Re: [Sursound] Sony PCM? (was Re: DTS Headphone:X)

2013-05-02 Thread Richard
Pretty much the 'Holy Grail' of audio.I can't ever imagine there being a software solution for those noise reduction systems as they were very level sensitive... but i'd be really happy if i could be proven wrong.. Not long ago I made an extensive search for software that would do at le

Re: [Sursound] Sony PCM? (was Re: DTS Headphone:X)

2013-05-02 Thread Eero Aro
Not long ago I made an extensive search for software that would do at least decoding of tape noise reduction systems. Practically nothing found, no convolution based or VST:s. No Dolby, no DBX, not even versions of single-ended analog NR, such as Philips DNL. An earlier version of the Stereo Tool

Re: [Sursound] Sony PCM? (was Re: DTS Headphone:X)

2013-05-01 Thread Richard Dobson
On 01/05/2013 23:52, Sampo Syreeni wrote: ... Still, do give me your definition of time-invariant. Perhaps there are stronger definitions I haven't heard of yet, and which can be useful in e.g. more fine grained analysis. I have always understood it to mean that the behaviour is not depe

Re: [Sursound] Sony PCM? (was Re: DTS Headphone:X)

2013-05-01 Thread Sampo Syreeni
On 2013-05-01, Fons Adriaensen wrote: As a technical nitpick, they are too: if you just shift a signal in time, the output will be a shifted version of the original. That corresponds to a very weak definition of 'time-invariant'... I didn't think there could be but one: either it varies in t

Re: [Sursound] Sony PCM? (was Re: DTS Headphone:X)

2013-05-01 Thread Fons Adriaensen
On Thu, May 02, 2013 at 01:28:40AM +0300, Sampo Syreeni wrote: > In this vein the starting point prolly would be the Moog ladder, in > its nonlinear region. It's hideously complex for such a charming > little thing. It's a real gem of analog design. But at least in this case the dependene on the

Re: [Sursound] Sony PCM? (was Re: DTS Headphone:X)

2013-05-01 Thread Sampo Syreeni
On 2013-05-01, Fons Adriaensen wrote: The diode is not 'perfect', it will have some voltage drop depending on the current flowing in it. The result may well be 'desirable', i.e. in practice better than what would be obtained by using a 'perfect' diode. Perhaps the nastiest commonly used exam

Re: [Sursound] Sony PCM? (was Re: DTS Headphone:X)

2013-05-01 Thread Fons Adriaensen
On Thu, May 02, 2013 at 12:46:36AM +0300, Sampo Syreeni wrote: > As a technical nitpick, they are too: if you just shift a signal in > time, the output will be a shifted version of the original. That corresponds to a very weak definition of 'time-invariant'... Ciao, -- FA A world of exhausti

Re: [Sursound] Sony PCM? (was Re: DTS Headphone:X)

2013-05-01 Thread Fons Adriaensen
On Wed, May 01, 2013 at 04:29:46PM -0500, David Pickett wrote: > At 16:02 01-05-13, Fons Adriaensen wrote: > > >The difficult part in writing any software emulation of the Dolby-A > >or similar systems is modelling the dynamic behaviour of the compander, > >not the actual audio processing. Such sy

Re: [Sursound] Sony PCM? (was Re: DTS Headphone:X)

2013-05-01 Thread Sampo Syreeni
On 2013-05-01, Fons Adriaensen wrote: The point is that companders such as Dolby-A and Telcom are linear at least over a short time span - they do not introduce distortion. I started thinking about that as well. Yeah, if you put in all possible spectra, in all combinations, at all speeds of c

Re: [Sursound] Sony PCM? (was Re: DTS Headphone:X)

2013-05-01 Thread David Pickett
At 16:02 01-05-13, Fons Adriaensen wrote: >The difficult part in writing any software emulation of the Dolby-A >or similar systems is modelling the dynamic behaviour of the compander, >not the actual audio processing. Such systems will have 'designed' and >documented attack/release times, but ana

Re: [Sursound] Sony PCM? (was Re: DTS Headphone:X)

