Re: [time-nuts] HP 10811-60155 pinout

2007-01-13 Thread Didier Juges
It would be helpful to know who this seller is. Thanks in advance. Didier KO4BB [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Hello, > > I purchased one of the HP 10811-60155 standards on ebay one month ago and it > was just delivered today. Seller promised to send edge connector and > pinouts, but now refuses

Re: [time-nuts] Z3801A - notes on the hp58533a GPSDO

2007-01-12 Thread Didier Juges
David I. Emery wrote: > As for performance, I am curious myself. Certainly the > Thunderbolt is better documented in respect to performance, but whether > in fact it actually IS a lot better when GPS locked is something I'd > like to know. Its firmware does seem to supply a lot more data

[time-nuts] Knobs for HP 5370A

2007-01-12 Thread Didier Juges
I am looking for 4 knobs for my spare HP 5370A counter. They go on a 1/8" shaft. They have 2 screws and an index. They do not need to exactly match the original model (for instance, the index is not really useful since the instrument displays the trigger voltage), but I would prefer that all 4

Re: [time-nuts] Z3801A - notes on the hp58533a GPSDO

2007-01-12 Thread Didier Juges
Regarding the Thunderbolt, I got some information from the Trimble sales manager for timing products: The Thunderbolt was designed and built in-house (of course from parts bought from outside sources). So, the software and IP are Trimble, not OEM'd. Any resemblance with the Symmetricom 58540A u

Re: [time-nuts] Looking For Tektronix Knobs 22xx Series

2007-01-10 Thread Didier Juges
; > ----- Original Message - > From: "Didier Juges" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: "Discussion of precise time and frequency measurement" > > Sent: Wednesday, January 10, 2007 5:16 PM > Subject: Re: [time-nuts] Looking For Tektronix Knobs 22xx Series > >

Re: [time-nuts] Linux code for Prologix GPIB/USB

2007-01-10 Thread Didier Juges
I have some serial code under Linux that kind of works. Not extremely robust, but it is being used by the government on some NMD program, so it's got to be good enough :-) It is in C and the program runs in console mode. The code uses the serial port in half duplex mode, which should be fine f

Re: [time-nuts] Looking For Tektronix Knobs 22xx Series

2007-01-10 Thread Didier Juges
You are welcome to upload them to my Manuals page by ftp to ftp.ko4bb.com login: manuals password: manuals Then send me an email and I will move the manual with the others at www.ko4bb.com/ham_radio/Manuals Thanks in advance Didier KO4BB Joseph Gray wrote: > I have a PDF of both the Operation

Re: [time-nuts] Any one familiar with Trimble TSIP

2007-01-03 Thread Didier Juges
After I bought my Thunderbolt, I sent Trimble an email asking for what the current firmware was. I gave them the version in my unit. I have not gotten a response yet, but it has only been a month and a half... I am not holding my breath. They are probably more interested in selling new units.

Re: [time-nuts] New pics of RFTG-m-Rb, and some comparison details

2006-12-31 Thread Didier Juges
If the unit has an internal 10 MHz OCXO, it is hard to imagine the 15 MHz being cleaner than the 10 MHz, so it would seem the best way (simpler and cleaner) is actually to tap off the OCXO with a suitable buffer amp. Didier KO4BB jmfranke wrote: > One approach would be to divide the 15 MHz by

Re: [time-nuts] HP 5345A

2006-12-30 Thread Didier Juges
Just like with wine, making good crystals involves a lot of knowledge and a little bit of magic... Happy new year! Didier KO4BB Bill Hawkins wrote: > Brooke, > > I foresee a discussion similar to those of wine connoisseurs. > > What is the maison and vintage of the crystal? Was it > found on t

Re: [time-nuts] TIC resolution impact on GPSDO's performance

2006-12-27 Thread Didier Juges
Dr Bruce Griffiths wrote: > Dr Bruce Griffiths wrote: > >> Dr Bruce Griffiths wrote: >> >> >>> Didier Juges wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>>> Hi David, >>>> >>>> David I. Emery wrote: &g

Re: [time-nuts] TIC resolution impact on GPSDO's performance

2006-12-27 Thread Didier Juges
Dr Bruce Griffiths wrote: > Didier Juges wrote: > >> Hi David, >> >> David I. Emery wrote: >> >> >>> On Tue, Dec 26, 2006 at 04:14:45PM -0600, Didier Juges wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>> >>

