Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

I'm not sure whether this vote will be cancelled or not, so... > [+1] Open up POI svn commit access. > [-1] Don't open POI svn commit access, because... -1 because POI will make a move to spin off from Jakarta early next year. There is no point in force-merging at this time. If POI should decide

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

Hello Avik, Avik Sengupta wrote: > This is completely out of line (to say the least). Yes it was. Henri already pointed out my error, and I apologize for mixing things up and thereby offending the POI community. The problem was not in the release files, it was with the procedure used for publish

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

> eg the legal issue, which still > remains partially unanswered. > Andy has already replied that this was done in the early days of POI's entry into Apache under discussion with POI's then mentor and the board. It was also done as a consequence of a specific issue that had arisen. Short of no

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

If you are lost in bad sentences let me know :) Forgot to proof read :( Mvgr, Martin Martin van den Bemt wrote: > > Avik Sengupta wrote: >> I "dont care" about this vote (any more). I do care deeply about POI. I >> do care about Apache and Jakarta. I resent the opposite presumption on >> less th

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

Avik Sengupta wrote: > I "dont care" about this vote (any more). I do care deeply about POI. I > do care about Apache and Jakarta. I resent the opposite presumption on > less than rock-hard grounds, because it is a pretty big accusation. As noted in my analyses, I stated that I could be misinter

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

Martin van den Bemt wrote: >> -1 from me. >> >> Harmony doesn't let anyone commit on their project unless they they >> sign a statement saying they haven't looked at Sun's source code[1]. >> AFAIK this is a similar issue and the POI policy [2] is designed to >> protect POI, which as a user of POI

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

I "dont care" about this vote (any more). I do care deeply about POI. I do care about Apache and Jakarta. I resent the opposite presumption on less than rock-hard grounds, because it is a pretty big accusation. The fact that the POI and remaining jakarta communties are separate is a FACT. M

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

> So.. I think we need to: > > 1) Get the fixed POI release out. Fixed source headers, vote on the > files etc. > > 2) Sort out the legal statement so that it's more official and > organized (copying Harmony seems good). While everything I'm hearing > when I ask legal-internal, legal vp, secreta

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

Quoting Henri Yandell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: So.. I think we need to: 1) Get the fixed POI release out. Fixed source headers, vote on the files etc. 2) Sort out the legal statement so that it's more official and organized (copying Harmony seems good). While everything I'm hearing when I as

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

Quoting Roland Weber <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>: Hello Avik, I'd have been happy seeing POI move to a TLP. However, some of the comments in this thread seem to preclude that possibility either. I think his leaves the community between a rock and a hard place ... I dont want us to be subsumed as a co

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

Tetsuya Kitahata wrote: >> [+1] Open up POI svn commit access. >> [-1] Don't open POI svn commit access, because... > > As long as the ASF (entity)/ Jakarta PMC have an "WILL" to protect > and can protect the developers from the Legal Issues, > I am willing to put +1 to this vote. The biggest p

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

> [+1] Open up POI svn commit access. > [-1] Don't open POI svn commit access, because... As long as the ASF (entity)/ Jakarta PMC have an "WILL" to protect and can protect the developers from the Legal Issues, I am willing to put +1 to this vote. -- I, personally, hope I can live happily and pe

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

> I am wondering about this vote though. Why now? and what's the > significance of POI/Jakarta svn access merging? To me it seems the > flattening of svn is of little significance. After a year with the > new structure, I see individual cases where committers have > cross-pollinated (in commons

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

> I still have no personal desire to have the same people who brought me > commons automatically in POI. > I do however welcome constructive > good-intentioned dialog Take POI out of Jakarta, seriously. The problems seem to be really around "POI vs Jakarta" the PMC are uneasy at POI's insula

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

> I'm +0 for opening. I'm enthusiastic on pushing POI out of Jakarta to > remove this restriction. While I agree that POI fits Jakarta theme-wise, > this "access restriction" thing feels too much like a wart. Same here, as no-one has ack#ed my resignation I'm going to vote +0 for this. I think t

