https://www.raptorcs.com/
They manufacture the libre software talos mainboard.
I emailed them, asking if they would make an about 500usd libre software
mainboard. Raptor answered me. Rather good answers in terms of the
possibility of getting a lower priced libre software mainboard.
Raptor wr
This is very cool! I would think the free software movement should be able to
get 10,000 signatures together to crowdfund this. We would need to get a
firmer quote from them in terms of price/lead time; what the exact specs
would be and verify that it would be 100% libre. If the price really
I'm a bit surprised there isn't more interest in this. Would anybody else be
willing to pay $500-600 upfront for a fully open, modern mainboard
alternative to Intel/AMD? Do people not think that target of 10,000 units
could be achievable by crowdsourcing? I admit that I don't have a very soli
>get a firmer quote from them in terms of price/lead time; what the exact
specs would
My email to raptor was introductory. I did not list specifications and raptor
did
not mention specifications either in their answer. I did not expect raptor to
answer or
answer rejecting.
I think the price
> Specifications about a duo core x86 cpu, I should say suffice.
I'd be surprised if they would use a different CPU chip to the Talos II. It
seems doubtful that IBM would make a custom Power9 CPU/socket just for a
one-off run of 10,000 boards. I don't know, perhaps they would? Again, we
wou
Not just signatures but 10 000 orders with payments sent to Raptor to secure
the orders
Just need to know how much for a mainboard
Is Raptor's product different (in terms of freedom) from Think Penguin's
EOMA68?
Anyway PowerPC is more powerful than a x86 CPU, and it doesn't have AMD PSP
or Intel's ME shits. But PowerPC always was expensive.
I haven't gotten involved with any crowdfunding before, but I had a quick
look at Kickstarter. It looks like the way it works is people pledge a
certain amount of money, but no money is charged unless the target is met.
So, it seems like there isn't anything lose by giving it a try ..
I took
Some of us can pledge $500-$600 but there are also students here and other
low income type folks who cannot be expected to make and keep this sort of
promise at the expense of shelter and food. It is still wonderful news.
Please don't be discouraged.
My understanding is that coreboot/libreb
Hi Tonlee,
> I am going to write Stallman an email about raptor's lower priced
mainboard.
I applaud your efforts and encourage you to write others as well in hopes of
building interest for a advanced Libre platform.
I often think about the momentum that comes from the gaming communities
(d
This is actually happening right now. I'm too old to keep up with the gaming
world but still young enough to have a kid who does.
There is an IRC channel for libre gaming at #lgn. My nine year old does not
play proprietary games despite the heavy peer pressure in this age group and
has done
I have written think penguin asking if they would be interested in endorsing
a campaign and
crowd funding about a lower priced ppc libre software mainboard. Think
penguin
answered yes, if we could come up with a midway acceptable plan to get 1
mainboards sold. We both agree, we may not ach
Hi tonlee, seems like you're doing some great work on this and I think your
plan for campaigning sounds good. I have a couple of comments though:
Firstly, I strongly recommend going for a desktop ATX board over notebook. An
ATX board is very standard, so most people who already own a desktop
+1
Thanks Heather.
What is #lgn ?
My quick web-search revealed:
https://libregamenight.xyz/
https://libregamewiki.org/Main_Page
I wasn't aware of these sites, perhaps you have more urls you can share?
And - oh for sure do not under-estimate gamers - because I believe gamers can
Save the WORLD:
A
I may not commit to another motherboard (not sure) but I am willing to
promote the campaign via blogging and dropping comments in forums.
Please keep us informed with price, urls and dates.
Thanks Time4Tea -- that seems like a good way of coordinating this kind of
effort
"what is that giving me that I don't already have?"
I'd love me some >=Haswell-levels of battery life
Ok, fair enough. But, would you be willing to pay $500 for it, if it's not
giving you any increased computing power over what is already available? I
wouldn't, personally.
I wrote think penguin for remarks on my plan how to find 1 buyers. He has
not answered. I have resend the email. I wrote raptor for preliminary
specification options. No answer. I have resend the email. If communication
stops, I think we will get no further.
Has anyone contacted Richard Stallman yet? he's E-mail is: r...@gnu.org and
he's active! he replied to my message today.