Re: [time-nuts] TIC resolution impact on GPSDO's performance

2006-12-27 Thread Didier Juges
David I. Emery wrote: > On Tue, Dec 26, 2006 at 04:14:45PM -0600, Didier Juges wrote: > > >> When reading the data sheet for the Thunderbolt, and reading all the >> pitfalls associated with non-integrated GPSDO designs using stand alone >> GPS receivers, such

Re: [time-nuts] TIC resolution impact on GPSDO's performance

2006-12-27 Thread Didier Juges
Hi David, David I. Emery wrote: > On Tue, Dec 26, 2006 at 04:14:45PM -0600, Didier Juges wrote: > > >> When reading the data sheet for the Thunderbolt, and reading all the >> pitfalls associated with non-integrated GPSDO designs using stand alone >> GPS receivers,

Re: [time-nuts] TIC resolution impact on GPSDO's performance

2006-12-26 Thread Didier Juges
Dr Bruce Griffiths wrote: > Didier Juges wrote: > >> Dr Bruce Griffiths wrote: >> >> >>> Didier Juges wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>>> This discussion is fascinating, and as always it has prompted a num

Re: [time-nuts] RFTG-m-XO disassembly photos

2006-12-26 Thread Didier Juges
John, Nice pics! Did you at least run it to see if it works and what kind of performance you could get out of it? Didier KO4BB John Ackermann N8UR wrote: > My RFTG-m-XO arrived today, and the first thing I had to do was rip it > apart. I've put a series of pictures of the thing in various sta

Re: [time-nuts] TIC resolution impact on GPSDO's performance

2006-12-26 Thread Didier Juges
Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: > In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, Magnus Danielson wri > tes: > > >> harmonic(2) >> 1a) a tone in a harmonic series >> 2) in physics, a component frequency of a harmonic motion that is an integral >> multiple of the fundamental frequency >> >> overtone >> 1b) Harmonic(

Re: [time-nuts] TIC resolution impact on GPSDO's performance

2006-12-26 Thread Didier Juges
Dr Bruce Griffiths wrote: > Didier Juges wrote: > >> This discussion is fascinating, and as always it has prompted a number >> of other questions for me. >> >> I understand the sawtooth correction is provided to allow correction of >> 1 PPS timing er

Re: [time-nuts] 5334A and TIC measurments.

2006-12-25 Thread Didier Juges
If you have LabVIEW and a compatible GPIB controller, then all is done for you. Have fun. Didier KO4BB Jack Hudler wrote: > I was just looking for a quick fix to get going. > > While waiting I setup LabView to do it. Tweaking with the file format now. > > Thanks > > ___

Re: [time-nuts] 5334A and TIC measurments.

2006-12-25 Thread Didier Juges
Reading a 5334x counter via GPIB involves sending one command (to tell the counter to make a reading) and one query (to fetch the data), not a particularly difficult task in theory. Exactly how you send that command and how you get the data depends on the GPIB adapter you have, and the user lev

Re: [time-nuts] TIC resolution impact on GPSDO's performance

2006-12-25 Thread Didier Juges
This discussion is fascinating, and as always it has prompted a number of other questions for me. I understand the sawtooth correction is provided to allow correction of 1 PPS timing errors when the processor clock is non-coherent with the GPS signal (at least not intentionally), because the pr

Re: [time-nuts] Weird HP 5334B problem

2006-12-23 Thread Didier Juges
Thank you Jack, it makes sense, but I am not aware of the logic used by HP for serial numbers. I know it's been covered extensively on the hp_agilent newsgroup, I just don't recall. Thanks anyway and Merry Christmas to you and all time-nuts. Didier KO4BB Jack Hudler wrote: > Your manual 2934

[time-nuts] Weird HP 5334B problem

2006-12-23 Thread Didier Juges
My HP 5334B has been doing the following since I got it off eBay this summer. It's not a major problem, but it is irritating and I would like to fix it, but I don't know where to start... At power up, when being fed two signals for TIC measurements, the instrument passes self test without error

Re: [time-nuts] Picket fence technique

2006-12-23 Thread Didier Juges
Dr Bruce Griffiths wrote: > Using a GPS timing receiver to quantify the long term stability of an > oscillator whose frequency is not a harmonic of 1Hz, then the technique > of dividing the oscillator frequency down to 1Hz and logging the time > delay between the GPS derived PPS pulse and the le

Re: [time-nuts] Time Interval Averaging: Theory, Problems, and Solutions

2006-12-21 Thread Didier Juges
http://www.hparchive.com/hp_journals.htm Didier KO4BB Brooke Clarke wrote: > Hi Bruce: > > How to get a copy? > > Have Fun, > > Brooke Clarke > > w/Java http://www.PRC68.com > w/o Java http://www.pacificsites.com/~brooke/PRC68COM.shtml > http://www.precisionclock.com > > >> /Time Interval Aver

