let me add - Intel has been down this path before
(the i860) - and didn't see the success it wanted (although
the i860 is popping up in some
On Thu, 26 Aug 1999, Kenny Drobnack wrote:
Lately i have seen a lot of speculation as to what will happen when the
Intel Merced comes out. Will people wait 12-18 months for a 64 bit
Windows (that's the amount of time I keep hearing it will take them to get
Win2000 running on it) or will
In article
[EMAIL PROTECTED] you
write:
Actually, I was reading in a newsgroup, the VMS newsgroup I think it was,
that the PA-RISC chip is on the Merced chip. Basically, Intel will sell
Merced's with the chip disabled (kind of like the math co-processor on the
486 SX's) and HP will sell it
In reply:
In article
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
you write:
Actually, I was reading in a newsgroup, the VMS newsgroup I think it was,
that the PA-RISC chip is on the Merced chip. Basically, Intel will sell
Merced's with the chip disabled (kind of like the math co-processor on the
486 SX's) and HP
In reply:
On Fri, 27 Aug 1999, Sean Eric Fagan wrote:
In article
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
you write:
Look, people, the Merced WILL NOT excuse PA-RISC code directly. It will be
done via emulation/translation, and only a certain particular OS will be
supported (HP-UX 11, I believe they
Mitch Collinsworth wrote:
I recall a conversation not long ago with a sysadmin in the business
school here. I was asking what their typical laptop configuration was
and was told that some members of their faculty were quite particular
about finding out what their colleagues machines
Jay West wrote:
Keep in mind that the merced chip was not really designed or created by
Intel at all.
No, you're confusing terms here. Merced is a particular chip, like
Tillamook is a specific Pentium. HP designed the 64-bit architecture
in the Merced, what will become the "IA64", but
If you think Microsoft doesn't have 64-bit NT in development for Merced,
you're being awfully gullible.
I don't think anyone has suggested it's not being developed. Only that
NT is Not There today. (And that we'd all just love to have a FBSD
port available when systems start shipping! :-)
As Wes Peters wrote ...
Mitch Collinsworth wrote:
?? I thought we had already established that neither Linux or NT runs
on Merced, only HP-UX so far. I would certainly like to see a FBSD
port as I imagine we will be seeing Merced-based systems here quite
early on.
Nope, it was
As Wes Peters wrote ...
Mitch Collinsworth wrote:
?? I thought we had already established that neither Linux or NT runs
on Merced, only HP-UX so far. I would certainly like to see a FBSD
port as I imagine we will be seeing Merced-based systems here quite
early on.
Nope, it
Thomas David Rivers wrote:
Microsoft needs a "business quality" version of Windows,
which it claims is Windows/2000. That version of Windows
could benefit from a 64-bit port, if for marketing only; but
I don't think it would result in the volume of sales Intel
is looking for.
A
Jim Bryant wrote:
I really don't know how people get started with this. HP has _never_ stated
that the chip will handle it; all they have stated is that HPUX applications
will continue to be supported.
I suggest you people go read comp.arch for a while; there's a fair bit of
Zuidam, Hans wrote:
Hi,
The IA64 (merced) is a kind of VLIW (Very Large Instruction Word)
processor. It is basically a complete new kind of systems architecture
with a i686 (and of course a i586, ..., 4004) slapped on the side. The
original processor design was done by HP. See:
On Fri, Aug 27, 1999 at 08:45:31PM -0400, Sergey Babkin wrote:
Thomas David Rivers wrote:
Microsoft needs a "business quality" version of Windows,
which it claims is Windows/2000. That version of Windows
could benefit from a 64-bit port, if for marketing only; but
I don't think
marder-1:/usr/marko{57}% ./a.out
short == 2
int == 4
long == 4
long long == 8
marder-1:/usr/marko{57}%
But on the Alpha:
jkh@beast- ./foo
short == 2
int == 4
long == 8
long long == 8
- Jordan
To Unsubscribe: send mail to [EMAIL PROTECTED]
with "unsubscribe freebsd-hackers" in the body
On Fri, Aug 27, 1999 at 08:45:31PM -0400, Sergey Babkin wrote:
Thomas David Rivers wrote:
Microsoft needs a "business quality" version of Windows,
which it claims is Windows/2000. That version of Windows
could benefit from a 64-bit port, if for marketing only; but
I don't
Mark Ovens wrote:
On Fri, Aug 27, 1999 at 06:29:21PM -0700, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote:
marder-1:/usr/marko{57}% ./a.out
short == 2
int == 4
long == 4
long long == 8
marder-1:/usr/marko{57}%
But on the Alpha:
jkh@beast- ./foo
short == 2
int == 4
long == 8
long
The trade rags here insist it has already happened: M$ stopped 64 bit Alpha
NT. Beats me if it is true or not.
