Brad McCormick, Ed.D. wrote:
>
> Good to hear from Tor again! Hopefully
> well-fare for people is still alive and
> well in the land of the midnight sun!
>
Thank you!
Just to mention that things are changing.
A few months ago Denmark decided to raise taxes of the rich and lower
taxes of the co
> Eva asked,
>
> >Shouldn't we try whatever we can?
>
> Eva,
>
> Have you ever laid down on the tracks to stop a moving train? If you had,
> you wouldn't be telling people it's so easy. Sure, if everyone laid on the
> tracks together, the train would have to stop. But those who lie down first
>
At 11:20 PM 8/2/98 GMT, Eva <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>The Gaia concept always sounded like a phantasy picture
>to me. too mistyeyed and humanised. Like saying, that
>the solar system was just so stable in the las few million years
>because it had the hidden agenda of maintaining that
>wierd thir
> Is there not confusion within the ranks of our allegedly erudite
> economic scholars who see only increased production as solution to
> Social Problems?
This is the opinion of the scholars who want to defend
the present system, even though it is so evidently
wrong, as the last period of globa
> I hate to say it, but you are speaking platitudes that don't stem from
> original thought, but from more ancient platitudes. That has to be so
> when the typical reference of "proof" is, "it is so because HE said it's
> so." The Social Scientist is apparently well read, but lacking even one
>
Some dreams may come true, if they are based on
reality. When humans are made aware of some
dire danger, they act. I rather try to do something
than sitting back, watching the suffering of
other people, including my offsprings and
uttering my dying whisper: I told you so...
We have the means to m
-Original Message-
From: Eva Durant <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: list futurework <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Tuesday, August 04, 1998 7:13 AM
Subject: Re: BUT WHAT DOES IT MEAN?
Eva Durant, in response to my posting on the decline of our high- energy
based system:
>We have th
Eva asked,
>Shouldn't we try whatever we can?
Eva,
Have you ever laid down on the tracks to stop a moving train? If you had,
you wouldn't be telling people it's so easy. Sure, if everyone laid on the
tracks together, the train would have to stop. But those who lie down first
are alone -- totall
-Original Message-
From: Eva Durant <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: list futurework <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Monday, August 03, 1998 10:02 AM
Subject: Re: BUT WHAT DOES IT MEAN?
In response to my posting on the probability that we are transcending the
limits of sustainability, Eva
who wouldn't agree with you?
The question is, what to do, when we know, that
the present economical structure is not
able to cope with global environmental and social
problems.
Giving money to failing economies means
giving western financial institutions back what they
"risked" in investment, wh
> >
> >So the "thinker" and the "herd" are different species... there is no
> >evidence of this and all theories that attempt to use such notions
> >were very limited in their efficiency besides being sinister.
> >Jay, I think you are into some sort of personality-cult stuff...
>
> Not differen
>
>
> Durant wrote:
>
> > I had no response to my arguments;
> >
> > Science is only a tool and even art would be non-existent without
> >scientific problemsolving.
>
> What is the date on the invention of the modern scientific process? Method?
>
>
The old one was just the same as th
Durant wrote:
> I had no response to my arguments;
>
> Science is only a tool and even art would be non-existent without
>scientific problemsolving.
What is the date on the invention of the modern scientific process? Method?
> It is the social/economical/cultural system that poses an
The Gaia concept always sounded like a phantasy picture
to me. too mistyeyed and humanised. Like saying, that
the solar system was just so stable in the las few million years
because it had the hidden agenda of maintaining that
wierd third planet. It is now demonstrated that there were
quite a few
> From: Ray E. Harrell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>
> >Do you think we could come up with some kind of syndrome that connects all
> of
> >these massive denials? How about it Brad? A 12 step program maybe? Jay
> >could write about it, Eva could do the numbers and the economists could
> work on
> >th
I had no response to my arguments;
Science is only a tool and even art would be non-existent without
scientific problemsolving. It is the social/economical/cultural
system that poses and applies/buysscience; so blame that for any
"miscarriages".
> Sorry guys, but considering the hi
Ray E. Harrell wrote:
>
> Sorry guys & gals,
>
> but it ain't that simple. Just ask Hall, Geertz or any of the others
> who have come to realize that the world does not only have two
> sides. Brad, that Maslow hierarchy exists as a holistic frame, in
> the moment, not as an order of events.