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

Hello Henri, > I bet a lot of Jakarta does not conform - it's only when a release > happens that we think about bringing it up to date. This is not a > problem of the POI community but a problem of the Jakarta community > structure and for the PMC. It's the PMC's responsibility to make sure > thes

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

Hi, On 12/17/06, Mark Thomas <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Martin van den Bemt wrote: > I simply don't care to be honest. Nick is doing lot's of work for POI, without any guidance from the > people you anticipate of giving guidance, which is what I care about. So my first goal is helping > out Ni

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

On 12/17/06, Roland Weber <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Hello Avik, > I'd have been happy seeing POI move to a TLP. However, some of the > comments in this thread seem to preclude that possibility either. I > think his leaves the community between a rock and a hard place ... I > dont want us to be

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

Martin van den Bemt wrote: > I simply don't care to be honest. Nick is doing lot's of work for POI, > without any guidance from the > people you anticipate of giving guidance, which is what I care about. So my > first goal is helping > out Nick so he can continue the good work he is doing over th

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

> made a proposal to promote POI now, I would expect the board > to reject it and tell us "make POI work in Jakarta before you > promote it to TLP". That is was my feeling as well, but I understood from the board that they rather prefer that things are not hidden in subprojects, which is somethi

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

Hello Avik, > I'd have been happy seeing POI move to a TLP. However, some of the > comments in this thread seem to preclude that possibility either. I > think his leaves the community between a rock and a hard place ... I > dont want us to be subsumed as a commons project I don't think that the

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

On 12/17/06, Martin van den Bemt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Avik Sengupta wrote: > I'd have been happy seeing POI move to a TLP. However, some of the > comments in this thread seem to preclude that possibility either. I > think his leaves the community between a rock and a hard place ... I >

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

Hi Avik, Avik Sengupta wrote: > Wow! The one weekend I decide not to check mail!! :) I know what you mean :) > > Am replying to the original message for convenience, but have read the > thread till this point. > > Basically, the amount of negativity towards POI project in the thread > seems se

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

Wow! The one weekend I decide not to check mail!! :) Am replying to the original message for convenience, but have read the thread till this point. Basically, the amount of negativity towards POI project in the thread seems seems quite painful. At the end of the day, I believe we keep say

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

On 12/15/06, Henri Yandell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On 12/15/06, Nick Burch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Fri, 15 Dec 2006, Martin van den Bemt wrote: > > Apache legal doesn't know anything about this.. > > Back when I joined POI, I was told the apache legal team had suggested the > requireme

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

Rainer Klute schrieb: > Martin van den Bemt schrieb: > >> [+1] Open up POI svn commit access. >> [-1] Don't open POI svn commit access, because... >> >> > > [0] I don't care. > Having read all the contribution s on this

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

hy im happy to join to ur party -- This message was sent on behalf of [EMAIL PROTECTED] at openSubscriber.com http://www.opensubscriber.com/message/general@jakarta.apache.org/5604698.html - To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECT

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

Niall Pemberton wrote: > On 12/17/06, Roland Weber <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> Hello Niall, >> >> > Why is it any different than Harmony? >> >> Harmony requires that an "Authorized Contributor Questionnaire" >> be signed. The ACQ surely has been reviewd by the ASF legal team, >> and signatures

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

Niall Pemberton wrote: > On 12/16/06, Martin van den Bemt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: >> > -1 from me. >> > >> > Harmony doesn't let anyone commit on their project unless they they >> > sign a statement saying they haven't looked at Sun's source code[1]. >> > AFAIK this is a similar issue and the

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

On 12/17/06, Roland Weber <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Hello Niall, > Why is it any different than Harmony? Harmony requires that an "Authorized Contributor Questionnaire" be signed. The ACQ surely has been reviewd by the ASF legal team, and signatures are legally significant. http://harmony.apac

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

Hello Niall, > Why is it any different than Harmony? Harmony requires that an "Authorized Contributor Questionnaire" be signed. The ACQ surely has been reviewd by the ASF legal team, and signatures are legally significant. http://harmony.apache.org/auth_cont_quest.html The POI "Get Involved" pag