2013-05-01 Thread Fons Adriaensen
On Wed, May 01, 2013 at 08:02:20PM +0300, Sampo Syreeni wrote: > On 2013-05-01, Dave Hunt wrote: > > >Dolby A (etc.) decode. Would it not be possible to to do this with > >convolution ?? Find a working unit, record its impulse response, > >use that in one of the many convolution reverb/filter plug

Re: [Sursound] Sony PCM? (was Re: DTS Headphone:X)

2013-05-01 Thread Sampo Syreeni
On 2013-05-01, Dave Hunt wrote: Dolby A (etc.) decode. Would it not be possible to to do this with convolution ?? Find a working unit, record its impulse response, use that in one of the many convolution reverb/filter plug-ins. Unfortunately this is not an option. Convolution can be used to m

Re: [Sursound] Sony PCM? (was Re: DTS Headphone:X)

2013-05-01 Thread Dave Hunt
effect (e.g. on backing vocals). Obviously the Dolby reference level would have to be taken into account. Apologies if this is a completely hare-brained idea. Dave Hunt Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2013 21:56:30 -0500 From: David Pickett Subject: Re: [Sursound] Sony PCM? (was Re: DTS Headphone:X) A

Re: [Sursound] Sony PCM? (was Re: DTS Headphone:X)

2013-04-30 Thread Dave Malham
True, the patent and JAES article are as usual not the full story. The only problem with the second user stuff is whether the thing itself is working properly. Access to a test rig would be useful - never used the 363 but I've had a lot of experience with the earlier 361 unit which uses the CAT 22

Re: [Sursound] Sony PCM? (was Re: DTS Headphone:X)

2013-04-30 Thread Eric Benjamin
On 30 Apr 2013, at 04:56, David Pickett wrote: > A standalone Windows app that would decode Dolby-A encoded wavefiles and > output >a restored non-Dolby 24-bit wavefile would be most useful. I have several >recordings that I have had transfer to hi-res files still in Dolby-A format. > ... even

Re: [Sursound] Sony PCM? (was Re: DTS Headphone:X)

2013-04-29 Thread Kees de Visser
On 30 Apr 2013, at 04:56, David Pickett wrote: > A standalone Windows app that would decode Dolby-A encoded wavefiles and > output a restored non-Dolby 24-bit wavefile would be most useful. I have > several recordings that I have had transfer to hi-res files still in Dolby-A > format. > > ...

Re: [Sursound] Sony PCM? (was Re: DTS Headphone:X)

2013-04-29 Thread David Pickett
At 12:37 29-04-13, Kees de Visser wrote: >Great idea though (same for a software Dolby A/SR decoder, which isn't >avaialble AFAIK). A standalone Windows app that would decode Dolby-A encoded wavefiles and output a restored non-Dolby 24-bit wavefile would be most useful. I have several recordi

Re: [Sursound] Sony PCM? (was Re: DTS Headphone:X)

2013-04-29 Thread David Pickett
At 11:34 29-04-13, Dave Malham wrote: >It is possible but I wasn't at all sure that it wasn't the ceramic >resonator used in the oscillator. What mechanism causes deterioration in one of these? David ___ Sursound mailing list Sursound@music.vt.edu ht

Re: [Sursound] Sony PCM? (was Re: DTS Headphone:X)

2013-04-29 Thread Sampo Syreeni
On 2013-04-29, Dave Malham wrote: Pretty certain it could be done with an ARM with C or C++ these days. Yes, though the data rate of the incoming video stream is a bit steep (20-30MB/s), so that you need a rather muscular DSP to keep up, and you probably won't want to go the easiest way whic

Re: [Sursound] Sony PCM? (was Re: DTS Headphone:X)

2013-04-29 Thread Dave Malham
Hi, It would have been difficult "in t'owld days" using dsp's with their (then) very small memories and the requirement to use assembler because of the general lack of high performance high level language compilers. Pretty certain it could be done with an ARM with C or C++ these days. However, it

Re: [Sursound] Sony PCM? (was Re: DTS Headphone:X)