Here's the confusing part: they say M$ stopped making 64 bit Alpha
NT, but some say they are actually developing Win2000 64 bit for Alpha's.
Since 2000 is NT based, you'd
As Kenny Drobnack wrote ...
Lately i have seen a lot of speculation as to what will happen when the
Intel Merced comes out. Will people wait 12-18 months for a 64 bit
Windows (that's the amount of time I keep hearing it will take them to get
Win2000 running on it) or will they just buy it and
Kenny Drobnack kdrob...@mission.mvnc.edu writes:
Lately i have seen a lot of speculation as to what will happen when the
Intel Merced comes out. Will people wait 12-18 months for a 64 bit
Windows (that's the amount of time I keep hearing it will take them to get
Win2000 running on it) or
It was written
Also, recall that Intel
launched Merced development when the idea was bigger/faster
is better
Keep in mind that the merced chip was not really designed or created by
Intel at all.
It was created almost completely by HP (by the same group responsible for
PA-RISC), with Intel
First - let me point out that FreeBSD already runs on the Alpha,
so there's some 64-bit experience.
I knew that already :-)
But - for Intel to hit it big - they need Merced to become
the next consumer architecture. Since they are continuing with
plans for the IA32 line
On Fri, 27 Aug 1999, Jay West wrote:
Keep in mind that the merced chip was not really designed or created by
Intel at all.
It was created almost completely by HP (by the same group responsible for
PA-RISC), with Intel as merely the production facilities. For obvious
marketing, competitive,
On Fri, 27 Aug 1999, Jay West wrote:
Keep in mind that the merced chip was not really designed or created by
Intel at all.
=20
It was created almost completely by HP (by the same group responsible for
PA-RISC), with Intel as merely the production facilities. For obvious
marketing,
Hi,
The IA64 (merced) is a kind of VLIW (Very Large Instruction Word)
processor. It is basically a complete new kind of systems architecture
with a i686 (and of course a i586, ..., 4004) slapped on the side. The
original processor design was done by HP. See:
The IA-64 Architecture at
But - for Intel to hit it big - they need Merced to become
the next consumer architecture. Since they are continuing with
plans for the IA32 line (what x86 got renamed to with the
advent of IA64, nee' merced) they are hedging their bets.
I don't believe they are convinced themselves
On Fri, 27 Aug 1999, Mitch Collinsworth wrote:
?? I thought we had already established that neither Linux or NT runs
on Merced, only HP-UX so far.
Merced silicon happens: Linux runs, NT doesn't
http://www.theregister.co.uk/990826-03.html
--
Ben
UNIX Systems Engineer, Skunk Group
?? I thought we had already established that neither Linux or NT runs
on Merced, only HP-UX so far.
Merced silicon happens: Linux runs, NT doesn't
http://www.theregister.co.uk/990826-03.html
I sit corrected. Thanks!
