Re: [The Java Posse] Re: IBM's Erich Gamma joins Microsoft

2011-06-08 Thread Ricky Clarkson
> Your experience of one person doesn't give you licence to damn the > entirety of the UK software development activity. It's not just my experience of one person. I lived in the UK all my life until 3 months ago. > Your experience of one person doesn't give you licence to damn the > entirety of

Re: [The Java Posse] Re: IBM's Erich Gamma joins Microsoft

2011-06-08 Thread Fabrizio Giudici
On 06/07/2011 05:59 PM, Ricky Clarkson wrote: [1] This helps to make sure the staff get treated well, as in properly informed, paid well enough not to be looking around or envious, and actually comfortable as opposed to gimmicky features like "we take our staff out mountain-climbing". It also he

[The Java Posse] Re: IBM's Erich Gamma joins Microsoft

2011-06-08 Thread Carl Jokl
Have we moved on to criticising the UK? Can I join in? Where do I begin? On Jun 8, 8:19 am, Kirk wrote: > ACCU  awesome group > > On Jun 8, 2011, at 9:05 AM, Russel Winder wrote: > > > > > On Tue, 2011-06-07 at 18:10 -0300, Ricky Clarkson wrote: > > [ . . . ] > >> As a tech lead/manager I rea

Re: [The Java Posse] Re: IBM's Erich Gamma joins Microsoft

2011-06-08 Thread Kirk
ACCU awesome group On Jun 8, 2011, at 9:05 AM, Russel Winder wrote: > On Tue, 2011-06-07 at 18:10 -0300, Ricky Clarkson wrote: > [ . . . ] >> As a tech lead/manager I really really tried to do that in the UK, and >> the guy still wrote the same broken code over and over, still >> committed r

Re: [The Java Posse] Re: IBM's Erich Gamma joins Microsoft

2011-06-08 Thread Russel Winder
On Tue, 2011-06-07 at 18:10 -0300, Ricky Clarkson wrote: [ . . . ] > As a tech lead/manager I really really tried to do that in the UK, and > the guy still wrote the same broken code over and over, still > committed rarely more than once a week, breaking the build as he > walked out of the door. Y

Re: [The Java Posse] Re: IBM's Erich Gamma joins Microsoft

2011-06-07 Thread Ricky Clarkson
> My not inconsiderable 22 years working in the UK has lead me to > believe strongly that pretty much everybody flourishes when they feel > valued and are treated properly. As a tech lead/manager I really really tried to do that in the UK, and the guy still wrote the same broken code over and over

[The Java Posse] Re: IBM's Erich Gamma joins Microsoft

2011-06-07 Thread Phil
On Jun 7, 11:59 am, Ricky Clarkson wrote: > > I work for an outsourcing company, in the third world, and what I see > is that the developers are very capable and very enthusiastic (a > refreshing change from the UK) > My not inconsiderable 22 years working in the UK has lead me to believe stro

Re: [The Java Posse] Re: IBM's Erich Gamma joins Microsoft

2011-06-07 Thread phil swenson
good advice. My problem with outsourcing is people who think like this: "Dev A in US costs $100,000. We can get 3 devs in country X for $100,000. We'll get 3x as much done!" They don't factor in the time zone differences, the management difficulties, etc. Not to mention the mythical man month

Re: [The Java Posse] Re: IBM's Erich Gamma joins Microsoft

2011-06-07 Thread Ricky Clarkson
> Seems like a lot of MBAs don't think that individuals matter (except > of course for the senior executives).  They view people as commodities > ("resources").  Hence the outsourcing for cheap labor movement. I work for an outsourcing company, in the third world, and what I see is that the develo

Re: [The Java Posse] Re: IBM's Erich Gamma joins Microsoft

2011-06-07 Thread phil swenson
Seems like a lot of MBAs don't think that individuals matter (except of course for the senior executives). They view people as commodities ("resources"). Hence the outsourcing for cheap labor movement. But hell yes, individuals matter. I've seen bad decisions by one fairly low level person comp

[The Java Posse] Re: IBM's Erich Gamma joins Microsoft

2011-06-07 Thread Vince O'Sullivan
On Jun 7, 6:12 am, Steven Herod wrote: > A company with 426,751 employees loses one staff member to a company > with 89,000 employees. > > Do individuals matter at this scale? Of course they do. Apple has over 30,000 employees but it owes all its success to one man. He left. The company nosedi

Re: [The Java Posse] Re: IBM's Erich Gamma joins Microsoft

2011-06-07 Thread Martijn Verburg
Of course they do, *we* still do the actual thinking and work you know :) On 7 June 2011 06:12, Steven Herod wrote: > A company with 426,751 employees loses one staff member to a company > with 89,000 employees. > > Do individuals matter at this scale? > > On Jun 7, 2:22 pm, Meteor wrote: >> Yes

