Just a few short replies, and then I'll leave everyone alone:
1. You're right. The Court doesn't resolve the child-labor issue. It
just said the issue was different. For myself, I have trouble believing the
Court is going to let a 13-year-old kid work 40 hours a week for a church, even
Setting aside the discussion of Hosanna-Tabor and RFRA for a moment, the
initial question was about where a person “has a right to be.” As it happens,
Virginia has a church trespass statute (Va. Code. § 18.2-128), which provides,
"It shall be unlawful for any person, whether or not a church memb
A few replies to Chris:
1. The Court never says in Hosanna-Tabor that "churches have no immunity
from child-labor laws." Please read that section of the opinion again
(page 21 of the pdf version). It explicitly concludes: "The case before us
is an employment discrimination suit brought on behal
Anyway, to return to my original question, how would this work out under RFRA,
it seems that there is no substantial burden on religious exercise unless the
church in question considers uncovered breast feeding immodest under its
religious teachings. Then, is uncovered breast feeding a compellin
Chip and I agree on a lot of this, so I’ll try to make this short:
“Chris says this is a matter of church freedom, which it is, but then he has to
face the question of why isn't every question a church decides a matter of
church freedom (no balancing, and the church always wins).”
True. There
Thanks for the kind words, Marty. Now look at your formulation: "We [the
state] *accept* your word that nursing women are not 'entitled' to worship
as a matter of religious precepts. We will not second-guess that
ecclesiastical question. Nevertheless, we have concluded that the
nondiscrimination
I don’t know whether anything rides on this in terms of results—maybe there is
no need to get into it—but I think Hosanna-Tabor is just as much about the
rights of religious organizations as it is about judicial competence.
Hosanna-Tabor says, quoting Kedroff, that “[t]he Constitution guarantees
I think Chip and Bob's article is probably the best thing yet written about
H-T, or at least it makes the best sense of the opinion. As Chip knows,
however, I am uneasy, not about whether they've accurately captured what
the Chief was getting at (or what he must have been getting at), but about
ju
Neither Eugene not Steven has made any attempt to state the principle for
which Hosanna-Tabor stands. It certainly does not stand for a broad and
free floating principle of church autonomy, subject to some balancing
test. It does not assert that broad principle, and it explicitly eschews
any bala
Eugene clearly reads Hosanna-Tabor far more broadly than I do.
--
Prof. Steven D. Jamar
Assoc. Dir. of International Programs
Institute for Intellectual Property and Social Justice
http://iipsj.org
http://sdjlaw.org
"Whenever you find yourself on the side of the majority, it
My class discussed this problem of government funding of parochial schools
yesterday. Most retreated to the simplistic model of “don’t take the money if
you don’t want the conditions,” which isn’t very reflective about the deeper
and longer-term issues involved in financial interdependence be
If I’m right that Hosanna-Tabor applies, wouldn’t the church
just have a categorical right to exclude members or attendees, notwithstanding
any antidiscrimination law, just as it has a categorical right to dismiss
clergy notwithstanding any discrimination law – even without a sho
I assume freedom of association would protect a church in selecting its
membership. And I assume Hosanna-Tabor would protect religion-driven decorum
decisions like separate seating for men and women in synagogues and mosques.
But this is just a case of people being uncomfortable — not a
religiou
1. Does the principle underlying Hosanna-Tabor extend to
churches excluding members (or visitors) based on race, sex, religion, etc.? I
assume it would, which is why, for instance, Orthodox synagogues could have
separate seating for men and women, Nation of Islam events could b
If RFRA applied to the state, or if Virginia had a state RFRA that copied the
federal RFRA, would this state law be legal?
Virginia law provides that a woman can breast feed uncovered anywhere she has a
legal right to be. Can a church then exclude her because breast feeding
uncovered might make
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