-Mitch
To Unsubscribe: send mail to majord...@freebsd.org
with
Actually, I was reading in a newsgroup, the VMS newsgroup I think it was,
that the PA-RISC chip is on the Merced chip. Basically, Intel will sell
Merced's with the chip disabled (kind of like the math co-processor on the
486 SX's) and HP will sell it with the PA-RISC chip enabled so it can run
Well, hobbyists and savvy bang-for-the-buck may take 32 over 64 if the
bang isn't there, but nowadays that is far from the entire market of
purchasers. You're overlooking the status symbol buyers who just have to
have the latest/greatest and/or something better than the guy next door.
I
Well, hobbyists and savvy bang-for-the-buck may take 32 over 64 if the
bang isn't there, but nowadays that is far from the entire market of
purchasers. You're overlooking the status symbol buyers who just have to
have the latest/greatest and/or something better than the guy next door.
I
Date: Fri, 27 Aug 1999 09:20:16 -0400 (EDT)
From: Kenny Drobnack kdrob...@mission.mvnc.edu
And - let me add - Intel has been down this path before
(the i860) - and didn't see the success it wanted (although
the i860 is popping up in some interesting places now...)
Um, which chip
On Fri, 27 Aug 1999, David Wolfskill wrote:
Date: Fri, 27 Aug 1999 09:20:16 -0400 (EDT)
From: Kenny Drobnack kdrob...@mission.mvnc.edu
And - let me add - Intel has been down this path before
(the i860) - and didn't see the success it wanted (although
the i860 is popping up in some
On Thu, 26 Aug 1999, Kenny Drobnack wrote:
Lately i have seen a lot of speculation as to what will happen when the
Intel Merced comes out. Will people wait 12-18 months for a 64 bit
Windows (that's the amount of time I keep hearing it will take them to get
Win2000 running on it) or will they
In article
pine.gso.3.96.990827103350.1456c-10.kithrup.freebsd.hack...@mission.mvnc.edu
you write:
Actually, I was reading in a newsgroup, the VMS newsgroup I think it was,
that the PA-RISC chip is on the Merced chip. Basically, Intel will sell
Merced's with the chip disabled (kind of like
In reply:
In article
pine.gso.3.96.990827103350.1456c-10.kithrup.freebsd.hack...@mission.mvnc.edu
you write:
Actually, I was reading in a newsgroup, the VMS newsgroup I think it was,
that the PA-RISC chip is on the Merced chip. Basically, Intel will sell
Merced's with the chip
On Fri, 27 Aug 1999, Sean Eric Fagan wrote:
In article
pine.gso.3.96.990827103350.1456c-10.kithrup.freebsd.hack...@mission.mvnc.edu
you write:
Look, people, the Merced WILL NOT excuse PA-RISC code directly. It will be
done via emulation/translation, and only a certain particular OS
In reply:
On Fri, 27 Aug 1999, Sean Eric Fagan wrote:
In article
pine.gso.3.96.990827103350.1456c-10.kithrup.freebsd.hack...@mission.mvnc.edu
you write:
Look, people, the Merced WILL NOT excuse PA-RISC code directly. It will be
done via emulation/translation, and only a certain
Mitch Collinsworth wrote:
?? I thought we had already established that neither Linux or NT runs
on Merced, only HP-UX so far. I would certainly like to see a FBSD
port as I imagine we will be seeing Merced-based systems here quite
early on.
Nope, it was reported last week a group at Intel
Mitch Collinsworth wrote:
I recall a conversation not long ago with a sysadmin in the business
school here. I was asking what their typical laptop configuration was
and was told that some members of their faculty were quite particular
about finding out what their colleagues machines had
Jay West wrote:
Keep in mind that the merced chip was not really designed or created by
Intel at all.
No, you're confusing terms here. Merced is a particular chip, like
Tillamook is a specific Pentium. HP designed the 64-bit architecture
in the Merced, what will become the IA64, but Intel
If you think Microsoft doesn't have 64-bit NT in development for Merced,
you're being awfully gullible.
