On Thu, 12 Jan 2006 18:15, Jo Rhett wrote:
> Before we plan the invasion of Iraq, how about an agreement on what we're
> trying to accomplish? Like I said, this topic has always been killed
> because "non-newbies can run make buildworld". So if it's going to get
> shot down quickly then why bothe
On Thu, 12 Jan 2006 18:07, Jo Rhett wrote:
> On Fri, Jan 06, 2006 at 10:20:11PM +1030, Daniel O'Connor wrote:
> > I imagine there are a few committers interested, but I'd say you need to
> > ask the right way first..
>
> As in...?
I don't know any personally, but then again I only know about 3 com
Hej there,
Jo Rhett wrote:
> On Fri, Jan 06, 2006 at 01:27:18PM +0100, Marian Hettwer wrote:
>
>>I'm actually wondering how yahoo for instance handles this situation. To
>>my knowledge, they have several thousand of FreeBSD based servers.
>>Either they are all the same in regards to configuration
On Wed, 2006-Jan-11 23:22:53 -0800, Jo Rhett wrote:
>I am deliberately trolling: not to cause grief, but to see if there are any
>bites on the topic. So far it's just people insulting my intelligence and
>cut&pasting web pages to me.
Going out of your way to antagonize FreeBSD developers is not t
On Fri, Jan 06, 2006 at 01:27:18PM +0100, Marian Hettwer wrote:
> I'm actually wondering how yahoo for instance handles this situation. To
> my knowledge, they have several thousand of FreeBSD based servers.
> Either they are all the same in regards to configuration and version, or
> they have some
On Fri, Jan 06, 2006 at 10:20:11PM +1030, Daniel O'Connor wrote:
> I imagine there are a few committers interested, but I'd say you need to ask
> the right way first..
As in...?
But again, there are lots of people interested in this topic. Colin for
an obvious one. But if Colin can't convince
On Fri, Jan 06, 2006 at 01:16:36PM -0800, John-Mark Gurney wrote:
> You're trying to target to large of an audience... You need to get _A_
> committer interested in your work, and get HIM to guide you and commit
> your work...
DING! Now we are FINALLY understanding what my goal for this topic w
On Sat, Jan 07, 2006 at 06:44:36AM +1100, Peter Jeremy wrote:
> In general, volunteer projects have a surfeit of ideas and a shortage
> of real implementations. The Project is never going to agree to import
> an idea without some substance.
Always true, and I wouldn't expect less. But we've cov
Jo Rhett wrote this message on Fri, Jan 06, 2006 at 03:03 -0800:
> On Thu, Jan 05, 2006 at 10:41:47AM -0800, John-Mark Gurney wrote:
> > I believe core has a policy of never supporting vaporware... There is
> > always the chicken and egg problem with arguments like this... I'll
> > code this if y
On Fri, 2006-Jan-06 03:03:18 -0800, Jo Rhett wrote:
>> Bottom line: Once code exists, then support can be talked about..
>
>This is bullhockey and you know it. Once the project is done, we'll
>authorize a budget for it? Once the season is over we'll know who should
>be on the starting team?
In
Hi there,
Jo Rhett wrote:
> On Fri, Jan 06, 2006 at 11:20:13AM +1030, Daniel O'Connor wrote:
>>
>>So, uhh, how would your magical binary upgrade system handle custom kernels?
>>Why would it be any different? You still haven't explained how this would
>>work..
>
>
> Versioning of the core packa
On Fri, 6 Jan 2006 21:53, Jo Rhett wrote:
> > you mean? Are you claiming someone from (or claiming to be from core)
> > said "Don't do this, we won't allow it"? If so, can you supply proof?
>
> I used to write a lot of patches to freebsd. I used to submit a lot of bug
> reports. I've found over t
> > I just know that core has either struck it down or been Silent.
On Thu, Jan 05, 2006 at 05:32:26PM -0600, Mark Linimon wrote:
> The latter is an entirely different case from the former, and you've been
> claiming core has done the former. This, and the above, tell me that
> you're not intere
On Fri, Jan 06, 2006 at 11:20:13AM +1030, Daniel O'Connor wrote:
> For NFS mount, read: any network file system. You can also use, say IPSEC to
> protect the NFS packets (although I'm not claiming it's a trivial thing to
> set up..)
IPsec is trivial compared to the amount of code and localized
On Thu, Jan 05, 2006 at 10:41:47AM -0800, John-Mark Gurney wrote:
> I believe core has a policy of never supporting vaporware... There is
> always the chicken and egg problem with arguments like this... I'll
> code this if you agree to support it and maintain it/I will agree to
> support it once
ml> (And, as well, that you do not even understand the role the core plays
ml> in the project. Hint: it is not primarily technical in nature.)
For those curious to know how the project works, the following online
resources may help:
A project model for the FreeBSD Project
http://www.freebsd.
[cross post to -current removed]
On Thu, 5 Jan 2006 19:54, Jo Rhett wrote:
> On Fri, Dec 23, 2005 at 11:36:11AM +1030, Daniel O'Connor wrote:
> > On each 'client' PC..
