I'd question that as well but not as an incidental use (typically storage,
mechanical, trash and special hazards rooms requiring protection - IBC
508.2(2006) - PS They moved this from Chapter 3 to Chapter 5 in 2006), but
as accessory using IBC 508.3.1(2006). Accessory occupancies are "subsidiary"
to the main occupancy and can be up to 10% of the area of the story in which
they are located. However they can never exceed the Height and Area
provisions of Table 503 for the type of construction.  But there are
exceptions 1st; up to 750 s.f. is exempt for accessory assemblies (that's
pretty big; 27' X 27') 2nd; The gymnasiums and auditoirums of Occcupany E,
i.e. Schools K-12. (But be careful there, the occupancy must be for
education K-12, many have questioned the use of these "facilities" for
quasi-private assembly uses) and 3rd; Religious education and auditorium
with occupant loads under 100 people.

Ok so with that said if Georges Offices and Classrooms fit the T503/ 10% /
750sf criteria then the mixed use classification can be revised as
"accessory occupancy". But check local regulations, in New Jersey if it's an
existing building and theres residential above, and the work area is 50% of
the gross area, then a one hour fire seperation is required, N.J.A.C.
5:23-6.

If not then its mixed use. But how did the architect get to A3 ?. College
classrooms and offices are Occupancy B not A3. (IBC 304- 2006), is there a
lecture hall or some other concentrated non classroom space in there ?. Also
be careful that the basement doesn't get used as storage. Over 100sf or
you'll find yourself back at IBC 508.2(2006) with a) fire separation or b)
fire suppression and over 10% / 750 s.f. reclassification to S2.  You'll end
up as A3/R2/S2 or B/R2/S2 ;-).

Don't forget the alarms, means of egress including but not limited to
emergency escape and rescue windows, emergency lighting, fire extinguishers,
etc. 

PS, Whats 13TR ?, something like 13K ? (yes I still think its viable).

John Drucker
Fire Protection Subcode Official (AHJ)
New Jersey



-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Joe Burtell
Sent: Friday, February 09, 2007 4:57 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: Residential?

Well, there could be opening protection trade-offs, rating, building type,
and so on. I would think if the A-3 was incidental the architect would have
just called it a R2. He didn't so I am guessing the occupancies are not
incidential and 13 would be required. 

Joe Burtell, SET, CFPS
Burtell Fire Protection, Inc.
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
www.burtellfire.com
 

-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of George Church
Sent: Friday, February 09, 2007 2:35 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: Residential?

Well, it wouldn't have been for an area increase !
Seriously, I haven't even seen the full set of docs yet. 
But I doubt there were any, egress isn't stretched at all- 60' travel max.

-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Joe Burtell
Sent: Friday, February 09, 2007 4:08 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: RE: Residential?

It will depend on the exceptions the architect took for trade-offs. Some of
the trade-offs allow you to install per 13 or 13R, some only allow 13. Did
he take any trade-offs? 

Joe Burtell, SET, CFPS
Burtell Fire Protection, Inc.
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
www.burtellfire.com
 
-----Original Message-----
From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
[mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of George Church
Sent: Friday, February 09, 2007 2:06 PM
To: [email protected]
Subject: Residential?


We have a project in which the majority of the building is dorm rooms;
2nd flr (top) is all dorms, with a few more dorm rooms and a few classrooms
and offices on the first floor. Small basement is mechanical only. 
Entire building footprint is a whopping

The classrooms are for the use of the students that reside in the dorm; 
Offices for faculty that teach there. 

Overall concept is suburban campus college has this building in the city for
students to study government and urban life. So the non-residential areas
are incidental to the residential nature of the building.

The Architect has deemed the building A3 for the first floor, R2 on 2nd
floor. Naturally the one hour separation is at the first floor ceiling.

If this sounds a little strange, at least it's not #13TR, elderly housing
over tire storage:)  This IS located in a locale where 13d tank/pumps feed 3
story office buildings, with poly tanks located in restaurant storage area,
and CPVC in OH2. Sure, that will make the judge understand ?

Anyway, would % of use and other uses being for the occupants make this look
#13R to any of you?

George Church
Rowe Sprinkler

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