I don't think anyone has suggested it's not being developed. Only that
NT is Not There today. (And that we'd all just love to have a FBSD
port available when systems start shipping! :-)
I had written.
As a matter of fact, the standard version of merced includes the PA-RISC
engine along with an x86 instruction decoder.
To which you replied...
Uh, no.
The Merced does not do PA-RISC decoding in hardware. Period.
Wrong. I wish I could send you the Internal design papers
As Wes Peters wrote ...
Mitch Collinsworth wrote:
?? I thought we had already established that neither Linux or NT runs
on Merced, only HP-UX so far. I would certainly like to see a FBSD
port as I imagine we will be seeing Merced-based systems here quite
early on.
Nope, it was
As Wes Peters wrote ...
Mitch Collinsworth wrote:
?? I thought we had already established that neither Linux or NT runs
on Merced, only HP-UX so far. I would certainly like to see a FBSD
port as I imagine we will be seeing Merced-based systems here quite
early on.
Nope, it
Thomas David Rivers wrote:
Microsoft needs a business quality version of Windows,
which it claims is Windows/2000. That version of Windows
could benefit from a 64-bit port, if for marketing only; but
I don't think it would result in the volume of sales Intel
is looking for.
A funny
Jim Bryant wrote:
I really don't know how people get started with this. HP has _never_ stated
that the chip will handle it; all they have stated is that HPUX applications
will continue to be supported.
I suggest you people go read comp.arch for a while; there's a fair bit of
Zuidam, Hans wrote:
Hi,
The IA64 (merced) is a kind of VLIW (Very Large Instruction Word)
processor. It is basically a complete new kind of systems architecture
with a i686 (and of course a i586, ..., 4004) slapped on the side. The
original processor design was done by HP. See:
On Fri, Aug 27, 1999 at 08:45:31PM -0400, Sergey Babkin wrote:
Thomas David Rivers wrote:
Microsoft needs a business quality version of Windows,
which it claims is Windows/2000. That version of Windows
could benefit from a 64-bit port, if for marketing only; but
I don't think it
marder-1:/usr/marko{57}% ./a.out
short == 2
int == 4
long == 4
long long == 8
marder-1:/usr/marko{57}%
But on the Alpha:
j...@beast- ./foo
short == 2
int == 4
long == 8
long long == 8
- Jordan
To Unsubscribe: send mail to majord...@freebsd.org
with unsubscribe freebsd-hackers in the
On Fri, Aug 27, 1999 at 06:29:21PM -0700, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote:
marder-1:/usr/marko{57}% ./a.out
short == 2
int == 4
long == 4
long long == 8
marder-1:/usr/marko{57}%
But on the Alpha:
j...@beast- ./foo
short == 2
int == 4
long == 8
long long == 8
Which is fair enough,
On Fri, Aug 27, 1999 at 08:45:31PM -0400, Sergey Babkin wrote:
Thomas David Rivers wrote:
Microsoft needs a business quality version of Windows,
which it claims is Windows/2000. That version of Windows
could benefit from a 64-bit port, if for marketing only; but
I don't
Mark Ovens wrote:
On Fri, Aug 27, 1999 at 06:29:21PM -0700, Jordan K. Hubbard wrote:
marder-1:/usr/marko{57}% ./a.out
short == 2
int == 4
long == 4
long long == 8
marder-1:/usr/marko{57}%
But on the Alpha:
j...@beast- ./foo
short == 2
int == 4
long == 8
long
Lately i have seen a lot of speculation as to what will happen when the
Intel Merced comes out. Will people wait 12-18 months for a 64 bit
Windows (that's the amount of time I keep hearing it will take them to get
Win2000 running on it) or will they just buy it and pop Linux onto it
right away?
Lately i have seen a lot of speculation as to what will happen when the
Intel Merced comes out. Will people wait 12-18 months for a 64 bit
Windows (that's the amount of time I keep hearing it will take them to get
Win2000 running on it) or will they just buy it and pop Linux onto it
right away?
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