I also think the bends must be important.
Michel
- Original Message -
From: "Horace Heffner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To:
Sent: Sunday, June 03, 2007 6:37 AM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:ion currents in pingpong balls
>
> On Jun 2, 2007, at 4:09 PM, Kyle R. Mcallister wrote:
>
>>
>> William Beaty w
- Original Message -
From: "Horace Heffner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To:
Sent: Sunday, June 03, 2007 5:41 AM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Miklos Borbas Thruster??
>
> On Jun 2, 2007, at 10:17 AM, Michel Jullian wrote:
>
>>
>> - Original Message -
>> From: "Horace Heffner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
On Jun 2, 2007, at 2:59 PM, Harry Veeder wrote:
According to the logic of Newton's laws of motion, the ions have to
remain
immobile to be able to pull the ball forward. However, the forward
motion
the ball will in turn be impeded by the ions immobility.
Therefore, the ball should not move
On Jun 2, 2007, at 4:55 PM, William Beaty wrote:
On Sat, 2 Jun 2007, Kyle R. Mcallister wrote:
About to go on some travels, will get some incense while I am out,
preferably something that smells nice and not like a house of ill
repute. :)
Y'know, I think incense smoke might give misleadin
On Jun 2, 2007, at 4:09 PM, Kyle R. Mcallister wrote:
William Beaty wrote:
But... there would be no ion flows near the rotor if the pingpong
balls
were truely insulating. A cloud of opposite ions would just
gather around
the pingpong balls, then all air flows (ion flows) would stop. So
On Jun 2, 2007, at 10:17 AM, Michel Jullian wrote:
- Original Message -
From: "Horace Heffner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To:
Sent: Saturday, June 02, 2007 7:38 PM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Miklos Borbas Thruster??
On Jun 2, 2007, at 8:43 AM, Michel Jullian wrote:
The stator wire tips are ori
Howdy Harry,
Seems that the price of bread is not a component of today's economic models
considering the size of the public school meals for free program that now
even extend to the summer when school is out.
The price of gasoline is keyed to the price of crude which is a commodity
traded on
On 30/5/2007 5:49 PM, Robin van Spaandonk wrote:
> In reply to Harry Veeder's message of Wed, 30 May 2007 13:41:29 -0500:
> Hi,
> [snip]
>> On 29/5/2007 12:01 AM, Robin van Spaandonk wrote:
>>
>>> In reply to Harry Veeder's message of Mon, 28 May 2007 21:17:21 -0500:
>>> Hi,
>>> [snip]
<>>
On 1/6/2007 8:27 PM, Kyle R. Mcallister wrote:
>
> 2. With no plastic covers (Miklos' ping pong balls), it works like an
> electric pinwheel, just like we used to run from a Wimshurst machine, at
> which point everyone was amused.
>
> 3. Cover the ends of the wires on the pinwheel with plastic s
On Sat, 2 Jun 2007, Kyle R. Mcallister wrote:
> About to go on some travels, will get some incense while I am out,
> preferably something that smells nice and not like a house of ill repute. :)
Y'know, I think incense smoke might give misleading results. Here's a
weird phenomenon:
Aim a HV ne
Note it may be necessary to insulate correctly not only the spinwheel's tips
but also the whole rotating arm, plus the exposed part of the spindle, to stop
the ion flow. After all it is not necessarily the balls which collect the bulk
of the ions as we have been assuming. With some luck the smok
William Beaty wrote:
But... there would be no ion flows near the rotor if the pingpong balls
were truely insulating. A cloud of opposite ions would just gather around
the pingpong balls, then all air flows (ion flows) would stop. So I bet
the pingpong balls are terrible insulators, and electr
See:
http://www.overunity.com/index.php/topic,356.0.html
Some intresting links, such as the latest page from Hydrodynamics.
Someone here reports 160% output (60% exess). I never saw anything like that,
but maybe there has been progress.
- Jed
But... there would be no ion flows near the rotor if the pingpong balls
were truely insulating. A cloud of opposite ions would just gather around
the pingpong balls, then all air flows (ion flows) would stop. So I bet
the pingpong balls are terrible insulators, and electrons are going
through t
Put this way, the hypothesis looks much more plausible :)
Michel
- Original Message -
From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To:
Sent: Sunday, June 03, 2007 1:35 AM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Miklos Borbas Thruster??
