On Tuesday 11 June 2002 04.19, Juan Linietsky wrote:
> > That's basically why I think inventing Yet Another, Although Much
> > Cooler Looking GUI Toolkit would be worth the effort, if it could
> > help cutting GUI development time without dropping chrome and/or
> > features. (Whether or not it's p
On Tuesday 11 June 2002 04.09, Taybin Rutkin wrote:
> On Tue, 11 Jun 2002, David Olofson wrote:
> > That's basically why I think inventing Yet Another, Although Much
> > Cooler Looking GUI Toolkit would be worth the effort, if it could
> > help cutting GUI development time without dropping chrome
On Monday 10 June 2002 18.52, Alexander Ehlert wrote:
> Hi,
>
> > Why we dont have apps such as Reason, Reaktor, Sonar, Sound
> > Forge, etc? I dont mean full apps, but at least projects aiming
> > for that kind of thing.
>
> Because only 2% of the linux audio programmers try to make a living
> of
On Tue, 11 Jun 2002, David Olofson wrote:
> That's basically why I think inventing Yet Another, Although Much
> Cooler Looking GUI Toolkit would be worth the effort, if it could
> help cutting GUI development time without dropping chrome and/or
> features. (Whether or not it's possibly is anot
> That's basically why I think inventing Yet Another, Although Much
> Cooler Looking GUI Toolkit would be worth the effort, if it could
> help cutting GUI development time without dropping chrome and/or
> features. (Whether or not it's possibly is another issue. Guess I'll
>
> just have to tr
On Monday 10 June 2002 07.46, Paul Davis wrote:
> >I think this raises some questions.. My feeling is that most
> > people aiming to write music on this OS is expecting to have apps
> > with super easy and intuitive interfaces, where you only go
> > trough displays, knobs, sliders and paintabe are
On Monday 10 June 2002 07.45, Ivica Bukvic wrote:
> However, forgot to mention, that it would be still nice to see
> user-friendliness become a standard in Linux ;-)
Yes - although one should keep in mind that *user* friendliness is
not the same thing as *beginner* friendliness. (I've had it wit
On Monday 10 June 2002 07.41, Ivica Bukvic wrote:
> What I think is that this is great since there is less likelihood
> that someone else will be using the same tools I do and hence less
> likely will my music sound like thousands of others :-)
Yeah... :-)
That's pretty much the reason why there
On Monday 10 June 2002 07.10, Juan Linietsky wrote:
> I thought this may be of interest to the list.
> In a k5 poll about usability of linux audio apps,
> ( http://www.kuro5hin.org/poll/1023512126_OSelOkZS )
> So far, out of 38 answers the results are:
>
> -How do you like music software for Linux
On Saturday 08 June 2002 12.32, Ingo Oeser wrote:
> On Sat, Jun 08, 2002 at 01:11:10AM +0200, David Olofson wrote:
> > (Software patents should be invalidated and made illegal world
> > wide, IMHO. They serve only the interests of the biggest
> > companies.)
>
> Nod, partially. Just invalidate aft
On Saturday 08 June 2002 09.28, Vincent Touquet wrote:
> On Sat, Jun 08, 2002 at 01:11:10AM +0200, David Olofson wrote:
> (cut)
>
> >>From the application POV, both approaches give the same result:
> >> Two
> >
> >"worlds" with different schedulers and services - and
> > unfortunately, different d
On Mon, Jun 10, 2002 at 06:09:01PM -0300, Juan Linietsky wrote:
(cut)
>I think Kai Vehmanen did a much better job explaining this than
>myself, since I dont know the internals of alsalib. I'll just repost
>what he said:
(cut)
Ok :)
If you want what Kai and Taybin are referring to,
its doable, it
On Mon, 10 Jun 2002 22:49:01 +0200
Vincent Touquet <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> (cut)
> >I'm afraid i didnt make myself clear. I tried to expain this in
> >previous mails, but I think i'm failing so far.
> >I perfectly understand what JACK is, but as I said before,
> >it's primarily meant for lo
On Mon, 10 Jun 2002, Juan Linietsky wrote:
> Yes! This is super just exactly accuratedly the point of what I was
> proposing. My point is simply that not all apps you'd like to
> route/interconnect need low latency, thus there is no need to use JACK
> natively on them. When the app tries to open
Great! of all people I think you understood what my point was with
this proposal.
I really have to work on improving my engish grammar.
> > 3-You may also want to put just any program that uses native
> > OSS/ALSA through this. Imagine running xmms and wanting to put the
> > sound thru a better
(cut)
>I'm afraid i didnt make myself clear. I tried to expain this in
>previous mails, but I think i'm failing so far.
>I perfectly understand what JACK is, but as I said before,
>it's primarily meant for low latency stuff.
>So my proposal consisted in two things.
>1-The first one is to proovid
On Mon, 10 Jun 2002, Juan Linietsky wrote:
> Also I find the whole idea redundant. If JACK is easier and faster to
> integrate then it should replace the ALSA api on that matter.