2013-04-29 Thread Kees de Visser
On 29 Apr 2013, at 18:42, umashankar manthravadi wrote: > many years ago, I tried to convince people it is worth producing a software > PCM F-1 decoder, using a low cost video card and a a VHS player (all our PCM > F1 recordings are on VHS). I thought it would be simple, but nobody showed > any

Re: [Sursound] Sony PCM? (was Re: DTS Headphone:X)

2013-04-29 Thread Kees de Visser
FWIW, I've got a few working systems, F1, 601, 701 and two Betamax VCRs (PAL only). The 601 and 701 have a SPDIF output. They are still used in our studio for clients who require transfers. Kees de Visser Galaxy Classics On 29 Apr 2013, at 17:59, Dave Malham wrote: > A few months ago I had to s

Re: [Sursound] Sony PCM? (was Re: DTS Headphone:X)

2013-04-29 Thread Richard Dobson
On 29/04/2013 16:59, Dave Malham wrote: A few months ago I had to sort out a PCM701 with one of my spdif cards in (the ones I used to do for Audio Design). We went through three PCM units before we found one that worked fully in replay mode (the original, one from the Uni and the final one, off E

Re: [Sursound] Sony PCM? (was Re: DTS Headphone:X)

2013-04-29 Thread umashankar manthravadi
100 > From: dave.mal...@york.ac.uk > To: sursound@music.vt.edu > Subject: Re: [Sursound] Sony PCM? (was Re: DTS Headphone:X) > > It is possible but I wasn't at all sure that it wasn't the ceramic > resonator used in the oscillator. Sooner or later we may have to resort

Re: [Sursound] Sony PCM? (was Re: DTS Headphone:X)

2013-04-29 Thread Dave Malham
It is possible but I wasn't at all sure that it wasn't the ceramic resonator used in the oscillator. Sooner or later we may have to resort to writing software to do the job - assuming we can find working Betamax machines. Fortunately the encoding is very well documented in the various manuals, unli

Re: [Sursound] Sony PCM? (was Re: DTS Headphone:X)

2013-04-29 Thread David Pickett
At 10:59 29-04-13, Dave Malham wrote: >A few months ago I had to sort out a PCM701 with one of my spdif cards in >(the ones I used to do for Audio Design). We went through three PCM units >before we found one that worked fully in replay mode (the original, one >from the Uni and the final one, off

Re: [Sursound] Sony PCM? (was Re: DTS Headphone:X)

2013-04-29 Thread Dave Malham
tal outputs, but cricklewood electronics (?) produced a card which >> produced a sdif signal out of the F1 that we are using to convert our pcm >> recordings to wav files without redigitising. umashankar >> > Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2013 15:02:32 +0100 >> > From: richarddob

Re: [Sursound] Sony PCM? (was Re: DTS Headphone:X)

2013-04-29 Thread Dave Malham
s (?) produced a card which > produced a sdif signal out of the F1 that we are using to convert our pcm > recordings to wav files without redigitising. umashankar > > Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2013 15:02:32 +0100 > > From: richarddob...@blueyonder.co.uk > > To: sursound@music.vt.

Re: [Sursound] Sony PCM? (was Re: DTS Headphone:X)

2013-04-29 Thread umashankar manthravadi
produced a sdif signal out of the F1 that we are using to convert our pcm recordings to wav files without redigitising. umashankar > Date: Mon, 29 Apr 2013 15:02:32 +0100 > From: richarddob...@blueyonder.co.uk > To: sursound@music.vt.edu > Subject: [Sursound] Sony PCM? (was Re: DTS

[Sursound] Sony PCM? (was Re: DTS Headphone:X)

2013-04-29 Thread Richard Dobson
On 29/04/2013 11:53, Jon Honeyball wrote: I have a pcm-f1 tape of the Zuccherelli stuff from 30 years ago, for those with long memories. Must pull that into a wav file, but my f1 has no digital output. Hmmm As it happens, I have a Sony PCM-701ES (incl SPDIF) with the CDP digital port adde