From: Durant <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Economist to work on ideology?? That's sounds even more frightening
>than me doing numbers...
Ideology and mathematical conjuring tricks is what economists are trained to
do.
Jay
> Jay Hanson wrote:
>
> > E. O. Wilson has pointed out that people evolved to "believe" -- not to be
> > scientists Once the thinkers figure out what needs to be done, a twelve
> > step program is an excellent way to change the behavior of the herd.
> >
So the "thinker" and the "herd" are diffe
Hey, Jay, I agree with you here... Eva
> I all cases, when I say "sciences", I mean "systems sciences" -- big picture
> sciences that include the social impacts in analysis. I am thinking of a
> top-down analysis of the whole enchilada
>
> SYSTEM DEFINED
> Interacting, interrelated, or inter
s a damn good list.
>
> Steve
>
>
>------------
>
> Subject: Re: BUT WHAT DOES IT MEAN?
> Date: Sat, 1 Aug 1998 16:21:53 -0400
> From: "Ed Weick" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> To: "Jay Hanson" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>,
> "Futurework" &l
Ray E. Harrell wrote:
[big snip]
> All of this being said, I am not an anti-European or an anti-Scientist.
[big snip]
While it is true that many scientists are "in for the money" and many
technicians wear blinkers, we should keep in mind that not all scientists/
technicians are like that, and sci
I agree with Brad:
Brad McCormick, Ed.D. wrote:
>
> Perhaps this is as good a place as any to clarify something
> about some of my postings that may not have been obvious due
> to my having other "fish to fry": I think Jay's disgnoses and
> progmoses of waht's likely to happen in our world are
-Original Message-
From: Jay Hanson <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: Futurework <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: Friday, July 31, 1998 10:04 PM
Subject: Re: BUT WHAT DOES IT MEAN?
>Let's pretend for a moment, that we had the resources to minimize global
>human suffering. What
> > E. O. Wilson has pointed out that people evolved to "believe" -- not to
be
>> scientists Once the thinkers figure out what needs to be done, a twelve
> > step program is an excellent way to change the behavior of the herd.
>
>So the "thinker" and the "herd" are different species... there is
Ray Harrell's thread is superb, but isn't the problem with science that
it is effectively an act of analysis done upon something else than the
scientist? As such scientific solutions like the ones listed below solve
problems of transport, exchange, sociology and power supply in a narrow
sense, but
Hi:
I've been off this list for a couple of years, but I hear it's still a
sounding board for reality - for which there is generally little appetite,
when it comes to considering humanity's future prospects
I was sent a recent post, so I though I'd sign on for a while.
REH said
>Jay,
>
>Comi
From: fran^don <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>serve society. Rather, society is seen as an aggregate resource to serve
>the global market.", and suggests we are all believers in this mad
scenario.
E. O. Wilson has pointed out that people evolved to "believe" -- not to be
scientists Once the thinkers fig
From: Ray E. Harrell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Sorry guys, but considering the history of people who have "solved" the
problems of the past like highways, nuclear power, the "free market", the
buffalo, the Indians, the internal combustion engine, the Concorde, the
economy, all with out looking at t
Sorry guys, but considering the history of people who have "solved" the
problems of the past like highways, nuclear power, the "free market",
the buffalo, the Indians, the internal combustion engine, the Concorde,
the economy, all with out looking at the big picture, makes me not
look to scienc
power lines to transmit the energy, decommissioning
> the plant, and so on. The difference between the amount of energy
> generated and the amount of energy wasted is known as the "energy profit".
>
> By definition, energy "sources" must produce more energy than t
From: Brad McCormick, Ed.D. <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>less terrible? *That* I believe is quite possible. My
>disagreement with Jay's postings is simply with their
>feeding into the ideology which makes persons think they are
>less than they can be and thereby helps them to become
>that less (if you d
From: Ray E. Harrell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>Do you think we could come up with some kind of syndrome that connects all
of
>these massive denials? How about it Brad? A 12 step program maybe? Jay
>could write about it, Eva could do the numbers and the economists could
work on
>the ideology of ch
he amount of energy wasted is known as the "energy profit".
By definition, energy "sources" must produce more energy than they
consume -- must produce a profit -- otherwise they are called "sinks".
BUT WHAT DOES IT MEAN?
As far as I know, there has been no stud
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