> Developers, and specialy new ones, will allways support the official
> api FIRST.
One important thing to remember i
On Mon, 10 Jun 2002, Juan Linietsky wrote:
> Here's a problem I commonly find in existing audio apps or in
> programming audio apps: Audio routing.
Over a year ago (Sat May 05 2001) I wrote the following message:
http://www.eca.cx/lad/2001/May/0071.html
... pretty close isn't it? The next step
On Mon, 10 Jun 2002 09:36:30 -0400
Paul Davis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >Yeah, but what I mean is 2 things, first that you should be able to
> >change transparently where the app is sending the data, without the
> >app noticing, and second that such configuration shouldnt be stored
> >by the a
On Mon, Jun 10, 2002 at 04:56:32 +0100, Richard Bown wrote:
> And for those of us labouring under dial-up perhaps an annotated png or two?
Frank took some digital photos which will be much better than the webcam
jpegs.
> So far the only show I'm planning on attending is Linux Expo UK
> (http://
On Mon, Jun 10, 2002 at 05:05:59PM +0200, Joern Nettingsmeier wrote:
< added to alsa.opensrc.org >
Regards,
Mark
mark.rages.net
Hi,
> something like that, forgot the name), Eyesweb, Glame, pd, jmax, Visual
cglame even compiles on MacOSX, the problem is that mmap doesn't
work the same way as it does in Linux and so our swapfile backend doesn't
work. As richi and I are proud owners of iBooks we might resolve that
problem. A
Hi,
> Why we dont have apps such as Reason, Reaktor, Sonar, Sound Forge,
> etc? I dont mean full apps, but at least projects aiming for that kind
> of thing.
Because only 2% of the linux audio programmers try to make a living of
that.
I personally dislike GUI programming, programming soundfx is
Mac-Only apps:
Max/MSP (yes I know PD runs on Windows and Linux, and jMax may be running
on on Windows by now)
Metasynth
Several Ircam pacakages: Super Phase Vocoder, Modalys
SoundHack
SuperCollider (for the time being)
Many ProTools plugins
Still a pretty substantial list, don't you think?
L
On Mon, Jun 10, 2002 at 09:30:36AM -0400, Paul Davis wrote:
(cut)
>Read the archives. We've been through this before. I'm not going
>through it again.
(cut)
ACK !
Every once in a while people bring up the same
questions people in this list
thought long and hard about and solved.
Before you st
Taybin Rutkin wrote:
> On Mon, 10 Jun 2002, Steve Harris wrote:
>
> > I have made some timelapse video of Linuxtag from saturday and sunday,
> > right up to the point when I had to shove everything in my bag and dash
> > for the train (which I just caught, thanks Frank!).
> >
> > http://inanna.e
>I read:
>>
>> What tools are you talking about? I mean, I own both PCs and Macs, and
>> except Digital Performer I don't know about any other major package
>> that only exists on the Mac.
>
>max/msp
>supercollider
>
>regards,
>
>x
Except that max/msp is coming to Win platform this fall (and
Juan Linietsky wrote:
>
> I thought this may be of interest to the list.
> In a k5 poll about usability of linux audio apps,
> ( http://www.kuro5hin.org/poll/1023512126_OSelOkZS )
> So far, out of 38 answers the results are:
^
anyone home ?
while it never hurts to discus
>In reply to the 'not having the same sound as
>everybody else', I think this is a question of how you
>use software and not what you use. You can play a
>million things/styles etc on a guitar. The same goes
>for software synths etc.
Yes, but guitar still sounds like a guitar (with the exception
On Mon, 10 Jun 2002, Steve Harris wrote:
> I have made some timelapse video of Linuxtag from saturday and sunday,
> right up to the point when I had to shove everything in my bag and dash
> for the train (which I just caught, thanks Frank!).
>
> http://inanna.ecs.soton.ac.uk/~swh/linuxtag/
Look
hi !
in reply to a posting by juan linietsky, Paul Davis wrote:
>
[allowing multiple apps to play at the same time (esound-style) on
hardware that does not support multi-open]
>
> * ALSA already has the "share" PCM device type which allows
> multiple access to the same underlying hardware
I read:
> What about jMax and Reactor?
I'm not sure what you mean reaktor runs on win and mac and jmax
runs on linux,osx,win32,irix
but max/msp != jmax and certainly not reaktor
supercollider is totally different from all the above
hmm..
x
--
[EMAIL PROTECTED]Postmodernism is german
I have made some timelapse video of Linuxtag from saturday and sunday,
right up to the point when I had to shove everything in my bag and dash
for the train (which I just caught, thanks Frank!).
http://inanna.ecs.soton.ac.uk/~swh/linuxtag/
I had a great time at the tag, but haven't had time to m
What about jMax and Reactor?
