[lace-chat] A question of articles

2005-11-14 Thread Tamara P Duvall
Gentle Spiders, I may have asked this one before, you may have replied and I'd forgotten... Such is life with memory running on "almost empty" When I was learning English as a kid (all those many years ago), we were given rules about when/where/how to use which article, because Polish doesn

[lace-chat] A question of articles

2005-11-15 Thread Jean Nathan
Don't know about current usage, but it used to be an hotel (pronouncing the h), but I can't think of any other words where 'an' precedes a prounounced 'h'. Some UK accents make deciding what's been said quite difficult when the 'n' from an tends to be run into the next word. Taking the alumini

Re: [lace-chat] A question of articles

2005-11-14 Thread Ruth
I've always had great sympathy for anyone trying to learn English as a second language. It's such a conglomeration of everything and there seem to be more exceptions that rules. There are not too many words that begin with "h" for US English speakers (it may well be different for UK English) i

Re: [lace-chat] A question of articles

2005-11-14 Thread Alice Howell
I don't know about the rest of the country, but I would use 'a' in front of history, hispanic and hotel, and I DO pronouce the H. However, I can imagine people using 'an' if they tend to drop or aspirate the H. I would say that this rule, as with others in USA grammar, is being slurred. I als

Re: [lace-chat] A question of articles

2005-11-15 Thread Brenda Paternoster
Hello Tamara Take "history"; it's almost always preceded by "an" when written. Should I, then, say "an istorical fact"? Same for "hotel". I know the "h" is silent *in French*, but, should I say "an otel reservation" in English? And, yesterday - in an otherwise great book - I got another one:

Re: [lace-chat] A question of articles

2005-11-15 Thread Scotlace
I, too, think, an hotel is "correct" grammar. I have very, very vague memories of the explanation why. I think it comes from the French who do not pronounce the "h". it's l'hotel isn't it? (Question for our French members). French was the language of society in this country for a long time.

Re: [lace-chat] A question of articles

2005-11-15 Thread Helen
Okay, according to my grammar book (p131, "Rediscover Grammar", David Crystal, Longman 1996): the use of "a" or "an varies before a few words beginning with "h", such as "hotel" and "historical". The latter form is often felt to be old-fashioned. so there you go

Re: [lace-chat] A question of articles

2005-11-15 Thread Helen
Or not, as the case may be http://www.straightdope.com/mailbag/mmuttonpork.html At 13:06 15/11/2005, Helen wrote: Pig, sheep and cow are Anglo-Saxon words which the peasants who looked after them needed to know. Pork, mutton and beef are Norman words which the nobles who ate them needed to kn

Re: [lace-chat] A question of articles

2005-11-15 Thread Joy Beeson
At 08:19 AM 11/15/05 -, Jean Nathan wrote: >. . . some accents would sound like "a naluminium foil >helmet" or "a nempirical study" with short 'a' and very slight pause between >the 'a' and 'n'. And all through history, "n" at the beginning of a word has tended to come and go. A word tha

Re: [lace-chat] A question of articles

2005-11-15 Thread A & Y Farrell
> > And all through history, "n" at the beginning of a word has tended to come and go. A word that begins with a vowel will latch onto the "n" from "an" and keep it as its own, and people will accuse words that came by their "n"s honestly of stealing them, and snatch them away. > reminds me of my

Re: [lace-chat] A question of articles

2005-11-16 Thread David Collyer
Dear Tamara, But, more and more, the "rule" seems to be fraying at the edges, till I'm worried - more than usual - about opening my mouth in "real life" rather than in writing... Take "history"; it's almost always preceded by "an" when written. Should I, then, say "an istorical fact"? Same f

Re: [lace-chat] A question of articles

2005-11-16 Thread David Collyer
Dear Brenda and Tamara et al, To me the criteria is whether I'd say: "the hotel" or "thee otel"; "the historical " or "thee istostrical " "teh Hispanic " or "thee ispanic " In each of these cases I'd pronounce the as thee - to say "the" I'd have to stress the first syllable inste

Re: [lace-chat] A question of articles

2005-11-19 Thread Georgette Card
Hello Tamara and all Long time no speak. :) I use whatever sounds best and easiest to say to me. I don't remember learning what article goes before anything with an H in school. My ex is French-Canadian. He has problems pronouncing the H and some of the words he says is quite amusing. He ca