>I wrote the following
>
>> I think Borbas was expecting the win
Michel Jullian wrote:
That's good, keep us tuned if that supply doesn't get you ;-)
Regarding 3 and 4, why would you expect to see air moving outside of
the bag? The device and Newton should be happy with air moving only
inside (in the direction opposite the rotor) shouldn't they?
Actually, I t
I wrote the following
I think Borbas was expecting the wind to be coming from behind the
balls,
Re reading the above, I realize I need to use a bit more tact in writing
messages. to the uninitiated, speaking of "wind...coming from behind
the balls" might seem a bit crude. :)
--Kyl
Some one posted a link to a rubber band machine gun, which was fun. Then
I noticed a link to http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-Yy8YH13qZs&feature=dir
which was an architect talking about cleaver buildings whose design was
inspired by nature. The subject of growing food in green houses is a
frequen
Jones wrote...
there are a number of ways to approach this, if we can get away from the
heat engine limitation -- since we do have 'free' mass transport of
charge (maybe)... and induction is not only interesting... it works both
ways. Maybe.
What about using induction for the power removal? i.e.
On 2/6/2007 3:36 PM, Kyle R. Mcallister wrote:
> Indeed, the stator wires do emit a lot of wind. One thing I did find is
> that if the "stator" is mounted on the rotation shaft of the rotor, so
> it rotates with it, the thing still works. I am guessing that what
> happens is that the wires charge
That's good, keep us tuned if that supply doesn't get you ;-) Regarding 3 and
4, why would you expect to see air moving outside of the bag? The device and
Newton should be happy with air moving only inside (in the direction opposite
the rotor) shouldn't they?
Michel
- Original Message
Michel Jullian wrote:
Kyle kindly proposed to do some more tests, a smoke test with the
rotor blocked and another one without the rotor (and its spindle
bluntes) would be quite instructive!
Yes, I can probably do that in a bit. I'm off now to go deal with some
things around the house, etc.,
Horace Heffner wrote:
Even more sad. Sigh.
I had a few hopes for this one, but it looks really bad. This is just
another ion driven gadget. The ball end indeed apparently attracts (and
is attracted by) the ions in front of it and creates a wind over and
around the ping pong ball. This win
Michel Jullian wrote:
Hi Kyle,
Good work and good reporting, as always! Some comments below.
No problem, and I appreciate the kind words.
Ah yes I had forgotten about those stator bound emitters in the
Borbas device! Indeed, to develop what you say in point 8 below,
those become the strong
Hi Michael-
Interesting thought - but induction might actually split enough of the
vapor for this to occur:
http://www.metacafe.com/watch/276060/nuclear_plant_cooling_tower_implosion/
OK. That was a bit of attempted humor... but come to think of it...
there are a number of ways to approach t
Jones wrote:
> I have often wondered about using the massive cooling towers of nuclear
> power plants to move large amounts of electric charge a few hundred feet
> apart, which requires work - (which is essentially 'free' due to the
> buoyancy of waste heat in the water vapor).
> By collectin
On May 29, 2007, at 2:17 PM, Robin van Spaandonk wrote:
In reply to Horace Heffner's message of Tue, 29 May 2007 12:28:49
-0800:
Hi,
[snip]
Regarding D + Pd cold fusion cathode conditions, Hora and Miley write
[1]: "The screened deuterons are mutually repulsed by their Coulomb
field at dist
- Original Message -
From: "Horace Heffner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To:
Sent: Saturday, June 02, 2007 7:38 PM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Miklos Borbas Thruster??
>
> On Jun 2, 2007, at 8:43 AM, Michel Jullian wrote:
>
>>>
>>> The stator wire tips are oriented radially. Their ion wind is
>>> orie
Correction:
Oh, I forgot to mention: if anything of commercial value is to be
obtained from any of this, now that replication plus understanding
has pretty much shown even pulsed DC to be useless, then tests should
be run using AC, no stator wires, minimized corona discharges.