> > NFS mount /usr/src and /usr/obj
> > installkernel
> > reboot
> > installworld
>
> Works fine on home computers behind firewall
> Jo Rhett wrote this message on Thu, Jan 05, 2006 at 01:24 -0800:
> Sorry. As said before, the topic is always struck down and nobody from
> core has ever stood up to say "we'll support this". I don't know whose on
> core this week, nor will I at any given time.
This information is publicly ava
Jo Rhett wrote this message on Thu, Jan 05, 2006 at 01:24 -0800:
> > You are putting words in the mouth of core@ -
>
> Sorry. As said before, the topic is always struck down and nobody from
> core has ever stood up to say "we'll support this". I don't know whose on
> core this week, nor will I
> Patrick M. Hausen, and lo! it spake thus:
> > Any suggestions for an alternative to NFS if your 'client' servers
> > are located "all over the world" and you want to installworld across
> > the Internet? I was planning to use NFS/TCP secured by IPSec
> > transport mode, but anything less complica
On Fri, Dec 23, 2005 at 11:36:11AM +1030, Daniel O'Connor wrote:
> On each 'client' PC..
> NFS mount /usr/src and /usr/obj
> installkernel
> reboot
> installworld
Works fine on home computers behind firewalls.
Useless on public servers that don't run RPC.
Useless on flash-based servers where min
> On Thu, Dec 22, 2005 at 01:09:04PM -0800 I heard the voice of
> Jo Rhett, and lo! it spake thus:
> >
> > No, you're missing the point. More core OS upgrades means less
> > incremental patches (which are easier to apply than a full update).
On Thu, Dec 22, 2005 at 09:08:13PM -0600, Matthew D.
On Thu, Dec 22, 2005 at 09:08:13PM -0600, Matthew D. Fuller wrote:
> Having done full OS upgrades a number of times, I can't remember the
> last time it took more than 5 or 10 minutes (during most of which the
When the servers are in 17 countries around the world, with no CD-ROM
access. You keep
On Sun, 25 Dec 2005 02:02, Brian Candler wrote:
> Linux has an extremely neat solution for this (sshfs) but I don't know of
> anything comparable in the BSD world. sshfs uses 'Fuse', a plug-in
> architecture which allows filesystems to run in userland. I believe it
> makes an sftp connection to the
On Fri, Dec 23, 2005 at 09:51:15AM +0100, Patrick M. Hausen wrote:
> Any suggestions for an alternative to NFS if your 'client' servers
> are located "all over the world" and you want to installworld across
> the Internet? I was planning to use NFS/TCP secured by IPSec transport
> mode, but anythin
On Fri, 23 Dec 2005 21:10:19 +0530
Joseph Koshy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> www.infrastructures.org
> www.isconf.org
and perhaps also http://www.cfengine.org/
and probably others.
IMHO, FreeBSD is a good os, with good options on configuration and
management.
It is not a systems management tool
phk> Bring to system administration what source code
phk> version control brought to programming.
www.infrastructures.org
www.isconf.org
--
FreeBSD Volunteer, http://people.freebsd.org/~jkoshy
___
freebsd-stable@freebsd.org mailing list
http://lis
I have consistently ignored all emails in this thread because the
use of the word "demand" in the Subject.
Whenever people use words like "demand" or "somebody should" in
FreeBSD contexts, it indicates cluelessness to me.
Cluelessness about how the project works and cluenessness about
how thing
Brian Candler wrote:
> I think the real concern here is: for how long after RELEASE_X_Y are binary
> patches for it made available?
I build FreeBSD Update patches for all the branches supported by the
FreeBSD Security Team.
To answer a couple of other questions:
FreeBSD Update is something which
On Fri, 23 Dec 2005 19:26, Matthew D. Fuller wrote:
> > the Internet? I was planning to use NFS/TCP secured by IPSec
> > transport mode, but anything less complicated would be greatly
> > appreciated ;-)
>
> This is one of the situations where r{dist,sync}'ing out the binaries
> makes more sense th
On Thu, Dec 22, 2005 at 09:08:13PM -0600, Matthew D. Fuller wrote:
> > No, you're missing the point. More core OS upgrades means less
> > incremental patches (which are easier to apply than a full update).
>
> Right. I don't understand how B follows A here.
>
> These patches come from where? S
On Fri, Dec 23, 2005 at 09:51:15AM +0100 I heard the voice of
Patrick M. Hausen, and lo! it spake thus:
>
> Any suggestions for an alternative to NFS if your 'client' servers
> are located "all over the world" and you want to installworld across
> the Internet? I was planning to use NFS/TCP secure
Hi, Folks!
> On your central PC..
> buildworld once.
> builkernel once for each of the different kernels you are using.
>
> On each 'client' PC..
> NFS mount /usr/src and /usr/obj
> installkernel
> reboot
> installworld
Any suggestions for an alternative to NFS if your 'client' servers
are locat
On Thu, Dec 22, 2005 at 01:09:04PM -0800 I heard the voice of
Jo Rhett, and lo! it spake thus:
>
> No, you're missing the point. More core OS upgrades means less
> incremental patches (which are easier to apply than a full update).
