Norton, Steve wrote:
Dick and Scott,
I hope you don't mind me combining both of your questions into one response
since there is an overlap in subject matter.
It is generally accepted that you cannot make a stable EIS solution above 30 ppm. However, there is a method claimed to be able to make EIS as high as 500 ppm. It will of course be a dark color but it is also claimed that when sufficiently diluted, it will return to a light yellow color.( I would assume that at that point you could add a little H2O2 to produce a clear solution.)
See:
http://www.silverceramicsystems.com/CS16-5-3.html
Recent Success at Concentrated CS Production
Points Up Requirement of Very Pure, Distilled Water
That fellow used to be a member of this list. We all assisted him (
made suggestions ) on his silver impregnated filtering clay. Anyway,
the page is very interesting. First from reading it it appears that one
could use high quality distilled water for both the double boiler and
colloid water. Realizing that this is for areas where labor is cheap,
and equipment expensive, there are a number of ways one could reduce the
energy requirements, water requirements and labor requirements.
1. Use a timer to switch polarity as I presently do with my flow through
system
2. Use a thermistor and temperature controller to maintain the desired
temperature of the colloid without using a double boiler arrangement (a
thermometer and a temperature controlled heating base could do it.)
That said, I think I do understand what is happening. Our limit of 20
ppm, which includes the ionic silver primarily, is set by the solubility
of the ionic silver at room temperature. Since that arrangement is
heating the solution then two things happen. First the solubility of
the silver oxide goes up significantly, from about 13 ppm to over 50
ppm. In addition the Browning movement will increase tremendously.
Now if you increase the ion concentration, the probability of a
collision between oxide or hydroxide silver ions increases by the
square, so that alone should cause the colloidal portion to go up by a
factor of about 20 to 25, setting the limit to about 400 to 500 ppm. The
increase in Browning movement adds to this ability, especially of an ion
and colloidal particle banging into each other. Not limiting the
current also adds to the particle size thereby allowing a higher silver
concentration.
Now the colloid turns red. That indicates that the particle size of the
colloid is much higher than optimum. Thus far it all makes pretty good
sense. However they say that if you dilute it down to 20 ppm or so, it
returns back to a light yellow, indicating small near optimum particle
size. That does not make sense to me.
I only have one theory as to how that is even possible. This is just a
theory, and it could well be very very wrong. At the increased
concentration and temperature, we end up with silver oxide and/or silver
hydroxide ions colliding with silver particles, and they "stick"
together. Once this happens, another silver particle can collide with
the ion stuck to the first silver particle, making two particle stuck
together with an oxygen or hydroxyl ion. This produces what appears to
be a larger silver particle, although it is really made up of smaller
particles stuck together by an oxygen or hydroxyl ions. Think of a
popcorn ball, where the popcorn is the silver particles, and the sugar
is the oxygen or hydroxide ions. Now, this is a stable arrangement,
since the solution is at the solubility limit of silver
oxide/hydroxide. However if you dilute it, the silver oxide/hydroxide
"glue" dissolves back into the water, unglueing the silver particles,
which are now small. Thus it will reconstitute back to good, but not
necessarily excellent EIS equivalent.
I have GOT to try this. This could be one of the most exciting
discoveries in this field in years.
Marshall
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