Re: [time-nuts] Brandywine GPS-4 User Manual

2006-12-21 Thread Didier Juges
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: 'Didier Juges' <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Done (I think). Never uploaded to an FTP site b4. If you don't see "GPS4-Manual v2.2.pdf". Please tell me how to upload. REM -----Original Message- From: Didier Juges [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]

Re: [time-nuts] Looking for QST Jan 1990 Article on Crystal S, Q & R testing By DeMaw

2006-12-20 Thread Didier Juges
I did just that to check the 50 MHz crystal in my HP 3586 and convince myself it was not dead. The 50 MHz VCXO did not oscillate, for some reason, and finding a replacement crystal would have been a long shot and would have probably cost more than I paid for the instrument. Seeing the proper re

Re: [time-nuts] LPRO-101 with Brooks Shera's GPS locking circuit

2006-12-20 Thread Didier Juges
In the matter of lifetime (outside of MTBF issues), is it correct that Rb has a built-in life limiting mechanism (the lamp wears out), where Qz does not? If so, Rb oscillators will eventually fail but one might hope a Qz oscillator may not. Didier Tom Van Baak wrote: >> Hello folks, >> >> i li

Re: [time-nuts] Locking gunn diode

2006-12-19 Thread Didier Juges
Hittite has dividers (prescalers) that go to 18 GHz: http://www.hittite.com/ I have a couple of samples of the :8 that goes to 12 GHz, precisely to try and phase lock a Gunn, which I have not used yet (another long winter project that won't happen as long as I am in Florida :-) Didier Normand

Re: [time-nuts] Locking gunn diode

2006-12-18 Thread Didier Juges
Rick, If you are talking about injection locking, that will probably not be practical. The Gunn is not stable enough (not the Gunn itself, but the cavity where it will be installed) to stay close enough to the right harmonic to stay locked, and the high order difference between the gunn and th

Re: [time-nuts] Digital PLL ICs, alternatives and digital loop filters

2006-12-16 Thread Didier Juges
John Miles described a clean 110 MHz PLL from a 5.5 MHz source, which he used in his tracking generator project. http://www.thegleam.com/ke5fx/tr503.html It could be easily adapted to a 100 MHz output from a 10 MHz input. An alternative to a PLL would be a frequency multiplier, if the original

Re: [time-nuts] motorola oncore descriptions

2006-12-13 Thread Didier Juges
You have to be careful with the 10 kHz output. The output is only updated once per second (the 10,000 pulses in the 1 second period are equally spaced), so you still need the same filter as if you were using the 1 PPS output. I am not sure what the 10kHz output was intended to, but it's not tha

Re: [time-nuts] Time Nuts at PTTI this past week

2006-12-09 Thread Didier Juges
Don't do that over my house :-) Didier Tom Van Baak wrote: > Yes, and instead of dropping sand to keep aloft > over time I could drop the lead acid batteries as I > use them up! > > /tvb > > > ___ time-nuts mailing list time-nuts@febo.com https://w

Re: [time-nuts] FMT

2006-11-15 Thread Didier Juges
Recent radios of that grade all have TCXOs, and that level of performance is really not that hard to achieve today at constant temperature. My Yaesu FT-1000 Mk5 Field (with TCXO) drifts much less than 0.5 Hz at 14 MHz between 30 minutes and one hour after being turned on (in receive), but a co

[time-nuts] What is UTC after all?

2006-11-11 Thread Didier Juges
Looking at the Thunderbolt manual, I came across this: It is important to remember that any real-time UTC is actually a prediction of UTC. The official UTC time is published approximately one month after the fact. It makes sense that real-time "UTC" is a prediction, since UTC is the average o

Re: [time-nuts] FMT

2006-11-10 Thread Didier Juges
Hi Mike, Interesting, I was just doing pretty much that, except that I did not think of using the tracking generator of the 3586A as a reference, I used an 8657B synthesizer phase locked to the Thunderbolt GPSDO to inject a reference signal 20Hz above the test signal (I used WWV at 5 MHz for t

Re: [time-nuts] time-nuts Digest, Vol 28, Issue 5

2006-11-05 Thread Didier Juges
Well, I am sorry to report that you failed this simple test: you need an *abacus* of course :-) (an abacus with statistical functions helps, but I have not seen one, or maybe a programmable abacus...) Didier KO4BB John Ackermann N8UR wrote: > Didier Juges said the following on 11/05/2006