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

On Fri, 2006-12-15 at 20:30 -0500, Andrew C. Oliver wrote: [...] > I would like to see a formats.apache.org project which was devoted to We do know that you are not serious here. [...] > With the launch of Buni (http://buni.org) my time for repeating votes Domain Name:BUNI.ORG Created On:06-

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

On Fri, 2006-12-15 at 18:25 -0500, Andrew C. Oliver wrote: [...] > what is your interest here? Do you have nothing better to do? You *might* (at some point) read up what part of Apache the POI project is in and who is currently legally responsible for it. This is not your small, private show

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

On 12/16/06, Martin van den Bemt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > -1 from me. > > Harmony doesn't let anyone commit on their project unless they they > sign a statement saying they haven't looked at Sun's source code[1]. > AFAIK this is a similar issue and the POI policy [2] is designed to > protect

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

Andrew C. Oliver wrote: > Hey I have an idea! If it doesn't pass this time we can call another > vote right before the next holiday and hope that none of the POI PMC > members are around... Then 3 months later do it again. This is a different vote. This one is specific about POI. The previous

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

Will Glass-Husain wrote: > Andy-- No one was going to railroad this through without input from > POI. See my previous email where I insisted that we have POI > participation. (and I would have -1'd this automatically if it had > been lacking). The discussion was civil up until recently. > >

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

Every legal document has to be on file and known to the secretary and he has no knowledge of such documents, so from an ASF point of view, this is non existing. If there is something on file I would love to hear where. Mvgr, Martin Roland Weber wrote: > Henri Yandell wrote: > >> Reasoning bein

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

Andrew C. Oliver wrote: > -1. > > You are of course misrepresenting the issue but okay. It is also > because of the legal issues. Go read the archive and provide a good > faith assertion rather than making an assumption. If YOU want to work > on POI please submit some patches and following th

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

> -1 from me. > > Harmony doesn't let anyone commit on their project unless they they > sign a statement saying they haven't looked at Sun's source code[1]. > AFAIK this is a similar issue and the POI policy [2] is designed to > protect POI, which as a user of POI is a good thing IMO. Even if this

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

Henri Yandell wrote: > Reasoning being that Martin has done the same thing I did - asked > legal vp and secretary if they know anything about the need for POI to > be legally special and they don't. Then either the ASF legal team wasn't involved in the discussion Andy mentioned, or the current st

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

On 12/15/06, Andrew C. Oliver <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Hey I have an idea! If it doesn't pass this time we can call another vote right before the next holiday and hope that none of the POI PMC members are around... Then 3 months later do it again. Reasoning being that Martin has done the sa

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

Is it necessary to resort to sarcasm and personalise this? Henri Yandell's a good guy in my book and this only reflects badly on you. Niall On 12/16/06, Andrew C. Oliver <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Hey I have an idea! If it doesn't pass this time we can call another vote right before the next h

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

Martin van den Bemt schrieb: > [+1] Open up POI svn commit access. > [-1] Don't open POI svn commit access, because... > [0] I don't care. Best regards Rainer Klute Rainer Klute IT-Consulting GmbH Dipl.-Inform. Rainer Klute E-Mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

Will Glass-Husain wrote: Andy-- No one was going to railroad this through without input from POI. See my previous email where I insisted that we have POI participation. (and I would have -1'd this automatically if it had been lacking). The discussion was civil up until recently. Okay. It jus

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

The alias is immaterial to me -Andy Roland Weber wrote: Andrew C. Oliver wrote: [...] I would like to see a formats.apache.org project which was devoted to Java/Ruby/C# APIs for office software file formats and more. That's a very unspecific name. "formats" can mean anything, from f

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

Andrew C. Oliver wrote: > [...] > I would like to see a formats.apache.org project which was devoted to > Java/Ruby/C# APIs for office software file formats and more. That's a very unspecific name. "formats" can mean anything, from formatting a file system to data formats/representations like BER.

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

Andy-- No one was going to railroad this through without input from POI. See my previous email where I insisted that we have POI participation. (and I would have -1'd this automatically if it had been lacking). The discussion was civil up until recently. I am wondering about this vote though.

