+1 I don't think plasmoids or applications really replace each other.
Some users want a calculator application, others want a handy
plasmoid. No need to choose between them, ship both imo.
BR,
Jeremy
On Wed, Jan 15, 2014 at 2:56 PM, Albert Astals Cid wrote:
> El Dimecres, 15 de gener de 2014, a
Where do we draw the line between them?
Plasmoids come from (live in) the Plasma Workspaces world, it's our desktop.
Thanks to the awesome KF5 effort apps are becoming more
desktop-agnostic than ever. These two worlds rock while running
side-by-side but also would shine when used separately.
I do
On Wednesday, January 15, 2014 22:56:12 Albert Astals Cid wrote:
> El Dimecres, 15 de gener de 2014, a les 21:47:17, John Layt va escriure:
> > Hi,
> >
> > * Do we need small utilities like KCalc as stand-alone apps, or do
> > they belong in Workspaces, perhaps as Plasmoids? Where do we draw the
On Wednesday, January 15, 2014 22:56:12 Albert Astals Cid wrote:
> El Dimecres, 15 de gener de 2014, a les 21:47:17, John Layt va escriure:
> > Hi,
> >
> > * Do we need small utilities like KCalc as stand-alone apps, or do
> > they belong in Workspaces, perhaps as Plasmoids? Where do we draw the
On Thursday 16 January 2014 10:43:42 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
> On Wednesday, January 15, 2014 22:56:12 Albert Astals Cid wrote:
> > El Dimecres, 15 de gener de 2014, a les 21:47:17, John Layt va escriure:
> > > Hi,
> > >
> > > * Do we need small utilities like KCalc as stand-alone apps, or do
> > >
Hey,
On Thursday, January 16, 2014 10:43:42 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
> > Why would i want a calculator
> > as a plasmoid instead of an application? So that i need to minimize all my
> > other apps to see the desktop to see it instead of just alt-tabbing?
>
> What’s worse than insulting another perso
On Thursday, January 16, 2014 11:35:29 Sebastian Kügler wrote:
> I think this is really not the way we should discuss things. Accusing Albert
> of insulting anybody is not necessary, accusing him of doing it out of
> ignorance is clearly against our code of conduct.
Fine; so when someone says “I
On Thursday, 2014-01-16, 10:43:42, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
> We’ve had plasma-windows for ages now which runs plasmoids in their own
> independent window like a mini application. For apps like ksnapshot and
> kcalc the results would be identical or nearly so (kcalc would require
> support for puttin
On Thursday, January 16, 2014 11:28:02 Martin Graesslin wrote:
> On Thursday 16 January 2014 10:43:42 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
> > On Wednesday, January 15, 2014 22:56:12 Albert Astals Cid wrote:
> > > El Dimecres, 15 de gener de 2014, a les 21:47:17, John Layt va escriure:
> Aaron, please assume goo
On Thursday, January 16, 2014 11:46:33 Kevin Krammer wrote:
> On Thursday, 2014-01-16, 10:43:42, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
> I also thought about plasma-windowed when reading that :)
>
> However, I think it is one of those "hidden gems" that nobody knows about.
> I've had questions like "can I run $ap
On Thursday, January 16, 2014 11:47:13 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
> On Thursday, January 16, 2014 11:35:29 Sebastian Kügler wrote:
> > I think this is really not the way we should discuss things. Accusing
> > Albert of insulting anybody is not necessary, accusing him of doing it
> > out of ignorance is
On Thursday, 2014-01-16, 12:05:17, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
> On Thursday, January 16, 2014 11:46:33 Kevin Krammer wrote:
> > On Thursday, 2014-01-16, 10:43:42, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
> > I also thought about plasma-windowed when reading that :)
> >
> > However, I think it is one of those "hidden gems
On Thursday, January 16, 2014 12:12:47 Sebastian Kügler wrote:
> The bottom line is that it would have been easy to *not* take this personal.
It’s not about taking this personally, it’s about creating an environment that
is pleasant and collaborative, or alternatively negative and adversarial. Wh
On Thursday 16 Jan 2014 13:24:51 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
> Personally, I’d like to be able to open my KDE email folders and not wonder
> who is going to say what unpleasant thing to me today. I’d like others to
> have the same assurance as well.
