On 3/3/20 6:47 AM, Jim Popovitch via Mailman-Users wrote:
>
> Can you share with me (us) the number and size, along with the industry
> or operations arena, of those people who are creating their own web UI.
I have no information about that.
> I honestly don't believe that there is that much
On Mon, 2020-03-02 at 17:18 -0800, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> On 3/2/20 1:55 PM, Jim Popovitch via Mailman-Users wrote:
> > There are plenty of people who are still happy with pipermail and some
> > of the other search options (Google, htdig, etc) What benefit does a
> > REST api provide to church
On 3/2/20 1:55 PM, Jim Popovitch via Mailman-Users wrote:
>
> There are plenty of people who are still happy with pipermail and some
> of the other search options (Google, htdig, etc) What benefit does a
> REST api provide to church groups, and tech lists like nanog or mailop?
It provides a
On 3/2/20 4:55 PM, Jim Popovitch via Mailman-Users wrote:
While I applaud Brian's efforts, I'm not convinced that I would run PHP
on a public facing portal, even in 2020. But that's just me, others may
feel differently.
And so it begins.
--
Please let me know if you need further assistance.
On Mon, 2020-03-02 at 10:54 -0800, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> On 3/2/20 8:56 AM, Jim Popovitch via Mailman-Users wrote:
>
> > Barry's roadmap
> > for Python2 -> Python3 seems to counter the narrative that MM2 is ill-
> > advised to be ported to Python3 (btw, that was posted in Jan of this
> > year).
>
On Sat, 29 Feb 2020 10:53:19 -0500
Jim Popovitch via Mailman-Users wrote:
> but I have vague recollections that both Barry and Mark have
> > said repeatedly that doing so would be substantially anything built on the
> > MM2
> > architecture.
assuming that's so I think the "anything built
On 3/2/20 8:56 AM, Jim Popovitch via Mailman-Users wrote:
> Barry's roadmap
> for Python2 -> Python3 seems to counter the narrative that MM2 is ill-
> advised to be ported to Python3 (btw, that was posted in Jan of this
> year).
The question is what do people want when they say they want
On Mon, 2020-03-02 at 17:17 +0900, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote:
> Jim Popovitch via Mailman-Users writes:
>
> > Interestingly enough, here's a roadmap on exactly how to do it: :)
>
> Jim, you're not helping.
Stephen, thank you for taking the time to respond. Although I would
have preferred
Jim Popovitch via Mailman-Users writes:
> Interestingly enough, here's a roadmap on exactly how to do it: :)
Jim, you're not helping. Until there are "I'll do it" hands up, no
port to Python 3 that is faithful to current Mailman 2 is viable.
Pushing it just serves to annoy those who are
Mark Sapiro writes:
> I'd say it depend on the details of how serious the vulnerability is,
> how easy it is to exploit and how hard it is to fix. I am not opposed to
> Mailman 2.1.30-x security fix releases.
Mark speaks for me, although it's been a long time since I've worked
on Mailman 2,
On Sat, 2020-02-29 at 10:46 -0800, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> On 2/29/20 7:02 AM, Jim Popovitch via Mailman-Users wrote:
> > If
> > a CSF/CSS is identified in Mailman v2.1.30 in May-2020, what will be
> > done to address it?
>
> I'd say it depend on the details of how serious the vulnerability is,
>
On 2/29/20 7:02 AM, Jim Popovitch via Mailman-Users wrote:
>
> If
> a CSF/CSS is identified in Mailman v2.1.30 in May-2020, what will be
> done to address it?
I'd say it depend on the details of how serious the vulnerability is,
how easy it is to exploit and how hard it is to fix. I am not
On 2/28/20 11:28 PM, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote:
> Mark Sapiro writes:
>
> > Well, Steve channeled me earlier, so I'll return the favor.
>
> And did it with extreme precision and accuracy. Sorry if I created
> any misunderstandings.