Regards,
H
Oh, I forgot to mention: if anything of commercial value is to be
obtained from any of this, now that replication plus understanding
has pretty much shown even pulsed DC to be useless, then tests should
be run using AC.
Regards,
Horace Heffner
On Jun 2, 2007, at 8:34 AM, Jones Beene wrote:
Horace
Unfortunately the energy you can get from gas buoyancy is way less
than the heat energy to get that buoyancy. Solar towers, for
example, run at less than 2% efficiency.
Yes but that is due to low Delta-T no? ...
No, it is not a
On Jun 2, 2007, at 8:43 AM, Michel Jullian wrote:
The stator wire tips are oriented radially. Their ion wind is
oriented radially. The field of the balls deflects that radial wind
towards themselves. That deflection is clockwise as viewed from the
top, for the device in the first photos of
- Original Message -
From: "Horace Heffner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To:
Sent: Saturday, June 02, 2007 5:10 PM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Miklos Borbas Thruster??
>
> On Jun 2, 2007, at 6:59 AM, Michel Jullian wrote:
>
>>
>> - Original Message -
>> From: "Horace Heffner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Horace
Unfortunately the energy you can get from gas buoyancy is way less than
the heat energy to get that buoyancy. Solar towers, for example, run at
less than 2% efficiency.
Yes but that is due to low Delta-T no? ... the $64 question - is there
an advantage to the addition of charge?
On Jun 2, 2007, at 7:47 AM, Jones Beene wrote:
If one could convert this into electricity at 5% efficiency, then
the system required to do that would easily have a market value
(worth) of ~10% of the cost of the nuclear plant itself !
Unfortunately the energy you can get from gas buoyancy
With summer here... Brrr ... almost every location in the USA (except
the West Coast of California) will see thunderclouds and lightning.
These high energy phenomena require a source of ground level heat -
rising from earth to interact with moisture in the 'right kind' of dense
cloud layer.
T
On Jun 2, 2007, at 6:59 AM, Michel Jullian wrote:
- Original Message -
From: "Horace Heffner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To:
Sent: Saturday, June 02, 2007 4:15 PM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Miklos Borbas Thruster??
...
I suspect the asymmetry in the the shape of the field in front of the
ping pong
On May 29, 2007, at 2:17 PM, Robin van Spaandonk wrote:
In reply to Horace Heffner's message of Tue, 29 May 2007 12:28:49
-0800:
Hi,
[snip]
Regarding D + Pd cold fusion cathode conditions, Hora and Miley write
[1]: "The screened deuterons are mutually repulsed by their Coulomb
field at dist
- Original Message -
From: "Horace Heffner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To:
Sent: Saturday, June 02, 2007 4:15 PM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Miklos Borbas Thruster??
...
> I suspect the asymmetry in the the shape of the field in front of the
> ping pong balls is important. I expect the field attract
On Jun 2, 2007, at 3:15 AM, Michel Jullian wrote:
4. Put "corona wires" fanning out from the axis of rotation of the
pinwheel, about 3 inches below it, and pointed so that they emit
radially, and not tangentially (so they contribute little to any
wind-caused thrust) and the thing begins spinnin
On Jun 1, 2007, at 5:27 PM, Kyle R. Mcallister wrote:
Howdy folks,
Well, I bit (past tense of "I'll bite") so I made one of these
things and tested it.
Awesome! I just go away for a bit, and you pretty much have this
thing wrapped up!
It does work, as Miklos Borbas says, but some t
- Original Message -
From: "Horace Heffner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To:
Sent: Saturday, June 02, 2007 3:13 AM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Miklos Borbas Thruster??
>
> On Jun 1, 2007, at 4:15 PM, Michel Jullian wrote:
>
>>
>> - Original Message -
>> From: "Horace Heffner" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]
Hi Kyle,
Good work and good reporting, as always! Some comments below.
- Original Message -
From: "Kyle R. Mcallister" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
To:
Sent: Saturday, June 02, 2007 3:27 AM
Subject: Re: [Vo]:Miklos Borbas Thruster??
> Howdy folks,
>
> Well, I bit (past tense of "I'll bite") s
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