Re: [time-nuts] time-nuts Digest, Vol 28, Issue 5

2006-11-05 Thread Didier Juges
As much as I believe there should be a place and appropriate recognition for anyone who has shown dedication to the art of time keeping, regardless of the technology employed, I remind you of the bylaws of the time-nuts group: / Time-Nuts/ is a mailing list for amateurs who are interested in pr

Re: [time-nuts] More Allan deviation data

2006-10-29 Thread Didier Juges
Dr Bruce Griffiths wrote: > Didier > > Unless you have a particularly poor 10811 it is likely that the measured > Allan deviation is limited by the instability of your GPS receiver > PPS output. > With a good GPS timing receiver setup you should expect an Allan > variance perhaps 5x lower than t

Re: [time-nuts] More Allan deviation data

2006-10-29 Thread Didier Juges
Ulrich Bangert wrote: > Hi Didier, > > you may use the DRIFT section of the graphic editor of PLOTTER to remove > a phase drift due to a constant frequency offset as seen in this data, > with the result that you get more "visual resolution" out of it, as in > the attached PDF. > > 73 de Ulrich, DF6

Re: [time-nuts] More Allan deviation data

2006-10-29 Thread Didier Juges
I had to stack up frequency counters on top of frequency counters (to measure time difference and each input frequency simultaneously -> 3 counters) and the last one on the top, a HP 5334B, was fairly high and just about level with the antenna, about 2 feet away. I found out that if I stood in

[time-nuts] More Allan deviation data

2006-10-28 Thread Didier Juges
I moved the GPS antenna as high as I could in the shack (instead of on a shelf at eye level) and it seems to have significantly improved the signal. Here is the latest plot of the HP10811 against the GPS, unlocked. http://www.ko4bb.com/Test_Equipment/HP10811-GPS-10-29.png (sorry the screen shot

Re: [time-nuts] GPS vagaries and binary interface

2006-10-28 Thread Didier Juges
Dr Bruce Griffiths wrote: > Didier Juges wrote: > > > > >> That's the impression I am getting. I do not know if any of the GPSDO >> that I have seen described in recent literature take care of this properly. >> It seems when the GPS goes nuts, the 1

Re: [time-nuts] GPS vagaries and binary interface

2006-10-28 Thread Didier Juges
Dr Bruce Griffiths wrote: > > Didier > > Alternative GPSDO solution > Divide the 10MHz reference by 32 resync the output to 10MHz with a fast > D flipflop and then divide the D flipflop output by 4 using a 2 bit > switchtail ring (Johnson) counter. > Low pass filter the outputs of both divide by

[time-nuts] GPS vagaries and binary interface

2006-10-28 Thread Didier Juges
Dr Bruce Griffiths wrote: > Good timing antennas have built in ceramic or equivalent bandpass > filters to minimise the effect of interference. > A patch antenna is not as satisfactory as a quadrifilar helix or a choke > ring ground plane antenna for accurate timing purposes. > > If GPSDO did

Re: [time-nuts] Can anyone help?

2006-10-28 Thread Didier Juges
Poul-Henning Kamp may weigh in with his valuable expertise, but I believe the ntp standard offers the capability for the clients (your computer's operating system) to compensate for the time it takes for the ntp info to get to you. This assumes that the delay from you to the ntp server is the s

Re: [time-nuts] Allan Deviation -> more data: GPS 1PPS against OCXO/128

2006-10-28 Thread Didier Juges
kd7ts wrote: > Didier Juges wrote: > >> There are sudden increases in noise (bursts that last from seconds to >> minutes) on the plots I posted. >> >> I believe the sudden and drastic increase in noise at times comes from >> the GPS loosing lock. At the m

Re: [time-nuts] Allan Deviation -> more data: GPS 1PPS against OCXO/128

2006-10-28 Thread Didier Juges
There are sudden increases in noise (bursts that last from seconds to minutes) on the plots I posted. I believe the sudden and drastic increase in noise at times comes from the GPS loosing lock. At the moment, I cannot hook up the computer to the GPS and verify, but I will do that later. In th

Re: [time-nuts] Allan Deviation -> continuing saga...

2006-10-28 Thread Didier Juges
Magnus Danielson wrote: > Look at the AD8561 datasheet first. The 74HC4046 is much slower than the > AD8561 and the higher output slewrate of the AD8561 is certainly good to keep > jitter down. The 74HC4046 is worse for that aspect. > > What I would rather critize Didiers schematic for is the lack

Re: [time-nuts] Allan Deviation -> continuing saga...

