Mark Calabretta said:
Not if the timestamps are properly labelled with the timezone,
preferably specified as an offset, which distinguishes between
DST and non-DST.
falls about laughing
I was involved in a murder case where the police investigated the wrong
person because they hadn't realized
In message 20110209025648.gb5...@ucolick.org, Steve Allen writes:
Further evidence of this is that UN registers all internation
treaties its member states have entered into, in accordance with
the UN charters article 102, and you can see all of these treaties
at http://treaties.un.org
In
In message 0ea57b08-af7c-4bbe-8a56-b1376e873...@batten.eu.org, Ian Batten wri
tes:
Sovereign states have some degree of control over civil time; [...]
Although it's not obvious to me that in the UK, at least, they have any
practical authority over time. The Weights and Measures Act 1985
Ian Batten said:
Microsoft Exchange meeting invitations say things like GMT: London,
Edinburgh, Lisbon, and then contain local timestamps corrected for daylight
savings.
[...]
Yes, I'd forgotten that one.
Given that half of my team are now based in Bangalore and the other half in
Cambridge,
Should the day be the basic unit for civil timekeeping? Why not year?
Years cover things like when to plant crops which seems more important than
when to get up in the morning.
On the other hand, Gregorian rules may be good enough so we can use days as
the basic unit if that's more
On Tue, 8 Feb 2011, Warner Losh wrote:
On 02/08/2011 14:39, Rob Seaman wrote:
C) As pointed out on numerous occasions in the past, these kaleidoscopic
timezones would accelerate quadratically just like leap seconds.
This problem isn't solved by this method either. True.
Except that
On Tue, 8 Feb 2011, Rob Seaman wrote:
B) Detailed expert knowledge would become necessary to answer even
simple questions of comparing both clock intervals and Earth
orientation questions either in a single place or across epochs and
locations.
We have that today.
We have a soupçon
Getting further off-topic:
http://www.newyorker.com/reporting/2007/12/10/071210fa_fact_gawande?printab
le=true
Great article! Thanks!
If you like that article, I highly recommend his 3rd book: Checklist
Manifesto.
http://gawande.com/the-checklist-manifesto
That article is (roughly) the
On Wed, 9 Feb 2011, Ian Batten wrote:
It also opens the interesting question of what timestamps mean in a
non-monotonic timescale: during the autumn change, a hour is repeated.
So as far as a clock ticking civil time is concerned, you have 0100
through 0200 twice, once a year. Events stamped
On Wed, 9 Feb 2011, Ian Batten wrote:
Extra fun will ensue if England moves to full-time daylight saving or to
WET, both of which have a non-zero chance of happening, while Scotland
remain on their existing arrangements, which also has a non-zero chance.
You mean CET. (We are currently on
Tony Finch said:
As far as I can tell from a brief look at the document, the accurate
timestamp requirement applies to trading data, and they don't trade when
there is a DST change or when leap seconds occur.
Does it say that, or are you guessing?
DST changes tend to be outside trading hours,
As far as I can tell from a brief look at the document, the accurate
timestamp requirement applies to trading data, and they don't trade when
there is a DST change or when leap seconds occur.
Does it say that, or are you guessing?
DST changes tend to be outside trading hours, but leap
Clive D.W. Feather wrote:
Tony Finch said:
As far as I can tell from a brief look at the document, the accurate
timestamp requirement applies to trading data, and they don't trade when
there is a DST change or when leap seconds occur.
Does it say that, or are you guessing?
DST
In message ae1ee06f-17e5-46e2-abc2-c0700cb1a...@noao.edu, Rob Seaman writes:
Clive D.W. Feather wrote:
I reserve the right to disagree. The point is that dumb is what
the rubber timezone folks say - and rubber timezones are an order
of magnitude more dumb than either rubber seconds or
Tony Finch wrote:
Warner Losh wrote:
Rob Seaman wrote:
C) As pointed out on numerous occasions in the past, these kaleidoscopic
timezones would accelerate quadratically just like leap seconds.
This problem isn't solved by this method either. True.
Except that timezone adjustments
On 02/08/2011 23:54, Mark Calabretta wrote:
On Wed 2011/02/09 06:25:25 -, Ian Batten wrote
in a message to: Tom Van Baakt...@leapsecond.com,
Leap Second Discussion Listleapsecs@leapsecond.com
Although that mandates access to a continuously reliable source of DST
changeover dates and
On 02/09/2011 09:05, Rob Seaman wrote:
Tony Finch wrote:
Warner Losh wrote:
Rob Seaman wrote:
C) As pointed out on numerous occasions in the past, these kaleidoscopic
timezones would accelerate quadratically just like leap seconds.