None whatsoever, at least not from me ;)
--
Mark Sapiro
On Thu, 2020-02-27 at 14:51 -0500, Bill Cole wrote:
> On 27 Feb 2020, at 14:24, Jim Popovitch via Mailman-Users wrote:
>
> > Personally, I'd like to see the GNU Mailman project have a formal
> > Mailman 2.3 release that supports Python3, I feel that there would be
> > a
> > lot of support for
On Sat, 2020-02-29 at 16:28 +0900, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote:
> Mark Sapiro writes:
>
> > Well, Steve channeled me earlier, so I'll return the favor.
>
> And did it with extreme precision and accuracy. Sorry if I created
> any misunderstandings.
>
> The only thing I have to add is that
Mark Sapiro writes:
> Well, Steve channeled me earlier, so I'll return the favor.
And did it with extreme precision and accuracy. Sorry if I created
any misunderstandings.
The only thing I have to add is that mailman-users@python.org is not
going away. Furthermore, I expect that Mark and I,
Phil Stracchino writes:
> On 2020-02-28 05:44, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote:
> > str in Python 1, and the history of Mailman as an MLM for an American
> > rock band (who needs no steekin' accents, we just hammer and bend the
> > strings!)
>
> This is clearly a story I didn't know. :) And
Brian Carpenter writes:
> On 2/28/20 1:55 PM, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> > Quite a few core settings are not exposed in Postorius but we're
> > chipping away at that.
>
> Is there a list somewhere to see what core settings have not been
> exposed in Postorius yet?
Implicit in the Postorius UI
@mailman-users
I'm going to get into a lot of design here, so I'm moving the thread to
mailman-develop...@python.org. Reply-To set; please respect. Brian
kept in Reply-To as a courtesy, don't know if he's subscribed over there.
@mailman-developers Brian is planning to develop an alternative web
On 2/28/20 1:55 PM, Mark Sapiro wrote:
Quite a few core settings are not exposed in Postorius but we're
chipping away at that.
Is there a list somewhere to see what core settings have not been
exposed in Postorius yet?
--
Please let me know if you need further assistance.
Thank you for
On 2/28/20 10:24 AM, Jim Popovitch via Mailman-Users wrote:
>
> I think that is Brian's and a lot of other people's concern. 3 years to
> implement something into MM3 that was a core feature in MM2. I realize
> this next question is going to sound bombastic, I assure you it's not
> meant that
On Fri, 2020-02-28 at 10:07 -0800, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> On 2/28/20 6:17 AM, Jim Popovitch via Mailman-Users wrote:
> > On Fri, 2020-02-28 at 19:52 +0900, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote:
> > > Brian Carpenter writes:
> > >
> > > > I have hired a professional PHP developer to begin work on a new
> > >
On 2/28/20 6:17 AM, Jim Popovitch via Mailman-Users wrote:
> On Fri, 2020-02-28 at 19:52 +0900, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote:
>> Brian Carpenter writes:
>>
>> > I have hired a professional PHP developer to begin work on a new
>> > admin/forum interface for Mailman 3.
>>
>> Too bad. I really
On 2/28/20 5:52 AM, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote:
Too bad. I really sympathize with your goals but am unlikely to be
able to contribute directly to implementation (assuming an eventual
open-sourcing). Never learned PHP, not going to do it anytime soon.
That's OK, the point of REST is so*you*
On 2020-02-28 05:44, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote:
> Mailman has the opposite problem. We *wish* str was Unicode from the
> get-go, but it wasn't, and Mailman 2 is rife with potential encoded/
> decoded confusion because of the nature of email and the dual usage of
> str in Python 1, and the history
On Fri, 2020-02-28 at 19:52 +0900, Stephen J. Turnbull wrote:
> Brian Carpenter writes:
>
> > I have hired a professional PHP developer to begin work on a new
> > admin/forum interface for Mailman 3.
>
> Too bad. I really sympathize with your goals but am unlikely to be
> able to contribute
Brian Carpenter writes:
> I have hired a professional PHP developer to begin work on a new
> admin/forum interface for Mailman 3.
Too bad. I really sympathize with your goals but am unlikely to be
able to contribute directly to implementation (assuming an eventual
open-sourcing). Never
Phil Stracchino writes:
> Rewriting without breaking is hard.