2006-10-28 Thread Didier Juges
John Ackermann N8UR wrote: > To minimize jitter and tempco, you probably ought to stay away from a > comparator if you can. I've had good success using the input circuit > from Brooks Shera's GPSDO which is a 74HC4046 PLL, but using only the > input circuit and not the PLL section itself. Alterna

[time-nuts] Allan Deviation -> more data: GPS 1PPS against OCXO/128

2006-10-28 Thread Didier Juges
Ulrich, Is there a way to insert comment lines in the data file that will not confuse plotter? My logging program creates a header with useful information to record how the data was collected, but it messes up Plotter of course. Thanks I have made a run over night of the 10 MHz OCXO divided by

[time-nuts] Allan Deviation -> continuing saga...

2006-10-27 Thread Didier Juges
In the quest to check the stability of my OCXOs and make a GPS disciplined oscillator, here is my current progress: Using parts I had on hand and a couple of free AD8561 samples, I made a synchronous divider for the 10 MHz OCXO to get it closer to 1 Hz. Since I only had two synchronous binary d

Re: [time-nuts] ARRL FMT

2006-10-27 Thread Didier Juges
[EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > Hi Didier... > > The "official" readings are taken for the band that is announced. > > Even though the exciters at W1AW are left on for an extended period of time > before the test, there is some drift during the > test period. > > I would suggest that you listen

Re: [time-nuts] ARRL FMT

2006-10-27 Thread Didier Juges
It is back to the previous method of sending a clean CW signal. I did not participate previously, so I have no experience with the test. If I understand correctly, they will transmit on all 3 frequencies simultaneously, but we are supposed to measure only the specific band they announce at a ti

Re: [time-nuts] Allan deviation -> finally some data!!!

2006-10-26 Thread Didier Juges
It seems obvious that's what hapenned, but I am still curious about the temperature variation. Must have been the coax cables difference in length going to the two inputs. Temperature affected the delay. The resolution of the 5370 is quite amazing. Thanks for the comments and the software. Did

Re: [time-nuts] Allan deviation -> finally some data!!!

2006-10-25 Thread Didier Juges
Tom Van Baak wrote: >> Since I have only one readily accessible spare OCXO at the moment and I >> want to get the procedure right before I take anything else apart, I >> will feed the output of the 10 MHz reference from the 5370 into the >> START channel, and my DUT into the STOP channel and sel

Re: [time-nuts] Allan deviation -> finally some data!!!

2006-10-25 Thread Didier Juges
Bruce, Sorry that I did not specify the setup was the same as when described in the post about the trigger outputs, as follows: > I have a single 10 MHz sine signal fed to the START channel, and > the 5370 is set to TI, MEAN, SAMPLE SIZE 1, + TI ONLY, START channel > triggers o

Re: [time-nuts] Allan deviation -> finally some data!!!

2006-10-25 Thread Didier Juges
Ulrich Bangert wrote: > Hi Didier, > > the sigma-tau plot looks indeed strange! Can you send me the data file > for some tests with it? > > 73 de Ulrich, DF6JB > The files are at http://www.ko4bb.com/Test_Equipment/ filenames: Counter_TIxx.dat Didier ___

Re: [time-nuts] Allan deviation -> finally some data!!!

2006-10-25 Thread Didier Juges
Dr Bruce Griffiths <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > The apparent behaviour of your 10811's is far too good!! > Over a period of 15,000 seconds the allan deviation should have reached > a minimum and then increased as the effects of ageing manifest themselves. > Either the oscillators are

[time-nuts] Allan deviation -> finally some data!!!

2006-10-25 Thread Didier Juges
I have downloaded and installed Plotter, and found it easy to setup and use, at least for basic functionality. The menu threw me off a little bit (no simple File->Open dialog), but I am sure I will get used to it. I have ran my spare HP10811 overnight (twice), against the HP5370A's own timebase

Re: [time-nuts] How to measure Allan Deviation?

2006-10-23 Thread Didier Juges
Hi Bruce, Dr Bruce Griffiths wrote: > Didier Juges wrote: > >> Dr Bruce Griffiths wrote: >> >> >>> Didier Juges wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>>> I do not understand the signal on the rear trigger outputs.

Re: [time-nuts] How to measure Allan Deviation?

2006-10-23 Thread Didier Juges
Dr Bruce Griffiths wrote: > Didier Juges wrote: > >> I do not understand the signal on the rear trigger outputs. At the >> moment, I have a single 10 MHz sine signal fed to the START channel, and >> the 5370 is set to TI, MEAN, SAMPLE SIZE 1, + TI ONLY, START channel

Re: [time-nuts] How to measure Allan Deviation?