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

Hey I have an idea! If it doesn't pass this time we can call another vote right before the next holiday and hope that none of the POI PMC members are around... Then 3 months later do it again. -1 (because my votes don't seem to be counted and Henri will make up backstory for me) Henri Yand

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

I feel a bit attacked for no reason really (regarding the barbs thrown in my direction). It has been some time since I have not been rather civil on this list and I would expect the return courtesy. I've always tried to make a good faith effort with regards to POI. I have never supported (an

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

On 12/15/06, Martin van den Bemt <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Hi everyone, You probably think "Hey I have seen a similar vote started by Henri on 27-3-2006" and the outcome was 3 -1 from POI so their SVN is still closed for Jakarta committers. The reasoning behind this is that POI is still tryin

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

On 12/15/06, Andrew C. Oliver <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: -1. You are of course misrepresenting the issue but okay. It is also because of the legal issues. Go read the archive and provide a good faith assertion rather than making an assumption. If YOU want to work on POI please submit some pat

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

-1. You are of course misrepresenting the issue but okay. It is also because of the legal issues. Go read the archive and provide a good faith assertion rather than making an assumption. If YOU want to work on POI please submit some patches and following that should you wish to be a commit

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

On 12/15/06, Henri Yandell <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On 12/15/06, Nick Burch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > On Fri, 15 Dec 2006, Martin van den Bemt wrote: > > Apache legal doesn't know anything about this.. > > Back when I joined POI, I was told the apache legal team had suggested the > requireme

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

On 12/15/06, Henning Schmiedehausen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: Hm, does it pose a real legal threat or is it just a "felt threat" from Andy? As long as we're not soliciting trade secrets - tis good. I suspect this is a case of Andy's lawyer back in the day either having a different opinion or

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

On Fri, 15 Dec 2006, Henri Yandell wrote: Back when I joined POI, I was told the apache legal team had suggested the requirement. Perhaps one of the older POI committers can supply the original details? My understanding is that the advice is from Andy's personal lawyer many moons ago, maybe b

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

If anyone comments or votes who is from the POI community, could you please identify yourself? We need to be sure there is representation in this vote. I'm abstaining till I see more debate. I see the implication of Martin's point -- POI is pretty insular in Jakarta. But where would POI go if

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

Hm, does it pose a real legal threat or is it just a "felt threat" from Andy? I'm +0 for opening. I'm enthusiastic on pushing POI out of Jakarta to remove this restriction. While I agree that POI fits Jakarta theme-wise, this "access restriction" thing feels too much like a wart. Push it to TLP,

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

On 12/15/06, Nick Burch <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: On Fri, 15 Dec 2006, Martin van den Bemt wrote: > Apache legal doesn't know anything about this.. Back when I joined POI, I was told the apache legal team had suggested the requirement. Perhaps one of the older POI committers can supply the ori

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

ehh +1 :) Mvgr, Martin Martin van den Bemt wrote: > Hi everyone, > > You probably think "Hey I have seen a similar vote started by Henri on > 27-3-2006" and the outcome > was 3 -1 from POI so their SVN is still closed for Jakarta committers. > > The reasoning behind this is that POI is still t

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

On Fri, 15 Dec 2006, Martin van den Bemt wrote: Apache legal doesn't know anything about this.. Back when I joined POI, I was told the apache legal team had suggested the requirement. Perhaps one of the older POI committers can supply the original details? Nick

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

Which legal team ? Apache legal doesn't know anything about this.. Mvgr, Martin Nick Burch wrote: > On Fri, 15 Dec 2006, Martin van den Bemt wrote: >> The reasoning behind this is that POI is still trying to stick to what >> it Jakarta once was and it is time they join the club completely. > > I

Re: [VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

On Fri, 15 Dec 2006, Martin van den Bemt wrote: The reasoning behind this is that POI is still trying to stick to what it Jakarta once was and it is time they join the club completely. I think it was actually a reccomendation from the legal team. We have always asked that anyone contributing c

[VOTE] Remove POI svn restrictions.

Hi everyone, You probably think "Hey I have seen a similar vote started by Henri on 27-3-2006" and the outcome was 3 -1 from POI so their SVN is still closed for Jakarta committers. The reasoning behind this is that POI is still trying to stick to what it Jakarta once was and it is time they j