Re: [Vo]:does classical mechanics always fail to predict or retrodict for 3 or more Newtonian gravity bodies? Rich Murray 2011.02.18

2011-02-20 Thread Abd ul-Rahman Lomax
At 10:17 PM 2/18/2011, Rich Murray wrote: does classical mechanics always fail to predict or retrodict for 3 or more Newtonian gravity bodies? Rich Murray 2011.02.18 I think there is a misconception here. There isn't any true two-body or three-body problem because there are far, far more than

Re: [Vo]:does classical mechanics always fail to predict or retrodict for 3 or more Newtonian gravity bodies? Rich Murray 2011.02.18

2011-02-19 Thread Charles Hope
Yes, the Devil is in the details. It pays to know just how much Devil is in there, and in old school 8 bit BASIC, there is much. Classical Mechanics gives results that are reversible. So if the model isn't, it's just a numerical flaw, and not a profound fact about physics. Sent from my

Re: [Vo]:does classical mechanics always fail to predict or retrodict for 3 or more Newtonian gravity bodies? Rich Murray 2011.02.18

2011-02-19 Thread Stephen A. Lawrence
On 02/18/2011 10:17 PM, Rich Murray wrote: does classical mechanics always fail to predict or retrodict for 3 or more Newtonian gravity bodies? Rich Murray 2011.02.18 [ ... ] In fall, 1982, I wrote a 200-line program in Basic for the Timex-Sinclair $100 computer with 20KB RAM that would

Re: [Vo]:does classical mechanics always fail to predict or retrodict for 3 or more Newtonian gravity bodies? Rich Murray 2011.02.18

2011-02-19 Thread Rich Murray
Hello Stephen A. Lawrence, Thanks for the informative answer. It'd be impressive if the most accurate methods since this review in 1987 agree with each other far into the future and past -- how can we find out the details about results for the 3-body problem, in commonsense terms? Is this

RE: [Vo]:does classical mechanics always fail to predict or retrodict for 3 or more Newtonian gravity bodies? Rich Murray 2011.02.18

2011-02-19 Thread Abd ul-Rahman Lomax
At 11:12 PM 2/18/2011, OrionWorks - Steven Vincent Johnson wrote: Congratulations on your Sinclair project. I started on a TRS-80. Heh! Well, *I* -- the word is drawn out -- started on an Altair 8800. Pthtpthhh!

RE: [Vo]:does classical mechanics always fail to predict or retrodict for 3 or more Newtonian gravity bodies? Rich Murray 2011.02.18

2011-02-19 Thread OrionWorks - Steven Vincent Johnson
Jacques Laskar and his colleague Mickal Gastineau in 2009 took a more thorough approach by directly simulating 2500 possible futures. Each of the 2500 cases has slightly different initial conditions: Mercury's position varies by about 1 metre between one simulation and the next.[13] In 20

RE: [Vo]:does classical mechanics always fail to predict or retrodict for 3 or more Newtonian gravity bodies? Rich Murray 2011.02.18

2011-02-18 Thread OrionWorks - Steven Vincent Johnson
Hi Rick, I've been very busy with all the rabble rousing going on at the State Capital. I'm currently uploading more videos of the situation at the Capital. Don't know if I can answer your question thoroughly. But I'll do what I can. I'm not an expert on the matter. However it's my

Re: [Vo]:does classical mechanics always fail to predict or retrodict for 3 or more Newtonian gravity bodies? Rich Murray 2011.02.18

2011-02-18 Thread Charles Hope
I'm thinking your findings of irreversibility reflected the idiosyncrasies of floating point math represented in binary numbers, and not the physics itself. Sent from my iPhone. On Feb 18, 2011, at 22:17, Rich Murray rmfor...@gmail.com wrote: does classical mechanics always fail to predict

RE: [Vo]:does classical mechanics always fail to predict or retrodict for 3 or more Newtonian gravity bodies? Rich Murray 2011.02.18

2011-02-18 Thread OrionWorks - Steven Vincent Johnson
I'm thinking your findings of irreversibility reflected the idiosyncrasies of floating point math represented in binary numbers, and not the physics itself. I'm not sure what you mean by irreversibility but if you are referring to my Celestial Mechanics computer programs, I have never stated

Re: [Vo]:does classical mechanics always fail to predict or retrodict for 3 or more Newtonian gravity bodies? Rich Murray 2011.02.18

2011-02-18 Thread Rich Murray
The only access to the physics itself we have with finite nervous systems is by using digital approximations with finite number strings, processed by algorithms of finite instruction size, so there are always round-off errors, which always diverge without limit, even if there are no close