This and other RFCs are available on the web at
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=head1 TITLE
Class Collections: Provide the ability to overload classes
=head1 VERSION
Maintainer: Greg Williams <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: 17 Sep 2000
Last Modified: 1 Oct 2000
Mailing List: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
On Sun, 1 Oct 2000 15:57:33 -0400, Adam Turoff <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>David, please take your conspiracies elsewhere. We've all heard
>them before and they are not germane to the Perl6 brainstorming
>process we find ourselves in right now.
Comrade Adam,
your behavior is in violation of di
Stephen Zander wrote:
> David> This country (apologies to non-US citizens) was not founded
> David> on committee action, but on rebellion.
>
> I hope the irony of a proponent of non-profit motives holding up a
> rebellion that was exclusively profit-motive based in support of their
> argu
On Sun, Oct 01, 2000 at 02:00:20PM -0500, J. David Blackstone wrote:
> While POD hasn't changed for several years, the QA group has a
> couple of ideas in the works to morph it in desireable ways that might
> be easier if POD were replaced with an XML DTD.
^
On Sunday, October 01, 2000 8:51 PM, Bradley M. Kuhn [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] wrote:
> Stephen Zander wrote:
> > > "David" == David Grove <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> > David> This country (apologies to non-US citizens) was not founded
> > David> on committee action, but on rebellion.
Stephen Zander wrote:
> > "David" == David Grove <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
> David> This country (apologies to non-US citizens) was not founded
> David> on committee action, but on rebellion.
> I hope the irony of a proponent of non-profit motives holding up a
> rebellion that was
> "David" == David Grove <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes:
David> This country (apologies to non-US citizens) was not founded
David> on committee action, but on rebellion.
I hope the irony of a proponent of non-profit motives holding up a
rebellion that was exclusively profit-motive based i
Nathan Torkington wrote:
> Adam Turoff writes:
> > From this point forward, no new RFCs will be accepted until the RFC
> > submission process is reopened. Any new RFCs that are submitted
> > during this review phase will be held in limbo until new submissions
> > start up again.
> When were you
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=head1 TITLE
A Trademark on Perl Should be Acquired in Larry Wall's Name
=head1 VERSION
Maintainer: Bradley M. Kuhn <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: 30 Sep 2000
Last Modified: 1 Oct 2000
Mailing List: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
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=head1 TITLE
Regex assertions in plain Perl code
=head1 VERSION
Maintainer: Bart Lateur <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: 28 Sep 2000
Last Modified: 1 Oct 2000
Mailing List: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Number: 348
Version: 2
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=head1 TITLE
Perl6's License Should be (GPL|Artistic-2.0)
=head1 VERSION
Maintainer: Bradley M. Kuhn <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: 29 Sep 2000
Last Modified: 1 Oct 2000
Mailing List: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Number: 346
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=head1 TITLE
Elements of @_ should be read-only by default
=head1 VERSION
Maintainer: John Tobey <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: 28 Sep 2000
Last Modified: 1 Oct 2000
Mailing List: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Number: 344
Ve
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=head1 TITLE
Common attribute system to allow user-defined, extensible attributes
=head1 VERSION
Maintainer: Nathan Wiger <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: 28 Sep 2000
Last Modified: 1 Oct 2000
Mailing List: [EMAIL PROT
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=head1 TITLE
Regex: Make /$/ equivalent to /\z/ under the '/s' modifier
=head1 VERSION
Maintainer: Bart Lateur <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: 28 Sep 2000
Last Modified: 1 Oct 2000
Mailing List: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Nu
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=head1 TITLE
Generalised Additions to Regexs
=head1 VERSION
Maintainer: Richard Proctor <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: 22 Sep 2000
Last Modified: 1 Oct 2000
Mailing List: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Number: 274
Version: 2
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=head1 TITLE
Boolean Regexes
=head1 VERSION
Maintainer: Richard Proctor <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: 6 Sep 2000
Last Modified: 1 Oct 2000
Mailing List: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Number: 198
Version: 3
Status: Frozen
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=head1 TITLE
Alternative lists and quoting of things
=head1 VERSION
Maintainer: Richard Proctor <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: 27 Aug 2000
Last Modified: 1 Oct 2000
Mailing List: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Number: 166
Ve
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=head1 TITLE
Heredoc contents
=head1 VERSION
Maintainer: Richard Proctor <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: 27 Aug 2000
Last Modified: 1 Oct 2000
Mailing List: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Number: 162
Version: 2
Status: Froze
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=head1 TITLE
Assignment within a regex
=head1 VERSION
Maintainer: Richard Proctor <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: 16 Aug 2000
Last Modified: 1 Oct 2000
Mailing List: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Number: 112
Version: 4
Sta
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=head1 TITLE
Examples encoded with =also for|begin|end POD commands
=head1 VERSION
Maintainer: Barrie Slaymaker <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: 2 Aug 2000
Last Modified: 1 Oct 2000
Mailing List: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Nu
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=head1 TITLE
A Base Class for Exception Objects
=head1 VERSION
Maintainer: Tony Olekshy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: 12 Aug 2000
Last Modified: 1 Oct 2000
Mailing List: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Number: 96
Version: 2
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=head1 TITLE
Extensible Meta-Object Protocol
=head1 VERSION
Maintainer: Tony Olekshy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: 11 Aug 2000
Last Modified: 1 Oct 2000
Mailing List: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Number: 92
Version: 2
St
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=head1 TITLE
Omnibus Structured Exception/Error Handling Mechanism
=head1 VERSION
Maintainer: Tony Olekshy <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: 8 Aug 2000
Last Modified: 1 Oct 2000
Mailing List: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Num
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=head1 TITLE
Immediate subroutines
=head1 VERSION
Maintainer: Jean-Louis Leroy
Date: 4 Aug 2000
Last Modified: 1 Oct 2000
Mailing List: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Number: 18
Version: 2
Status: Frozen
=head1 ABSTRA
On Sun, Oct 01, 2000 at 03:39:51PM -0400, Adam Turoff wrote:
> I think POD's list handling is full of warts, but what follows
> is much better than HTML/DocBook itemized lists:
For me, they're about the same.
