On Tue, Oct 22, 2013 at 5:31 AM, Janko Mihelić jan...@gmail.com wrote:
I don't think we really need layers, but could use editors that are
semantically aware of things like boundaries,
and put them in the background until needed.
As far as I see, if we just prevent certain ways or nodes to
Bryce Nesbitt wrote:
I don't think we really need layers, but could use editors that are
semantically aware of things like boundaries,
and put them in the background until needed.
As far as I see, if we just prevent certain ways or nodes to share nodes
with
2013/10/22 Bryce Nesbitt bry...@obviously.com
On Mon, Oct 21, 2013 at 2:11 PM, Johan C osm...@gmail.com wrote:
Essentially what we need is the concept of layers.
I don't think we really need layers, but could use editors that are
semantically aware of things like boundaries,
and put them
Janko Mihelić wrote:
I don't think we really need layers, but could use editors that are
semantically aware of things like boundaries,
and put them in the background until needed.
As far as I see, if we just prevent certain ways or nodes to share nodes with
others, that is as good
On Sat, Oct 19, 2013 at 11:16 PM, Colin Smale colin.sm...@xs4all.nl wrote:
I think it might be easier to define a new boundary/multipolygon relation
per time zone, containing all the boundary ways, in inner and outer roles as
usual.
Or create a relation collecting all
2013/10/22 Janko Mihelić jan...@gmail.com
I don't think we really need layers, but could use editors that are
semantically aware of things like boundaries,
and put them in the background until needed.
As far as I see, if we just prevent certain ways or nodes to share nodes
with others,
On Tue, Oct 22, 2013 at 7:11 AM, Martin Koppenhoefer dieterdre...@gmail.com
wrote:
It really depends on the legal situation, sometimes sharing nodes is the
right thing to do (if the boundary is defined as being the river for
instance), sometimes it is to be seen distinctly (when the boundary
: Re: [OSM-talk] Timezones (was: Deleting data)
Nick, this can be done for admin boundaries as well. Would you advocate
removing them from OSM as well? The change to the size of the planet file if
timezones are included is absolutely microscopic in the big scheme of things.
There are clearly
I'd go the other way and abolish Winter Time. ;-)
No DST = dark summer evenings. Not nice!
Going on topic, not sure if something like time zones belongs in OSM. Would it
not be better to use a more specialised web service to look up time zones for a
given lat/lon? I'd prefer to minimise
Nick, this can be done for admin boundaries as well. Would you advocate
removing them from OSM as well? The change to the size of the planet
file if timezones are included is absolutely microscopic in the big
scheme of things. There are clearly many shades of grey. It's a question
of where to
On Mon, Oct 21, 2013 at 11:19 AM, Colin Smale colin.sm...@xs4all.nl wrote:
The traditional consensus is that anyone can put anything
in OSM
It was only a consensus in the group of contributors thinking that
(which is then easy to reach a consensus).
This remembers me similars discussions about:
Another popular view is that these are problems for the renderer/editor,
not intrinsic issues with the data. sarcasmTag as you see fit and the
renderers/editors will catch up!/sarcasm The fact that coastlines are
difficult to maintain with the current toolset is not an argument to not
have them
Colin Smale wrote:
My point is, gut feelings aside, that it is not reasonable to single out TZ
boundaries for this deprecation.
Actually having accurate TZ boundaries in OSM is probably more important than
some of the political boundaries. The reason I've been looking into this is
simply
2013/10/21 Pieren pier...@gmail.com
It was only a consensus in the group of contributors thinking that
(which is then easy to reach a consensus).
This remembers me similars discussions about:
- hi-res aerial imagery coverage by huge polygons (Yahoo!)
agree that this is not really a datum
I'd go the other way and abolish Winter Time. ;-)
No DST = dark summer evenings. Not nice!
Going on topic, not sure if something like time zones
belongs in OSM. Would it not be better to use a more
specialised web service to look up time zones for a
given lat/lon? I'd prefer to minimise
On Mon, Oct 21, 2013 at 6:29 AM, Colin Smale colin.sm...@xs4all.nl wrote:
Back on topic: how do you phrase an objective rule, or at least
well-worded guidelines, which allow admin boundaries but disallow time zone
boundaries? I wonder where the UK ceremonial counties, fire department
areas,
It is not always possible to separate admin boundaries from real world
features. Rivers, roads or even hedges often define a boundary.