I haven't seen anyone else say this, so maybe I'm the
On Thursday 16 January 2014 13:24:51 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
> Martin Graesslin wrote: 'We all know Albert and we all know that his writing
> reads more harsh than he intents to.’ IOW: it’s OK for Albert, because we
> all know he’s gruff and we should accommodate that. Others are routinely
> granted
On Thursday 16 January 2014 14:48:22 Martin Graesslin wrote:
> On Thursday 16 January 2014 13:24:51 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
> > Martin Graesslin wrote: 'We all know Albert and we all know that his
> > writing reads more harsh than he intents to.’ IOW: it’s OK for Albert,
> > because we all know he’s
My 2 cents on this: I agree that Albert's original phrasing here
wasn't great, and I wouldn't have ignored it myself.
Assuming good intentions has to go both ways, and reacting to a
*question* (like "Should we do these as Plasmoids?") with "You're
going to kill my baby seals, I know it!" is exact
Hi Aaron,
On Thursday, January 16, 2014 13:24:51 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
> > > That particular statement has been used for years and I’ve
> > > patiently corrected it time and again, and it is still used to justify
> > > things like “don’t force this down our throat”. That is not fair play.
> >
> >
On Thursday, January 16, 2014 16:09:03 Sebastian Kügler wrote:
> Hi Aaron,
>
> On Thursday, January 16, 2014 13:24:51 Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
> > > > That particular statement has been used for years and I’ve
> > > > patiently corrected it time and again, and it is still used to justify
> > > > thin
El Dijous, 16 de gener de 2014, a les 10:43:42, Aaron J. Seigo va escriure:
> On Wednesday, January 15, 2014 22:56:12 Albert Astals Cid wrote:
> > El Dimecres, 15 de gener de 2014, a les 21:47:17, John Layt va escriure:
> > > Hi,
> > >
> > > * Do we need small utilities like KCalc as stand-alone a
El Dijous, 16 de gener de 2014, a les 12:05:17, Aaron J. Seigo va escriure:
> On Thursday, January 16, 2014 11:46:33 Kevin Krammer wrote:
> > On Thursday, 2014-01-16, 10:43:42, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
> > I also thought about plasma-windowed when reading that :)
> >
> > However, I think it is one of
On Thursday, 2014-01-16, 22:07:17, Albert Astals Cid wrote:
> El Dijous, 16 de gener de 2014, a les 12:05:17, Aaron J. Seigo va escriure:
> > On Thursday, January 16, 2014 11:46:33 Kevin Krammer wrote:
> > > On Thursday, 2014-01-16, 10:43:42, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
> > > I also thought about plasma-
On Wednesday 15 January 2014 22:56:12 Albert Astals Cid wrote:
> El Dimecres, 15 de gener de 2014, a les 21:47:17, John Layt va escriure:
> > Hi,
> >
> > * Do we need small utilities like KCalc as stand-alone apps, or do
> > they belong in Workspaces, perhaps as Plasmoids? Where do we draw the
>
El Dijous, 16 de gener de 2014, a les 22:13:58, Kevin Krammer va escriure:
> On Thursday, 2014-01-16, 22:07:17, Albert Astals Cid wrote:
> > El Dijous, 16 de gener de 2014, a les 12:05:17, Aaron J. Seigo va
escriure:
> > > On Thursday, January 16, 2014 11:46:33 Kevin Krammer wrote:
> > > > On Thur
On Thursday 16 January 2014 22:05:08 Albert Astals Cid wrote:
> > > other apps to see the desktop to see it instead of just alt-tabbing?
> >
> > What’s worse than insulting another person is doing so from ignorance.
>
> Already said in private, but feel the public will benefit from it too:
> * S
On Thu, Jan 16, 2014 at 10:07 PM, Albert Astals Cid wrote:
> El Dijous, 16 de gener de 2014, a les 12:05:17, Aaron J. Seigo va escriure:
> > On Thursday, January 16, 2014 11:46:33 Kevin Krammer wrote:
> > > On Thursday, 2014-01-16, 10:43:42, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
> > > I also thought about plasma
On Thursday, 2014-01-16, 22:54:43, Albert Astals Cid wrote:
> El Dijous, 16 de gener de 2014, a les 22:13:58, Kevin Krammer va escriure:
> > On Thursday, 2014-01-16, 22:07:17, Albert Astals Cid wrote:
> > > Can you start it from the command line?
> >
> > plasma-windowed can be run from the comman
On Thursday, January 16, 2014 22:54:43 Albert Astals Cid wrote:
> So basically there's no difference between a plasmoid and a non-plasmoid?
There are differences; I would never do Krita as a plasmoid, e.g. Or, for that
matter, Okular. The Plasmoid design pattern lends itself to self-contained,
h
On Friday, January 17, 2014 09:21:29 Kevin Krammer wrote:
> > > > Can you start it from the command line?
> > >
> > > plasma-windowed can be run from the commandline, e.g.