Sebastien
Original Message -
From: "CK" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Sent: Monday, June 10, 2002 4:59 PM
Subject: Re: [linux-audio-dev] Poll about linux music audio app usability
> I read:
> >
> > What tools are you talking about? I mean, I
I read:
>
> What tools are you talking about? I mean, I own both PCs and Macs, and
> except Digital Performer I don't know about any other major package that
> only exists on the Mac.
max/msp
supercollider
regards,
x
--
[EMAIL PROTECTED]Postmodernism is german romanticism with bet
[cc:ing alsa-dev and lau]
Richard Guenther wrote:
>
> Hi!
>
> I'd like to create a virtual 2-(stereo)-channel alsa device from one
> ISA SB AWE and one on-board VIA alsa device. Has anyone figured out
> how to do this using .asoundrc magic? [I know Jaroslav knows and told
> Joern, but I think t
What tools are you talking about? I mean, I own both PCs and Macs, and
except Digital Performer I don't know about any other major package that
only exists on the Mac. They all have at least a Win32 version. I think it
even now the other way around: the Mac platform is really missing tools as
powe
On Mon, 10 Jun 2002, Juan Linietsky wrote:
> I think this raises some questions.. My feeling is that most people
> aiming to write music on this OS is expecting to have apps with super
> easy and intuitive interfaces, where you only go trough displays,
> knobs, sliders and paintabe areas.
> Why w
>Since I have hardly looked at Jack, and definately not tried to use it (as a
>developer) I can't really comment on the design.
but you still say:
>- harder to understand "what" goes "where", Jörn has made some
>nice schemantics but the design is rather complex, a novice would not
>understand i
>Yeah, but what I mean is 2 things, first that you should be able to
>change transparently where the app is sending the data, without the
>app noticing, and second that such configuration shouldnt be stored by
>the app but from an abstracted app/interface that handles connections.
You're asking f
>> Mostly because to do it correctly he argued that it has to be based
>> on a callback design and that is not part of the alsa-lib. Hence
>> JACK.
>>
>
>Sorry, obligatory question, what's wrong with blocking calls? :)
Read the archives. We've been through this before. I'm not going
through it a
>1-It's not a standard. ALSA/OSS are. If i want to write a driver, i
>will do for those.
JACK has nothing to do with device drivers. Its a layer that hides
even the existence of physical audio interfaces from
applications. Right now, there is a dynamically loaded client/clock
client that uses ALS
On Mon, 10 Jun 2002, Juan Linietsky wrote:
> 1-It's not a standard. ALSA/OSS are. If i want to write a driver, i
> will do for those.
In the open-source world, standards are defined by consensus. How do you
think gtk+ became a standard? People started using it. ALSA isn't in
POSIX either.
>
Hi All,
It's obvious that we don't have all the programs that
are available for windows. Nor do we have the same
level of ui design/sophistication.
On the subject of ui s. I think the most important
thing about making music is a fluid work flow. If you
don't have that then things just end up be
Juan Linietsky wrote:
> No, allow me to explain better why I think supporting JACK is
> pointless and why I wouldnt do it. I'll give you all the reasons I can
> think of.
[a bunch of pretty useless reasons]
> For these reasons, I will not support or use JACK until something like
> it becomes pa
Hi guys,
being mainly a lurker (and (potentially) a user) I may not have a say, but anyway...
>
> No, allow me to explain better why I think supporting JACK is
> pointless and why I wouldnt do it. I'll give you all the reasons I can
> think of.
>
> 1-It's not a standard. ALSA/OSS are. If i wan
> No, allow me to explain better why I think supporting JACK is
> pointless and why I wouldnt do it. I'll give you all the reasons I can
> think of.
>
> 1-It's not a standard. ALSA/OSS are. If i want to write a driver, i
> will do for those.
define standard.
> 3-Device sharing is pointless for
On Mon, 10 Jun 2002 09:52:10 +0100
Richard Bown <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Juan Linietsky wrote:
>
> [developers choosing JACK over ALSA audio]
>
> > Not to be pessimistic, but I think such thing is not going to
> > happen. Also I find the whole idea redundant. If JACK is easier
> > and faste
Juan Linietsky wrote:
[developers choosing JACK over ALSA audio]
> Not to be pessimistic, but I think such thing is not going to happen.
> Also I find the whole idea redundant. If JACK is easier and faster to
> integrate then it should replace the ALSA api on that matter.
> Developers, and speci
On Mon, 10 Jun 2002 14:37:42 +0900
Patrick Shirkey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Juan Linietsky wrote:
>
> > Probably the easier and more natural approach to this is just
> > integrating JACK to ALSA in some way.
> >
> > What do you think?
> >
>
> Your idea has been discussed in length by Abra
On Mon, 10 Jun 2002 01:38:10 -0400
Paul Davis <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> >Here's a problem I commonly find in existing audio apps or in
> >programming audio apps: Audio routing.
> >
> >The way things work now, it's hard for apps to implement a standard
> >way of:
>
> First, you can't do any be
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