Phil (trigpoint)
--
Sent from my Nokia N9
On 21/10/2013 15:41 Toby Murray wrote:
On Mon, Oct 21, 2013 at 6:29 AM, Colin Smale colin.sm...@xs4all.nl wrote:
On Mon, Oct 21, 2013 at 7:41 AM, Toby Murray toby.mur...@gmail.com wrote:
Having edited over a thousand of them, I would not be sad to see admin
boundaries removed from the general OSM database. I think Russ is on to
something with his ClosedStreetMap concept although that is some terrible
Yes, in that small fraction of cases there would be duplication of
positional data. But in some cases where you think this is the case, it
might actually not be. My county border was defined by a river. Now part of
the river is a reservoir and the other part has shifted over time and
through
On 21 October 2013 16:41, Toby Murray toby.mur...@gmail.com wrote:
Having edited over a thousand of them, I would not be sad to see admin
boundaries removed from the general OSM database. I think Russ is on to
something with his ClosedStreetMap concept although that is some terrible
branding
Essentially what we need is the concept of layers.
Layers do have disadvantages, how to prevent data being mapped in the wrong
layer for instance. I however do see the point that mappers, especially
newbies, break administrative boundaries. If that happens a lot, it might
be easier to 'grey them
Am 21/ott/2013 um 17:09 schrieb Clifford Snow cliff...@snowandsnow.us:
Introducing layers, although difficult to implement, would certainly simplify
editing. Moving admin boundaries and land use polygons to a layer(s) would
simplify basic editing. No more connecting roads to boundaries
On Mon, Oct 21, 2013 at 2:11 PM, Johan C osm...@gmail.com wrote:
Essentially what we need is the concept of layers.
I don't think we really need layers, but could use editors that are
semantically aware of things like boundaries,
and put them in the background until needed.
---
Some
On Tue, Oct 22, 2013 at 7:07 AM, Bryce Nesbitt bry...@obviously.com wrote:
On Mon, Oct 21, 2013 at 2:11 PM, Johan C osm...@gmail.com wrote:
Essentially what we need is the concept of layers.
I don't think we really need layers, but could use editors that are
semantically aware of things
On 19 Oct 2013 09:55, Frederik Ramm frede...@remote.org wrote:
I've recently deleted a large multipolygon that was tagged
timezone=GMT+1 or someting like that. I admit that I haven't actually
gone there to check ;)
The Wikipedia-deletionism-kind would be more like No matter whether this
feature
Hi,
On 10/19/2013 12:04 PM, moltonel 3x Combo wrote:
I'd
love to replace the unwieldy timezone selector of many programs with a
clickable map generated from OSM. So, do timezones really make no sense
in OSM ?
No they make no sense in OSM. Get/make yourself a shape file from
official sources
So how does that differ from admin boundaries? I can survey time zones by
asking a sample of people what the time is. On land at least the timezone
boundaries will correspond to some kind of admin boundary, sometimes at a lower
level than you might expect.
Frederik Ramm frede...@remote.org
On Sat, 2013-10-19 at 12:04 +0200, moltonel 3x Combo wrote:
Actually, I always wondered why timezones were kept out of OSM. I know
DST complicates tagging (it'll be the first thing I abolish when I
become World Dictator), but it seem like a very usefull political
boundary that I'd like to
In the US I believe cities and counties can overrule state time, including DST
rules. This is from memory as I am on the road at the moment though, so I might
be wrong.
Philip Barnes p...@trigpoint.me.uk wrote:
On Sat, 2013-10-19 at 12:04 +0200,
I am slightly confused by
the idea put forward
Hi,
On 10/19/2013 12:56 PM, Colin Smale wrote:
So how does that differ from admin boundaries?
Admin boundaries are:
* generally much more useful than time zone boundaries
* especially, very useful for mapping as they are closely related to
other stuff we map, e.g. a road ref will change at
Hi,
* not useful for mappers
oh, and what about opening_hours, service_times, collection_times ...
those are normally given in the local time of the object being tagged,
maybe users would want to be able to interpret that without having to
use external data sources?