True.
> There is a Python framework called Twisted.
Not an example appropriate to Mailman, though. The Twisted people were
doing amazing things with str, to which Unicode was irrelevant, because
their job was to shovel bytes from
On 2/27/20 8:01 PM, Mark Sapiro wrote:
>> Bounce processing will still not be available for new users of Mailman
>> which is my big concern. I assume new lists will have to have those
>> settings adjusted via the Mailman shell?
>
> Sure it will. All the settings have reasonable defaults just like
On 2/27/20 5:01 PM, Mark Sapiro wrote:
>
> True, until they are exposed in some list admin UI they will need to be
> set via mailman shell or the REST API, ...
That is IF they need to be changed from the default.
--
Mark Sapiro The highway is for gamblers,
San Francisco Bay Area,
On 2/27/20 3:09 PM, Brian Carpenter wrote:
>
> Bounce processing will still not be available for new users of Mailman
> which is my big concern. I assume new lists will have to have those
> settings adjusted via the Mailman shell?
Sure it will. All the settings have reasonable defaults just
On 2/27/20 5:30 PM, Mark Sapiro wrote:
I don't know why Mailman 3's DMARC mitigation is considered improved
over Mailman 2.1. It's the same. The Settings and Postorius UI for them
are more logical than MM 2.1, but they ultimately boil down to the same
things.
The latest Mailman core (not yet
On 2/27/20 1:37 PM, Brian Carpenter wrote:
Brian makes a number of good points. I just have a couple of
remarks/questions.
> 5. MM3 DMARC handling seems to have improved from reviews I have seen
> but NO BOUNCE PROCESSING.
I don't know why Mailman 3's DMARC mitigation is considered improved
On 2/27/20 2:44 PM, Mark Sapiro wrote:
I
have said before that a much better use of time and resources would be
the implementation of a light weight, non-Django web UI for Mailman 3,
but I don't see anyone raising a hand to do either.
Let me be more clearer on this.
I have hired a
On 2/27/20 3:40 PM, Brian Carpenter wrote:
>> If you want to port Mailman 2 to Python 3, you are welcome to do it. I
>> have said before that a much better use of time and resources would be
>> the implementation of a light weight, non-Django web UI for Mailman 3,
>> but I don't see anyone raising
On 2/27/20 2:44 PM, Mark Sapiro wrote:
If you want to port Mailman 2 to Python 3, you are welcome to do it. I
have said before that a much better use of time and resources would be
the implementation of a light weight, non-Django web UI for Mailman 3,
but I don't see anyone raising a hand to do
On 2/27/20 2:08 PM, Phil Stracchino wrote:
...
> What has this yielded?
>
> "Most of the most commonly used parts" of Twisted are now Python 3
> compatible.
I hear this how upgrading any django installation from one python-3
version to another python-3 version usually goes. I.e. long-term, at
On 2020-02-27 14:51, Bill Cole wrote:
> On 27 Feb 2020, at 14:24, Jim Popovitch via Mailman-Users wrote:
>
>> Personally, I'd like to see the GNU Mailman project have a formal
>> Mailman 2.3 release that supports Python3, I feel that there would be
>> a
>> lot of support for that.
>
> I'm sure
On 27 Feb 2020, at 14:24, Jim Popovitch via Mailman-Users wrote:
Personally, I'd like to see the GNU Mailman project have a formal
Mailman 2.3 release that supports Python3, I feel that there would be
a
lot of support for that.
I'm sure there would be widespread applause and congratulations
On 2/27/20 11:24 AM, Jim Popovitch via Mailman-Users wrote:
>
> Who decides that there will be no more releases of MM2 from the GNU
> Mailman project?
I do. I am the release manager and the only one making releases so I get
to decide.
> I've got to be honest, Mailman 3 still looks unstable
On Thu, 2020-02-27 at 10:56 -0800, Mark Sapiro wrote:
> for Mailman 3, but that seems unduly kludgy. There won't be any change
> in Mailman 2.1 which is only waiting for i18n updates for the final
> 2.1.30 release which will be the last release from the GNU Mailman project.
Who decides that there
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