2006-10-23 Thread Didier Juges
Dr Bruce Griffiths wrote: > Didier > > Did you get my comment on HP5370A differential linearity errors. > It made it to the list but I didn't receive a bounced copy. > > Bruce > > > ___ > time-nuts mailing list > time-nuts@febo.com > https://www.febo.com/

Re: [time-nuts] How to measure Allan Deviation?

2006-10-23 Thread Didier Juges
Dr Bruce Griffiths wrote: > Didier > > You may also find this useful > > http://www.wenzel.com/documents/waveform.html > > There are some other items that may be of interest at: > > http://www.wenzel.com/documents/library.html > > Though you may not want to build the water barometer!! > > Bruce >

Re: [time-nuts] How to measure Allan Deviation?

2006-10-23 Thread Didier Juges
Here are my $0.02... Magnus Danielson wrote: > From: Dr Bruce Griffiths <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > Subject: Re: [time-nuts] How to measure Allan Deviation? > Date: Tue, 24 Oct 2006 10:52:21 +1300 > Message-ID: <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > > >> Tom >> > > Hi Bruce, > > >> In comparing 2 oscillators

Re: [time-nuts] How to measure Allan Deviation?

2006-10-23 Thread Didier Juges
Hi Tom, comments are embedded: Tom Van Baak wrote: > Didier, > > I've been out of town and I see a flurry of postings to > your original query about Allan deviation. It sounds > like your goal is to measure the stability of various > oscillators that you have lying around? > That's what happen

Re: [time-nuts] How to measure Allan Deviation?

2006-10-23 Thread Didier Juges
Hi Ulrich, comments are embedded: Ulrich Bangert wrote: > the Datum LPRO User's Guide / Installation Guide discusses some methods > of sine to square wave conversion in terms of lowest phase noise. > > This is good to know. Do you have any suggestion how I might get a copy of the relevant pa

Re: [time-nuts] How to measure Allan Deviation?

2006-10-22 Thread Didier Juges
Dr Bruce Griffiths wrote: > Didier Juges wrote: > >> Dr Bruce Griffiths wrote: >> >> >>> Didier Juges wrote: >>> >>> >>> >>>> Dr Bruce Griffiths wrote: >>>> >>>>

Re: [time-nuts] How to measure Allan Deviation?

2006-10-22 Thread Didier Juges
Bruce, Thanks for the reminder. That was my intention. I was planning to use a 74HC74, and whatever dividers I can get my hands on. I am not looking forward to daisy chain seven 7490s, so I will probably try something else. With the D flip-flop, the dividers don't really matter, as long as the

Re: [time-nuts] How to measure Allan Deviation?

2006-10-22 Thread Didier Juges
Dr Bruce Griffiths wrote: > Didier Juges wrote: > >> Dr Bruce Griffiths wrote: >> >> >>> In principle this measurement could be made with a time interval counter: >>> PPS -> START >>> delayed 10KHz -> STOP >>> >>

Re: [time-nuts] How to measure Allan Deviation?

2006-10-22 Thread Didier Juges
Dr Bruce Griffiths wrote: > Didier Juges wrote: > >> Dr Bruce Griffiths wrote: >> >> >>> In principle this measurement could be made with a time interval counter: >>> PPS -> START >>> delayed 10KHz -> STOP >>> >>

Re: [time-nuts] How to measure Allan Deviation?

2006-10-22 Thread Didier Juges
Dr Bruce Griffiths wrote: > In principle this measurement could be made with a time interval counter: > PPS -> START > delayed 10KHz -> STOP > > Vary the delay and watch the jitter jump when the leading edge of the > PPS signal occurs during the 10KHz burst which was phase coherent with > the pre

Re: [time-nuts] How to measure Allan Deviation?

2006-10-22 Thread Didier Juges
Dr Bruce Griffiths wrote: > > Reading between the lines on the Jupiter GPS receiver datasheet it would > appear that the 10KHz output is phase modulated at 1Hz to realign it to > successive PPS output pulses. As the PPS jitters about so does the 10KHz > signal. > Most GPS receivers with higher f

Re: [time-nuts] How to measure Allan Deviation?

2006-10-22 Thread Didier Juges
It just so happen that I also have an HP 5334B, which I bought when I had given up on getting an HP5370 for a *reasonable* cost, considering my application. It draws 20 VA instead of 200, but this one does not have the 10811 time base. This will also be a lot easier on the UPS, as we do loose p

Re: [time-nuts] How to measure Allan Deviation?