-nik
--
* mirabilos is
* not useful for mappers
oh, and what about opening_hours, service_times, collection_times ...
those are normally given in the local time of the object being tagged,
maybe users would want to be able to interpret that without having to
use external data sources?
Then, the Wiki [1] says to
Frederik Ramm wrote:
Time zones, in contrast, are
* orders of magnitude less useful than admin boundaries (most countries will
simply have one time zone for the whole country)
* not useful for mappers
* readily available in shape file form
so why map them?
Except that the currently available
2013/10/19 Dominik George n...@naturalnet.de
oh, and what about opening_hours, service_times, collection_times ...
those are normally given in the local time of the object being tagged,
usually they aren't in the local time but in the time of the local
timezone. ;-)
Cheers,
Martin
Frederik Ramm writes:
Hi,
On 10/19/2013 12:04 PM, moltonel 3x Combo wrote:
I'd
love to replace the unwieldy timezone selector of many programs with a
clickable map generated from OSM. So, do timezones really make no sense
in OSM ?
No they make no sense in OSM. Get/make
On Sat, 2013-10-19 at 09:28 -0400, Russ Nelson wrote:
Frederik Ramm writes:
Hi,
On 10/19/2013 12:04 PM, moltonel 3x Combo wrote:
I'd
love to replace the unwieldy timezone selector of many programs with a
clickable map generated from OSM. So, do timezones really make no sense
Philip Barnes writes:
So we should not include country, state, principality, county, city,
town, parish boundaries either as unless its an island aren't surveyable
either.
If ClosedStreetMap.com was more than a figment of my imagination we
would store them there, not in OSM, yes.
For
Hi,
Everybody has these rules of thumb about what OSM is and isn't. I
could write a couple of pages with all of my rules about imports.
But, my number one rule is that if there is a individual or group that
want to maintain a specific set of data in OSM (timezones, ancient
rail roads, protected
On Sat, 2013-10-19 at 10:10 -0400, Russ Nelson wrote:
Philip Barnes writes:
So we should not include country, state, principality, county, city,
town, parish boundaries either as unless its an island aren't surveyable
either.
If ClosedStreetMap.com was more than a figment of my
Philip Barnes writes:
On Sat, 2013-10-19 at 10:10 -0400, Russ Nelson wrote:
Philip Barnes writes:
So we should not include country, state, principality, county, city,
town, parish boundaries either as unless its an island aren't surveyable
either.
If ClosedStreetMap.com
On Sat, Oct 19, 2013 at 7:25 AM, Jason Remillard
remillard.ja...@gmail.comwrote:
Everybody has these rules of thumb about what OSM is and isn't. I
could write a couple of pages with all of my rules about imports.
But, my number one rule is that if there is a individual or group that
want to
On Sat, Oct 19, 2013 at 2:24 PM, Dominik George n...@naturalnet.de wrote:
[1]: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:timezone
It's even easier to add the tag on existing countries relations. No
need for extra ways, neither tagging on ways.
Pieren
2013/10/19 Pieren pier...@gmail.com
It's even easier to add the tag on existing countries relations. No
need for extra ways, neither tagging on ways.
+1
Are there any timezones that don't follow country or some other
administrative borders?
Janko
On 2013-10-19 22:38, Pieren wrote:
On Sat, Oct 19, 2013 at 2:24 PM, Dominik George n...@naturalnet.de wrote:
[1]: http://wiki.openstreetmap.org/wiki/Key:timezone [1]
It's even easier to add the tag on existing countries relations. No
need for extra ways, neither tagging on ways.
Some of the anomalies in TZ boundaries can be found here...
http://efele.net/maps/tz/us/ [2]
http://efele.net/maps/tz/world/ [3]
Some boundaries are even unclear or undefined.
On 2013-10-19 22:58, Janko Mihelić wrote:
2013/10/19 Pieren pier...@gmail.com
It's even easier to add the
Janko Mihelić wrote:
It's even easier to add the tag on existing countries relations. No
need for extra ways, neither tagging on ways.
+1
Are there any timezones that don't follow country or some other administrative
borders?
This is unfortunatly part of the current problem WITH
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