Hi Sam, and the folks... Oxidation has a more specific technical meaning than ordinarily used. And, it is inherently confusing. I spend quite a few hours grinding through basic college chem texts trying to reduce [there's that word] my own confusion.
I also have the problem of not trusting much of what we have been given to explain things, because I think there is much intentional misinformation....and missing information ---in fundamental science education. It does require patience and persevering attention. I look at today's students, blasting joints, swilling bad beer, and obsessed with the search for snatch---as I was, and wish I had the luxury to just study what I find interesting and worthwhile. What's that old saying..."Youth is wasted on the young". This list is a gold mine of people who have a lot of knowledge and who will share it with you---as time permits, provided you are in teachable state of mind. Get a high-school or first year general chemistry text and look up "redox" or "oxidation and reduction" . It gets easier if you look up every word you do not know. Good fortune with your understanding. James Osbourne Holmes [email protected] -----Original Message----- From: Sam Earle [SMTP:[email protected]] Sent: Wednesday, October 27, 1999 3:18 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: CS>Colloid? was baking soda James, Thanks for a gentlemanly, intelligent answer that leaves me more confused than ever. + + ^ \_/ Sam > Yes, Sam, there is an argument with that, > > and, I predict you will hear from Ivan shortly... > > Oxidation and reduction always occur together. An electron > donator---almost always a metal---is called a reducing agent and is said to > be oxidized when it donates the -e. The electron receptor is called the > oxidizing agent, and in the process is said to be reduced. The process is > reversible under some conditions. I think there is some historical > connection with oxygen, which is certainly an oxidizing agent. What you > are describing is the creation of silver oxide, not a charged colloidal > particle. > > These processes take place with electrons of the atoms outer shells. The > charges present are called the valence of the atom or ion. It is not > clear to myself how the positive charge on a cluster of silver atoms > originates, but I don't think it is the valence charge of a single Ag atom > which is a part of the cluster. > > There is no such thing as a free proton in an aqueous solution, as a > hydrogen atom missing its electron; a nude proton bobbing around with its > plus hanging out. Instead, the h+ gets involved with a water molecule to > become H30+. > > Now, pure speculation: Or, is it possible that it gets 'associated' with a > cluster of Ag? Trapped inside a micelle with a bunch of negative ends of > some water structure? Data, are you there..., talk to me... > > If it were a missing electron, would not the Ag atom hitch up with some > passing oxidizing agent hussy? > > This issue, the cause of the charge, is the source of much discussion, and > even some small amount of contention on this list. > > There must be someone lurking out there who is who knows, and is sitting > back yucking as we founder about with these rube questions. > > Where is Robert Hunter when we need him the most.... > > James Osbourne Holmes > [email protected] > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Sam Earle [SMTP:[email protected]] > Sent: Tuesday, October 26, 1999 1:53 PM > To: [email protected] > Subject: Re: CS>Colloid? was baking soda > > >Positively charged silver particles are already oxidised (lost an > >electron). > > I've seen this said several times, and at the risk of having my ears boxed > by the real scientists on the list, I have to say it looks like nonsense. > The loss of an electron gives a positive charge. That's not oxidation. > Oxidation is picking up an oxygen atom and thus becoming part of a > compound -- an oxide. > > Any argument with that? > > Sam > > > > -- > The silver-list is a moderated forum for discussion of colloidal silver. > > To join or quit silver-list or silver-digest send an e-mail message to: > [email protected] -or- [email protected] > with the word subscribe or unsubscribe in the SUBJECT line. > > To post, address your message to: [email protected] > > List maintainer: Mike Devour <[email protected]> >