2006-10-22 Thread Didier Juges
Hi John, I got zip (does not work either :-) I remember going through something like that a while back on one of my servers, I have no recollection how I fixed it :-( The files look pretty small, can you email them to me? Interestingly, on my ISP's server (Linux too), I have no problem getting

Re: [time-nuts] How to measure Allan Deviation?

2006-10-22 Thread Didier Juges
More comments embedded... Didier John Ackermann N8UR wrote: > Didier, a few comments embedded below. > > John > ---- > > Didier Juges said the following on 10/22/2006 10:34 AM: > >> Hi Warner, >> >> Does it mean I should divide the 10 MHz down to 1 Hz ou

Re: [time-nuts] How to measure Allan Deviation?

2006-10-22 Thread Didier Juges
Hi John, I have written a number of Perl programs under Linux, so your offer of the scripts was great. However, permissions on your server do not allow me to download the scripts. I get a directory though... Regarding programming *style*, we can share then :-) Thanks Didier KO4BB John Ackerm

Re: [time-nuts] How to measure Allan Deviation?

2006-10-22 Thread Didier Juges
Hi Warner, Does it mean I should divide the 10 MHz down to 1 Hz output and use the 5370 to measure TI compared to it's internal timebase once per second, and feed that to the computer, store it to a file and feed the output to AlaVar? (obviously, the divider would have to use synchronous counte

[time-nuts] How to measure Allan Deviation?

2006-10-21 Thread Didier Juges
OK, here is my problem. I do not think it is a unique problem, based on recent mail :-) I have read about the Allan Deviation and I understand the principle, even though the nuances between the 3 basic Allan deviations escape me at the moment, but I am sure it will come once I re-read the Help

Re: [time-nuts] HP8568B firware eproms anyone ?

2006-10-19 Thread Didier Juges
Many CMOS chips draw higher supply current with floating inputs, as the internal buffers may bias themselves in the middle of the range, where both transistors are turned on. That may lead to increased temperature and failure over time. In many cases, floating inputs will simply toggle as a fun

Re: [time-nuts] HP8568B firware eproms anyone ?

2006-10-19 Thread Didier Juges
My kind of guy :-) Congratulations! Reminds me a long time ago when building 120 audio amplifiers as part of a college hobby gone crazy, I had laid out my PWB for mini-DIP (DIP8) op-amps (uA709, because that's all there existed back then), with the frequency compensation caps at each end of th

Re: [time-nuts] HP8568B firware eproms anyone ?

2006-10-18 Thread Didier Juges
John Miles ([EMAIL PROTECTED]) on hp_agilent_equipment (yahoo) has a lot of experience with the 8568 and 8566 analyzers and is probably your best opportunity to find what you need. I know he had an 8568 which he sold, but not before copying the EPROMs. Didier KO4BB Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: > M

Re: [time-nuts] ARRL 2006 Frequency Measuring Test

2006-10-18 Thread Didier Juges
I had planned to participate the last 2 years, but got distracted both times. Hopefully, this year will be the charm :-) I better have my GPS stabilized clock working by then (to drive the HP 3586A receiver, and the HP 3570A counter for the decoded audio), no more excuses... Interestingly, the

Re: [time-nuts] HP 5370A

2006-10-15 Thread Didier Juges
Bruce, Thanks for the explanation, and you were right on the money. It looked like one of the tuning caps was open, funny that it resonated so close to 30 MHz. I reflowed the solder joints on the two 500pF capacitors (even though they looked fine under the magnifier) and voila, Bob's your uncl

Re: [time-nuts] EIP 575 Looking for Service information or schematics

2006-10-14 Thread Didier Juges
Eric, This is probably too old to be useful, but I have the 371 Source Locking frequency counter service manual on my web site at http://www.ko4bb.com/ham_radio/Manuals This manual was courtesy of Had, K7MLR Didier KO4BB Eric Haskell wrote: > I purchased a broken EIP 575 Source Locking Micro

[time-nuts] HP 5370A

2006-10-14 Thread Didier Juges
I got an HP 5370A from eBay which did not work at power up (display was messed up). After resetting all the ROMs and the CPU in their sockets, the instrument came to life and now powers up without error message. It has serial number 2128A01306. However, it seems that the reference oscillator ou

Re: [time-nuts] Features of a Precision Clock?