>Has anyone contacted Richard Stallman yet?
Several times. Each year I send him a nice brief text with a gnulzy wallpaper
in the attachments :)
On 30/09/17 12:38, leestro...@gmail.com wrote:
> I took a look at the EOMA68 (that looks very cool as well, btw). That's
> a laptop using a dual-core ARM Cortex 1.2 GHz chip, which looks similar
> to what is used in the Raspberry Pi. The Raptor board would be for a
> desktop and the Power9 CPU is m
I got an email from raptor.
They will not state specifications of a mainboard. If gathering the pieces of
information means costs to raptor, it is understandable. If a crowd funding
is initiated, raptor will have to display specifications because people will
want to know what they buy. Rapto
On 11/10/17 15:39, svh...@gmail.com wrote:
>
> Instead raptor suggest a micro atx
> mainboard. I would prefer a notebook mainboard enabling people to make
> their own portable or notebook solutions.
>
I suspect/take a guess that part of the problem is power consumption.
Which means a lot of coo
Thanks for the update, tonlee, although it is discouraging that Raptor will
not be able to provide specifications. In my opinion, for the crowdfunding to
have any chance at all, they would have to provide a firm quote first,
including specs, price, lead time, warranty details. As you say, peo
https://www.powerpc-notebook.org/en/
This might be cheaper to support ;)
Manufactoring a notebook is not less expensive, than a mainboard.
In its latest email, think penguin says, it will not be part of a
ppc raptor lower priced mainboard crowd funding. Think penguin
believes it is impossible to find 1 buyers of the mainboard.
My point of view is, it does not matter, if a ppc libre software
mainboard crowd funding is unsuccessfu
I think this is a pipe dream. POWER seems to be a candidate for the future of
high-end computing, the really expensive stuff that businesses depend on. If
the cost goes down to a few thousand dollars for a whole computer, Raptor
could even provide high-end libre-friendly PCs, and that would b
>POWER seems to be a candidate for the future of high-end computing
My impression from raptor's emails is, the main parameter is number of
mainboards you order or raptor
sells. I have not asked raptor but I do not think ppc is inherently more
expensive than similar x86 hardware. If you buy 30
Raptor has emailed a list of specifications should a ppc libre software micro
atx mainboard, cpu included, get crowd funded.
1 POWER9 "Sforza" CPU
4 DDR4 DIMM slots
2 PCIe slots (1 x16, 1 x8)
On board audio
On board HDMI video (2D)
2 GbE NICs
On board USB 3.0
On board SATA (AHCI)
Optional remote
> I do not think ppc is inherently more expensive than similar x86 hardware.
I didn't say it is. x86 is what I was thinking of when I said "high-end". You
know, like gaming computers. The really expensive, cutting-edge stuff that
people like gamers buy.
For lower-end stuff, ARM is largely o
>1usd for a ppc mainboard, cpu included
Erroneously I wrote 1usd. It is 1000usd.
My main argument is, if it was on sale in shops for
1000usd and you asked all gnulinux aware people, if
they wanted to buy one, with some likelihood 1 units
could be sold.
Main obstacles are, people are
I wrote Stallman an email, explaining about how fsf could endorse given crowd
fundings of pieces of libre software or hardware which runs on libre
software. I suggested fsf should look into endorsing the crowd funding of a
lower priced raptor ppc atx mainboard.
Stallman answered, he was una
I agree. The EOMA doesn't excite me the way the POWER9 does. Not only is it a
new architecture, it is the first architecture for a long time that fully
supports libre computing. Like all of this stuff, cost will come down if it
takes off and higher quantities get made.
I don't see what the
That sounds pretty good! I would definitely take one for $1000 (including
CPU). 2 PCIs seems a little bit low, but I could work with it.
Ok, I'll send him an e-mail a bit later on and see if I can explain. Seems
like he is pretty good at getting back to e-mails.
Good effort, tonlee! :-)
Seriously, we need to make this happen for the future of free computing. I'll
be willing to volunteer some time as well for the crowdfunding
That's because you have a preference for power. I have a preference for low
price and low energy usage. That's fine; we have different preferences.