[The Java Posse] Re: IBM's Erich Gamma joins Microsoft

2011-06-06 Thread Steven Herod
A company with 426,751 employees loses one staff member to a company with 89,000 employees. Do individuals matter at this scale? On Jun 7, 2:22 pm, Meteor wrote: > Yes. > Bad news for IBM and Java. > > But good news for Microsoft and C#. -- You received this message because you are subscribed

[The Java Posse] Re: IBM's Erich Gamma joins Microsoft

2011-06-06 Thread Meteor
Yes. Bad news for IBM and Java. But good news for Microsoft and C#. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "The Java Posse" group. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/javaposse/-/YmluTXE0YVFGb1VK. To post to this group,

Re: [The Java Posse] Re: IBM's Erich Gamma joins Microsoft

2011-06-06 Thread phil swenson
But what about JUnit itself? Tell me what sucks and why TestNG is better. 2011/6/6 Cédric Beust ♔ : > > On Mon, Jun 6, 2011 at 11:21 AM, Kevin Wright > wrote: >> >> Oh how the worm has turned! >> I personally found TestNG to be very complicated because of the XML >> configuration, certainly too

Re: [The Java Posse] Re: IBM's Erich Gamma joins Microsoft

2011-06-06 Thread Cédric Beust ♔
On Mon, Jun 6, 2011 at 11:21 AM, Kevin Wright wrote: > Oh how the worm has turned! > > I personally found TestNG to be very complicated because of the XML > configuration, certainly too risky for the average developer. > The tool support also lags behind JUnit, which is just a killer for most > pe

Re: [The Java Posse] Re: IBM's Erich Gamma joins Microsoft

2011-06-06 Thread Michael Barker
Visual Studio couldn't get much worse, (just finished building a .Net library). Mike. -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "The Java Posse" group. To view this discussion on the web visit https://groups.google.com/d/msg/javaposse/-/c0RWVlFETDBHRllK. To

Re: [The Java Posse] Re: IBM's Erich Gamma joins Microsoft

2011-06-06 Thread Kevin Wright
Oh how the worm has turned! I personally found TestNG to be very complicated because of the XML configuration, certainly too risky for the average developer. The tool support also lags behind JUnit, which is just a killer for most people. It's just remiss of a test framework designer not to start

Re: [The Java Posse] Re: IBM's Erich Gamma joins Microsoft

2011-06-06 Thread Russel Winder
Cédric, On Mon, 2011-06-06 at 10:42 -0700, Cédric Beust ♔ wrote: > On Mon, Jun 6, 2011 at 10:31 AM, phil swenson > wrote: > I think Eclipse is fairly awful (usability mostly). But I'm > curious > what you think is wrong with JUnit? > > > Must... resist... No don't. Gi

Re: [The Java Posse] Re: IBM's Erich Gamma joins Microsoft

2011-06-06 Thread Joseph Ottinger
I don't have to resist. JUnit is to TestNG as Eclipse is to IDEA; basically, JUnit manages to steal stuff from TestNG that they think is easiest to implement, except they release it a long time after TestNG has had it. TestNG and JUnit are similar in that they both do unit testing, but JUnit 4 is a

Re: [The Java Posse] Re: IBM's Erich Gamma joins Microsoft

2011-06-06 Thread Cédric Beust ♔
On Mon, Jun 6, 2011 at 10:31 AM, phil swenson wrote: > I think Eclipse is fairly awful (usability mostly). But I'm curious > what you think is wrong with JUnit? > Must... resist... -- Cédric -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Google Groups "The Java Posse" group.

Re: [The Java Posse] Re: IBM's Erich Gamma joins Microsoft

2011-06-06 Thread phil swenson
I think Eclipse is fairly awful (usability mostly). But I'm curious what you think is wrong with JUnit? On Mon, Jun 6, 2011 at 9:01 AM, Joseph Ottinger wrote: > Probably an overall win for Java - he can infect VS with Eclipse' and > JUnit's brands of retardation, and maybe Java's level of infect

Re: [The Java Posse] Re: IBM's Erich Gamma joins Microsoft

2011-06-06 Thread Joseph Ottinger
Probably an overall win for Java - he can infect VS with Eclipse' and JUnit's brands of retardation, and maybe Java's level of infection can subside. (And yes, I'm mostly kidding.) -- Joseph B. Ottinger http://enigmastation.com -- You received this message because you are subscribed to the Goo

[The Java Posse] Re: IBM's Erich Gamma joins Microsoft

2011-06-06 Thread Reinier Zwitserloot
All projects he was involved in have either stopped benefitting from initial work (i.e. JUnit, GoF book), or are far too large for one guy to have a serious impact on (eclipse). >From time to time some big company poaches a minor celebrity from another company. It happens. -- You received thi