Actually, I'd rather read an XHTML/HTML itemized list than a POD one;
they both look ug
Adam Turoff writes:
> From this point forward, no new RFCs will be accepted until the RFC
> submission process is reopened. Any new RFCs that are submitted
> during this review phase will be held in limbo until new submissions
> start up again.
When were you thinking the RFC process would reopen
At 04:53 PM 10/1/00 -0400, Dan Sugalski wrote:
>At 11:33 AM 10/1/00 -0700, Peter Scott wrote:
>>But, setting aside my visceral reaction to changing array bases, you have
>>precisely the same problem here that has scuppered my intent to file an
>>RFC for hashes with fixed keys; how do you apply t
The time for brainstorming about what Perl6 can/should be is coming
to a close. As Nat posted recently, we are now entering a two week
review period in anticipation of Larry's language design.
>From this point forward, no new RFCs will be accepted until the RFC
submission process is reopened.
Jeremy Howard wrote:
>
> I haven't got around to RFCing the more generic version (that all attributes
> are inherited inside nested data types), but that would certainly be a nice
> approach.
Not to confuse, let's call it cascading instead of inheritance.
--
John Porter
Nicholas Clark wrote:
>
> No-one ever did suggest adding « and » to the list of matched delimiters
> that q() etc support, did they? :-)
Yes, Larry did. Though not here, not recently.
Sorry I don't have a reference.
--
John Porter
I just froze the RFC that contains Artistic-2.0.
Here are the differences between beta3 and beta4 of the Artistic License.
I did the following things:
* clarified the "In addition," confusion that Dave brought up.
* Returned to saying "Freely Available" instead of "Exact License of". I
On Sun, 1 Oct 2000 22:24:12 +0100, Tim Bunce wrote:
>FWIW, I agree entirely with Randal here.
How do you prove that you're not paranoid, that "they" are really after
you? How do you prove that putting aluminum foil on your head really
helps?
You can't.
That said, I can only say one thing: if y
On 30 Sep 2000, Perl6 RFC Librarian wrote:
>The syntax should be something like the current C
>directives, possibly something like:
> use sandbox 'fs' (. => ALLOW_SUBDIRS | ALLOW_READ |
> ALLOW_READ | ALLOW_CLOBBER);
That should read
| use sandbox 'fs' (. => ALLOW_S
Ilya Zakharevich wrote:
> On Sun, Oct 01, 2000 at 08:51:04AM +1100, Jeremy Howard wrote:
> > Please no! Anything that makes it harder to write 'quick-and-dirty'
scripts
> > is never going to fly--this is part of what makes Perl special.
>
> Why? I see no problem in making -Mstrict and -Wall the d
David Grove wrote:
> >(b) ensure that the installation of Your non-source Modified Version
> >does not conflict in any way with an installation of the Standard
> >Version, include for each program installed by the Modified
> >Version clear documentation
In RFC353, I totally missed some of the problems with implementation. In
fact, what may actually be needed (with shared library code, in
particular) is that using the sandbox system causes a fork, and then the
child is ptrace()d by the parent perl process. This of course traps every
possible syste
David Grove wrote:
> No, no. Don't misunderstand. I'm in _favor_ of ActiveState making a profit
> and selling this other software. What I'm looking to prohibit is the
> proprietarization of perl itself. Making tools that use perl helps the
> community, even if those products are commercial. Propr
> No conspiracy could be that well-oiled. Someone would have leaked it
> by now.