Right. I don't understand how B follows A here.
These patches
On Fri, 23 Dec 2005 08:42, Jo Rhett wrote:
> > Using a build server as a testbed and to generate new packages or even a
> > new kernel + world will reduce the amount of work required, but FreeBSD
> > does require some level of administration and maintenance.
>
> We already have that. But again, I'
On Thu, Dec 22, 2005 at 04:45:09PM -0500, Chuck Swiger wrote:
> FreeBSD releases new .ISO images several times a year, but you've got the
> tools to make .ISO images of patch releases yourself, if you want to. I
> don't think that the FreeBSD project can shorten the release cycle below a
> mont
Jo Rhett wrote:
On Sat, Dec 17, 2005 at 06:55:03PM -0500, Chuck Swiger wrote:
YMMV. I burned a 6.0 release from the ISO image, and did a binary upgrade on an
IBM ThinkPad (T.34? maybe), which worked perfectly. All of the 5.x binaries,
including X11, KDE, printing, Mozilla, etc worked just fine
> On Sat, Dec 17, 2005 at 02:00:21PM -0800 I heard the voice of
> Joe Rhett, and lo! it spake thus:
> >
> > Increasing the number of deployed systems out of date [...]
On Sat, Dec 17, 2005 at 08:37:25PM -0600, Matthew D. Fuller wrote:
> This doesn't make any sense. If you install a 6.0 system,
> On Sun, Dec 18, 2005 at 09:55:33AM +, Matthew Seaman wrote:
> > Doesn't creating a binary updates system that's going to be practical to use
> > require implementation of that old and exceedingly bikesheddable subject:
> > packaging
> > up the base system?
On Sun, Dec 18, 2005 at 12:13:09PM
On Sun, Dec 18, 2005 at 09:55:33AM +, Matthew Seaman wrote:
> Doesn't creating a binary updates system that's going to be practical to use
> require implementation of that old and exceedingly bikesheddable subject:
> packaging up the base system?
EXACTLY. That's why we need core team suppo
> > On Fri, Dec 16, 2005 at 12:04:05AM -0700, Scott Long wrote:
> > > There will be three FreeBSD 6 releases in 2006.
> On Sat, Dec 17, 2005 at 02:00:21PM -0800, Joe Rhett wrote:
> > While this is nice, may I suggest that it is time to put aside/delay one
> > release cycle and come up with a binar
On Sat, Dec 17, 2005 at 06:55:03PM -0500, Chuck Swiger wrote:
> YMMV. I burned a 6.0 release from the ISO image, and did a binary upgrade on
> an
> IBM ThinkPad (T.34? maybe), which worked perfectly. All of the 5.x binaries,
> including X11, KDE, printing, Mozilla, etc worked just fine.
There a
On Sun, Dec 18, 2005 at 12:13:09PM -0500, Kris Kennaway wrote:
> > Doesn't creating a binary updates system that's going to be practical to use
> > require implementation of that old and exceedingly bikesheddable subject:
> > packaging
> > up the base system?
>
> No, after all the *existing* bina
On Sun, Dec 18, 2005 at 09:55:33AM +, Matthew Seaman wrote:
> Chuck Swiger wrote:
>
> >Upgrading the ports from there was somewhat annoying, as this guy's
> >machine had
> >~400 or so, but deleting them all, and then using "pkg_add -r " works just
> >fine
> >if you want to grab the latest cu
Chuck Swiger wrote:
Upgrading the ports from there was somewhat annoying, as this guy's machine had
~400 or so, but deleting them all, and then using "pkg_add -r " works just fine
if you want to grab the latest current binaries. From there you can portupgrade
as usual.
Now, if you want to talk
On Sat, Dec 17, 2005 at 02:00:21PM -0800 I heard the voice of
Joe Rhett, and lo! it spake thus:
>
> Increasing the number of deployed systems out of date [...]
This doesn't make any sense. If you install a 6.0 system, in 6 months
(assuming you installed it right when 6.0 was cut, for simplicity)
Joe Rhett wrote:
> On Fri, Dec 16, 2005 at 12:04:05AM -0700, Scott Long wrote:
>>There will be three FreeBSD 6 releases in 2006.
>
> While this is nice, may I suggest that it is time to put aside/delay one
> release cycle and come up with a binary update mechanism supported well by
> the OS? Incr
On Sat, Dec 17, 2005 at 02:00:21PM -0800, Joe Rhett wrote:
> On Fri, Dec 16, 2005 at 12:04:05AM -0700, Scott Long wrote:
> > There will be three FreeBSD 6 releases in 2006.
>
> While this is nice, may I suggest that it is time to put aside/delay one
> release cycle and come up with a binary update
On Fri, Dec 16, 2005 at 12:04:05AM -0700, Scott Long wrote:
> There will be three FreeBSD 6 releases in 2006.
While this is nice, may I suggest that it is time to put aside/delay one
release cycle and come up with a binary update mechanism supported well by
the OS? Increasing the speed of release
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