The problem with comparing EOMA68-based computers to your hacked Macbook,
however, is that your hacked Macbook isn't new. No more of those will e
>you have a preference for power.
No, he has not. As I have stated before, the cpu on the raptor microatx
mainboard will not be
a particular fast one. It will be the lowest priced cpu, which raptor can
provide, which has a
performance comparable to a x86 duo core cpu.
In a previously post, y
> As I have stated before, the cpu on the raptor microatx mainboard will not
be
a particular fast one. It will be the lowest priced cpu, which raptor can
provide, which has a
performance comparable to a x86 duo core cpu.
I think it's important to clarify on this. Did Raptor tell you that the
Sure, different people are going to want different things and one piece of
hardware is never going to suit everybody. I agree, of course, that the
Macbook is old hardware and, in 10 years' time, it isn't going to be as easy
to find one on Ebay.
I think there are a lot of people that do want
> There will be a place for both EOMA and the POWER9.
I agree completely. I just don't think POWER9's success is going to be by a
mass-production crowdfunding campaign aimed primarily at the libre software
community. I think Raptor needs to also give a lot of attention to some
larger niches
> When will arm cpus be as fast as x86 notebooks and when will such arm cpus
be libre software capable?
EOMA68 isn't supposed to use the same amount of power as x86; high-power
applications are supposed to be dealt with by a separate EOMA standard which
allows for more energy usage and heat
I had a reply from rms - he sent me a copy of what he said to tonlee the day
before.
In summary: he said he's going to ask the FSF people to take a look and let
him know if they think the project would be a benefit to free computing. He
also said that the FSF would only endorse a crowdfundi
>I would highly expect them to use the same POWER9 CPU that the Talos II is
using
Yes. From what raptor wrote me, there is not much of a wide range of options
in terms of hardware. It will be a talos 2 power9 sforza. It will be winded
down such that it can work on a microatx mainboard which
>most recent high-end x86 CPUs
I do not. I have a lenovo t400. It is fast enough to have several programs
running at the same time. Display youtube hd vidoes. Have a dozen tabs open
in firefox. It happens that the computer stalls. But not often. That would be
my benchmark.
It is unlikely t
>POWER9's success is going to be by a mass-production
I do not call 1 mainboards a mass production. The goal of a crowd funding
is, if there is 1 persons, who want to spend 1000usd on a libre software
mainboard and cpu, we will find them and give them the option to buy the
computer.
Stallman answered, he is not knowledgeable on the matter. He will ask people
who are familiar with fsf's hardware certifying system to decide if fsf
should engage in endorsing crowd fundings, which are about libre software. I
assume fsf will return, when they have made a decision.
Not sure
> It will be winded down such that it can work on a microatx mainboard which
has lower priced electronic components on it.
I would be very interested to hear more specific details about how it would
be 'winded down' and what that means. I.e. is it being clocked lower, or only
2 cores are en
My 2 cents: I think you will have a lot of difficulty getting Raptor to do
the crowdfunding on their website, seeing as they don't think the project is
viable and they weren't willing to provide a firm quote. Although I guess
there's no harm in asking.
Most crowdfunding sites that I've seen
> I have a lenovo t400.
That's not a low-end computer. That's mid-range at least. Low-end, e.g.
budget computers in 2008 would have used Celeron processors, which at that
time likely would have been single-core. They would also only have 2-4 GiB of
RAM, and around a 100 GiB hard drive.
Th
> The kinds of laptops you should be looking at are the $300-$400 budget
> laptops (sometimes as little as $200) found at Walmart and other similar
> stores. Those also include Chromebooks. I already told you that the SoC being
>
> used for the next computer card (yes, the Rockchip one) is
Funny you should mention that. Apparently someone is working on a GuixSD port
for the A20 computer card. :) I'm excited for that, GuixSD seems like a
really cool system.
Stallman answered, fsf will endorse no crowd funding regarding a libre
software microatx raptor mainboard and cpu. Because such mainboard is nothing
special. That is an odd reason considering, there is no new
libre software computer for sale, which equals an intel duo core cpu in
performance
Did you ask the FSF what they recommend as a currently-existing alternative?
No. The only answer fsf can have are the fsf certified computers.
https://www.fsf.org/resources/hw/endorsement/respects-your-freedom
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