This problem isn't solved by this method either. True.
On Wed, 9 Feb 2011, Rob Seaman wrote:
PHK's position is that hundreds of local governments (that he appears to
consider beneath contempt) would have to act separately or severally
during each adjustment.
Right. Just as they do at present for political reasons.
Even if one-a-day is
On Wed, 2011-02-09 at 09:49 -0700, Warner Losh wrote:
It is a lot easier to adjust by an hour for local time than it is to
have a leap second every month, or more often. Thus Tony is right: the
zoneinfo files adjusting local time via timezone shifts mandated by
local government would
On 9 Feb 2011, at 18:44, Warner Losh wrote:
On 02/09/2011 10:48, Rob Seaman wrote:
The idea that's been put forth is that the transition would be
made all at once. Eastern Time zone would go from TI-5 to TI-4,
most likely by failing to fallback one year in the fall.
Exercise for the
In message 6d097a07-04ec-4ace-ad99-4c647ab22...@noao.edu, Rob Seaman writes:
In context my statement was:
By comparison, a leap second is introduced by a central
authority [...]
What authority would that be, and what powers would it have ?
Remember: it's called a recommendation for a
Poul-Henning Kamp wrote:
What authority would that be, and what powers would it have ?
Per SERVICE INTERNATIONAL DE LA ROTATION TERRESTRE ET DES SYSTEMES DE
REFERENCE, we know that:
NO positive leap second will be introduced at the end of June 2011.
I don't need to remind you, that
In message e97e8012-cc6f-4948-b291-a82868873...@noao.edu, Rob Seaman writes:
Poul-Henning Kamp wrote:
What authority would that be, and what powers would it have ?
Per SERVICE INTERNATIONAL DE LA ROTATION TERRESTRE ET DES SYSTEMES DE
REFERENCE, we know that:
NO positive leap second
On 07/02/11 20:10, Tom Van Baak wrote:
It is also why TAI's rate was adjusted in the 1990's to compensate for
the red-shifted data that had been collected at NIST in Boulder, since
it sits at about 5400' (1700m) above sea level (as well as other
facilities not at sea level).
Warner
Are you
Since the velocity of the atomic clock causes relativistic dilation,
surely it is not the altitude-above-sea-level, but the radial distance
from the earths axis that we are talking about???
I.e. surely both latitude and altitude affect the ceasium? I mean the
velocity of the atomic clock as it
On Wed 2011/02/09 08:40:42 -, Clive D.W. Feather wrote
in a message to: Leap Second Discussion List leapsecs@leapsecond.com
Not if the timestamps are properly labelled with the timezone,
preferably specified as an offset, which distinguishes between
DST and non-DST.
falls about laughing
On Wed 2011/02/09 08:48:28 -, Poul-Henning Kamp wrote
in a message to: Leap Second Discussion List leapsecs@leapsecond.com
during the autumn
change, a hour is repeated. So as far as a clock ticking civil time is
concerned, you have 0100 through 0200 twice, once a year. Events
stamped
On Wed 2011/02/09 08:56:21 -, Ian Batten wrote
in a message to: Leap Second Discussion List leapsecs@leapsecond.com
Microsoft Exchange meeting invitations say things like
GMT: London, Edinburgh, Lisbon, and then contain local timestamps
corrected for daylight savings. They do that all year
On Wed 2011/02/09 10:59:39 -, Tony Finch wrote
in a message to: Leap Second Discussion List leapsecs@leapsecond.com
Except that timezone adjustments continue to work much further into the
future than leap seconds.
If we're seriously expected to accept the quadratic catastrophy
argument for
On Wed 2011/02/09 11:44:14 PDT, Warner Losh wrote
in a message to: leapsecs@leapsecond.com
The speculation on the list is that in the absence of a central
authority, local governments will act as their people request when it is
staying dark too late and parents can't get their kids to bed with
In message 1297295931.7518.8.camel@localhost, Paul Sheer writes:
Since the velocity of the atomic clock causes relativistic dilation,
surely it is not the altitude-above-sea-level, but the radial distance
from the earths axis that we are talking about???
No, the velocity factor (special
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