> > > plasma-windowed org.kde.networkmanagement
> >
> > That's a bit too long vs "kcalc", but i guess you could always install
On Friday 17 January 2014, Sebastian Kügler wrote:
>
> That's pretty much what plasma-windowed does (modulo some setup of
> KDeclarative, etc.). Disadvantage of a binary-per-app would be that it
> requires compiling, with a generic "app shell loader thing" (like plasma-
> windowed), you can write
On Thursday, January 16, 2014 22:05:08 Albert Astals Cid wrote:
> * Sorry for being rude
...
> * Sorry if being being rude and wrong made you feel insulted. It was not my
> intention at all.
thanks for writing this, it is meaningful.
i would echo what marco said about sorry for being wrong, tho
On Friday, 2014-01-17, 19:48:14, Marco Martin wrote:
> On Friday 17 January 2014, Sebastian Kügler wrote:
> > That's pretty much what plasma-windowed does (modulo some setup of
> > KDeclarative, etc.). Disadvantage of a binary-per-app would be that it
> > requires compiling, with a generic "app she
On Friday, 2014-01-17, 12:05:51, Sebastian Kügler wrote:
> On Friday, January 17, 2014 09:21:29 Kevin Krammer wrote:
> > Right. Or I imagine that there could be a PlasmaAppletView class or
> > similar
> > that can be used in a small launcher executable
> That's pretty much what plasma-windowed do
On Thu, Jan 16, 2014 at 10:43:42AM +0100, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
> We’ve had plasma-windows for ages now which runs plasmoids in their own
> independent window like a mini application. For apps like ksnapshot and kcalc
> the results would be identical or nearly so (kcalc would require support for
Hi folks, I've finally gotten up-to-date on this long, technical and
emotional discussion. I'd just like to say, I love each of you who
wrote. You care about quality, you care about the KDE community, and
you care deeply about one another.
Damn do I love this community. As long as we can keep reme
On Thursday, January 16, 2014 19:48:23 Martin Sandsmark wrote:
> On Thu, Jan 16, 2014 at 10:43:42AM +0100, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
> > We’ve had plasma-windows for ages now which runs plasmoids in their own
> > independent window like a mini application. For apps like ksnapshot and
> > kcalc the resu
On Sun, Jan 19, 2014 at 11:55:13AM +0100, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
> this is not really related at all, and i hesitate to engage in the topic here
> due to loss of topical focus.
It was merely to illustrate a point, that switching to QML is not a simple
process, and it seemingly takes us over a year
On Sunday, January 19, 2014 23:42:58 Martin Sandsmark wrote:
> On Sun, Jan 19, 2014 at 11:55:13AM +0100, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
> > this is not really related at all, and i hesitate to engage in the topic
> > here due to loss of topical focus.
>
> It was merely to illustrate a point, that switching
On Mon, Jan 20, 2014 at 11:10:06AM +0100, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
> namely duplication of effort and inconsistency due to multiple
> implementations of what is from a use case perspective the same thing.
This would be all well and good if it wasn't for the gross regressions it
would suffer.
You arg
On Mon, Jan 20, 2014 at 6:29 PM, Martin Sandsmark
wrote:
>
> The obvious downsides things being replaced would suffer from, thanks to
> the
> immature state of the desktop components, and not including the previously
> mentioned obviously broken components; dreadful performance, no proper
> accele
On Monday, January 20, 2014 18:29:16 Martin Sandsmark wrote:
> On Mon, Jan 20, 2014 at 11:10:06AM +0100, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
> > namely duplication of effort and inconsistency due to multiple
> > implementations of what is from a use case perspective the same thing.
>
> This would be all well an
On Monday, 2014-01-20, 18:29:16, Martin Sandsmark wrote:
> The current kcalc UI is very good, I often use it for stuff like bit
> fiddling, etc. I can't say the same thing for the calculator plasma applet.
> But please feel free to prove me wrong and make the plasma calculator much
> better than k
On Mon, Jan 20, 2014 at 06:42:14PM +0100, Martin Klapetek wrote:
> Just for the record, we now have almost 1-to-1 visual consistency of
> QtQuickControls with Oxygen style and classic QWidgets with Oxygen style.
> Couple patches are still pending.
I think the amount of work that has gone into Oxyg
I first wrote a long reply talking crap about UX and regressions, but I
re-read it and thought about kittens instead, so I deleted it.
On Mon, Jan 20, 2014 at 07:05:24PM +0100, Aaron J. Seigo wrote:
> Agreed, or at the very least has parity.
This is all I really want. Don't remove kcalc until the
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