The community has been leaking like a sieve since July 1998. Want a complete
list?
> It's possible you're speaking of one or more of the working group chairs,
> in which case your criticism may well be valid. This, though, is one of the
> cases where you may need to cope (as a volunteer project one needs to work
> with what's available). You can also speak to folks a step or two
On Sun, Oct 01, 2000 at 08:51:04AM +1100, Jeremy Howard wrote:
> > > A prototypeless-function call.
> > >
> > get rid of them all!!
>
> Please no! Anything that makes it harder to write 'quick-and-dirty' scripts
> is never going to fly--this is part of what makes Perl special.
Why? I see no pro
On Sun, Oct 01, 2000 at 12:14:49PM -0500, David Grove wrote:
> [...] I've no idea why Sarathy was deposed,
He wasn't.
> but I have a
> pretty big suspicion.
And a pretty big, well known problem with ActiveState.
> The problem is, I love Sarathy too. He's a hero,
Yes, he's pretty heroic.
> =head1 CHANGES
>
> Comments received have been that it would be better to use AUTOSCALAR,
> AUTOHASH etc instead of AUTOGLOB in the interests of encapsulation.
> The argument being that if you only want to implement AUTO scalars in
> your program, then doing:
>
> C # do some stuff
> }
> Something's gotta budge. I do not want to pay for the privilege of using a
> free
> language, and the "elite" need a damn good spaking to learn some manners to
> newbies (for at least the sake of advocacy) and people who don't use their
> own
> OS/Computer/Platform.
Being a Perl community new
Peter Buckingham wrote:
>
> but i did a quick check and there is a visio style program that is covered
> by the GPL
> Dia (http://www.lysator.liu.se/~alla/dia/)
>
> i have not used it, but it may be simpler than just doing everything from
> scratch in xfig.
Thanks for the link, Peter. I
Okay, followups to this belong in -meta (alas Eudora doesn't let you set
reply-to's, or I would), so if everyone would, please?
At 12:14 PM 10/1/00 -0500, David Grove wrote:
>On Sunday, October 01, 2000 4:02 PM, Jean-Louis Leroy [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
>wrote:
> > > The Perl-KGB-elite has got t
Bart Lateur wrote:
>
> You don't declare Perl arrays. They just exist. Well... except for my'ed
> arrays.
>
> My idea is that if anybody sets $[ to 1 in a script, all accesses to
> array in that script would use 1 as the index of the very first item:
> $ary[1]. But if you pass this array (for ex
On Sun, 01 Oct 2000 18:43:27 +0100, Hugo wrote:
>:This makes the implementation very tricky. I
>:wouldn't be surprised if precisely this feature is the main reason why
>:the current implementation is so notoriously unstable.
>
>I'm not aware of any instability caused by this. The instability is
>
Frank Tobin wrote:
>
> As covered, I'm worried POD will continually outgrow its original design,
> and become messier and messier.
I'd be interested to know what has caused you to be concerned about this.
>From what I can tell, the pod spec itself has changed very little over
the years; only the
At 09:56 AM 10/1/00 -0500, David Grove wrote:
>Part of Perl's problems, a severe internal problem that has external (user
>side) consequences, is that Perl does *not* have anyone to speak policy with,
Yes, it does, as much as any piece of software can. For language issues
there's Larry. For inte
At 11:01 PM 10/1/00 +0200, Jean-Louis Leroy wrote:
>Personally I'm very concerned about the 'every RFC should have an
>implementation section' near-requirement.
This, I'll agree, is going over the top. It's a good requirement, since it
means people *must* think hard about how a feature will be b
On Sunday, October 01, 2000 4:02 PM, Jean-Louis Leroy [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
wrote:
> > The Perl-KGB-elite has got to go, and a free republic must replace
> > it.
>
> I wouldn't go as far as your entire post, neither in form nor content,
> but I do have concerns about the sociopsycho(patho)logy
I am in the process of drafting a proposal, and have at a minimum split the
thread. However, thank you for pointing out which list this should go in. I'll
redirect further messages there.
On Sunday, October 01, 2000 11:56 AM, Nathan Torkington [SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]]
wrote:
> It's valid to wa
In <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Bart Lateur writes:
:Likely the most justifiable to want to be able to execute Perl code in a
>> reason
:This makes the implementation very tricky. I
:wouldn't be surprised if precisely this feature is the main reason why
:the current implementation
At 05:17 PM 9/30/00 -0700, Damien Neil wrote:
>On Fri, Sep 29, 2000 at 07:24:38PM -0400, Dan Sugalski wrote:
> > > $foo = """Things like ', ", and \ have no special meaning in here.""";
> >
> > Argh! *NO*! That way lies madness, or at least DCL's quoting mania. My
> > record, in a command proced
Bart Lateur wrote:
>
> On 1 Oct 2000 06:48:11 -, Perl6 RFC Librarian wrote:
>
> >-r freadable()
> >-R Freadable()
>
> This still doesn't sound like an improvement. I can remember that -r
> stands for readable, but the difference between -r and -R is very
> obscure. How to remember
It's valid to want to change the cultural makeup of perl6, but the
-language list is not the place for it. Try perl6-meta, and please
make concrete proposals. I see this "p5p sucks, we need something
better" as pointless unless there are definite ideas of what would
be better.