2006-10-08 Thread Didier Juges
Over that time period, maybe a calendar :-) Didier Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: > In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Bill Hawkins" writes: > > >> Since control is not precise, the subject is probably off >> topic for this list. >> > > It all depends on your integration time. > > I was told fro

[time-nuts] Extron 3 80 video distribution amplifier

2006-09-06 Thread Didier Juges
Hello fellows Time Nuts, Following a question of mine here a few weeks ago about using a video distribution amplifier for frequency reference distribution, and lots of good advice I got in response, I just got one of those distribution amplifiers from eBay and there are good news. The box is ve

Re: [time-nuts] Time syncing question

2006-08-31 Thread Didier Juges
The first phone I had where I observed the time zone error, after the plane had landed in a new time zone and the phone had not been turned off during the flight (and no, the plane did not crash, not that time) was an Alltel phone. Alltel uses CDMA. Again, this was just an observation. I suspe

Re: [time-nuts] Time syncing question

2006-08-30 Thread Didier Juges
I have observed that some cell phones set their clock when you power them up, and others set it at regular time. Some automatically change time zone as you travel and some don't, maybe due to the same process. Didier KO4BB Glenn wrote: > _Most_ cell phones set their time to "network time." Usua

Re: [time-nuts] Time syncing question

2006-08-28 Thread Didier Juges
OK, I assumed the operation was initiated by the phone system, but I believe you mean that the time can be set by sending a command via the serial port (for instance, or via ethernet) from a computer or a serial terminal. In that case, running a cron job on an NTP connected computer that would

Re: [time-nuts] Time syncing question

2006-08-28 Thread Didier Juges
I guess it would help to know if the phone system computer runs over a general purpose OS, such as Linux or a variation of Windows or other GPOS. If so, you may be able to install a good time keeping utility designed for that OS and have it steer and update the RTC from an NTP time server. If n

[time-nuts] distribution amplifier

2006-08-25 Thread Didier Juges
It is reasonable to use a standard video distribution amplifier to spread the good 10 MHz from a stable reference generator? It seems those provide moderate (usually adjustable) amplification, isolation of the various outputs (even though they do not have ground isolation) and should be appropr

Re: [time-nuts] Shopping list

2006-08-22 Thread Didier Juges
Ignore this, since you have already put it up where everyone can get it. Didier KO4BB Didier Juges wrote: > If you send me a copy, I'll put it with the other manuals at > http://www.ko4bb.com/ham_radio/Manuals > > Didier KO4BB > > _

Re: [time-nuts] Shopping list

2006-08-22 Thread Didier Juges
If you send me a copy, I'll put it with the other manuals at http://www.ko4bb.com/ham_radio/Manuals Didier KO4BB Poul-Henning Kamp wrote: > In message <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>, "Juerg Koegel" writes: > >> Hello Magnus >> >> I have the manual for the HP J06-59992A and I can you send a copy as a pdf

Re: [time-nuts] Enhancing the TIC232 code for better data

2006-08-13 Thread Didier Juges
keep that edge the way it is and then invert the 1PPS from the DUT, if this is possible. Also, at least with my Jupiter receiver, the 1PPS is a fairly short pulse, not nearly 50% duty cycle, so inverting it might not give much improvement. Any thoughts? Didier Didier Juges wrote: > Hi Rich

Re: [time-nuts] Enhancing the TIC232 code for better data

2006-08-13 Thread Didier Juges
Hi Richard, Thanks a lot for the very detailed explanations. I was not sure after looking at the PIC assembly code. I have never used PICs and even with my favorite micros (6805 and now 8051) I try to stay away from assembly, it's not as much fun as it used to be, now that I am used to C, even

Re: [time-nuts] Enhancing the TIC232 code for better data

2006-08-12 Thread Didier Juges
How do you measure the averaging time? Should we 1) measure the actual time that the phase data is being read (as I understand, that would be accumulating the time that the phase comparator output is high) and stop when we reach a certain count/time, or should it be 2) just elapsed time (period

Re: [time-nuts] Fw: How do I know my GPS stabilized oscillator is working?

2006-08-11 Thread Didier Juges
Hi Richard, Thanks a lot for the information, your email hit me at exactly the same time as the one telling me I won a HP 5316B time interval counter on eBay :-) (Could not find a 5370 I could afford...) (I have waay too many counters right now, but only one with TIM _and_ GPIB...) Thanks a l

Re: [time-nuts] Frequency Dividers

2006-08-09 Thread Didier Juges
Hi Said, Thanks for the info, I did check the Philips (and Sparkfun) web site(s) and I must admit the ARM chip is cheap and has impressive specifications. With the GNU tools, I know it will work and it will fit my homebrewer's budget :-) I used to consider $99 for a development kit cheap, but

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