Nat
> The Perl-KGB-elite has got to go, and a free republic must replace
> it.
I wouldn't go as far as your entire post, neither in form nor content,
but I do have concerns about the sociopsycho(patho)logy of the Perl
community.
Personally I'm very concerned about the 'every RFC should have an
imple
Realize that you are trying to convince a group who uses POD at the command
line (no, not everybody) to use a complete markup language. We're talking about
self-commenting code, sir, not a strict documentation system with indices and
the likes in any formal sense. Even if a documentation system
I'm afraid I had a family crisis yesterday, else another RFC would have been
submitted.
Part of Perl's problems, a severe internal problem that has external (user
side) consequences, is that Perl does *not* have anyone to speak policy with,
while the community itself is submerged in issues of
Adam Turoff, at 03:22 -0400 on Sun, 1 Oct 2000, wrote:
> POD has three mighty significant advantages over XML:
> - it is easy to learn
True, but XML is also easy to learn, and is more in-line with what the
user will probably already know, as covered in the RFC.
> - it is to write
True, bu
At 10:10 PM 9/30/00 +0200, Bart Lateur wrote:
>On Wed, 27 Sep 2000 16:56:37 -0400, Dan Sugalski wrote:
>
> >My gut feel is that there'll be a "default encoding" for filehandles and we
> >*won't* try and get clever.
>
>My gut feeling says that the text read from file should be treated as
>native te
=head1 TITLE
Regex assertions in plain Perl code
=head1 VERSION
Maintainer: Bart Lateur <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: 28 Sep 2000
Mailing List: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Number: 348
Version: 2
Status: Developing (candidate for freeze)
=head1 ABSTRACT
Likely the most justifiable reason to wa
On Sunday, October 01, 2000 1:14 AM, Perl6 RFC Librarian
[SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] wrote:
> This and other RFCs are available on the web at
> http://dev.perl.org/rfc/
>
> =head1 TITLE
>
> Extend regex syntax to provide for return of a hash of matched subpatterns
This doesn't make much sense. Re
On Sunday, October 01, 2000 1:37 AM, Perl6 RFC Librarian
[SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] wrote:
> This and other RFCs are available on the web at
> http://dev.perl.org/rfc/
>
> =head1 TITLE
>
> Improvement needed in error messages (both internal errors and die function).
Feel free to put anything you
On Sunday, October 01, 2000 1:38 AM, Perl6 RFC Librarian
[SMTP:[EMAIL PROTECTED]] wrote:
> This and other RFCs are available on the web at
> http://dev.perl.org/rfc/
>
> =head1 TITLE
>
> Allow multiply matched groups in regexes to return a listref of all matches
>
> =head1 VERSION
>
> Maintai
=head1 TITLE
Regex: Make /$/ equivalent to /\z/ under the '/s' modifier
=head1 VERSION
Maintainer: Bart Lateur <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
Date: 1 Oct 2000
Mailing List: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
Number: 332
Version: 2
Status: Developing (redraft)
=head1 ABSTRACT
To most Perlers, /$/ in a regex s
On Sun, 01 Oct 2000 11:18:58 +0200, Bart Lateur wrote:
> my @a = split /:/, "", -1;
Oops. that should be
my @a = split /:/, $_, -1;
--
Bart.
On 1 Oct 2000 06:40:08 -, Perl6 RFC Librarian wrote:
>Perl 5 split does five things that I think are just annoying, and
>which I suggest be removed:
I've got one more problem.
for my $i (0 .. 4) {
$_ = ':' x $i;
my @a = split /:/, "", -1;
my $coun
On Thu, 28 Sep 2000 23:54:20 +0100, Hugo wrote:
>I still like the idea of $$, as I described it in the original thread.
>I've seen no comments for or against at this time.
I intend to put this in the RFC:
Hugo prefers to add an alternative, like /$$/, wich would behave like
this. But an al
On 1 Oct 2000 06:26:40 -, Perl6 RFC Librarian wrote:
>If you did the following:
>
>C<"Bilbo Baggins" =~ /((\w+)\s+(\w+))/>
>
>Then @/ would contain the following:
>
>C<$/[0]> the compiled equivalent of C,
>
>C<$/[1]> the string "Bilbo Baggins"
>
>C<$/[2]> the string "Bilbo"
>
>C<$/[3]> the s
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