Todd,

Your drinking water is non-potable after it crosses your property line
according to some purveyors of potable water. Pools are a slam
dunk--they have chlorine added that wasn't added by the purveyor. In
Seattle there's a water bottling company that has an RPBA on the
incoming line from the city to their purifying equipment since once it
enters the building it's considered process water.

On 10/9/07, Todd Williams - FPDC <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> Is a swimming pool considered a non-potable water source? Should I be
> doing tours of the neighborhood to determine if there are NP sources?
> (Cha-ching, my price just went up.) Oceans, rivers and lakes are
> obvious, but where does it stop? What about if the location is 1500
> ft from the water source and 250 ft of it is vertical drop (actual case)?
>
>
> At 06:43 PM 10/9/2007, Garth W. Warren wrote:
> >Gayle - if the systems are within 1700 feet of a non potable water source
> >they are supposed to be RPZs anyway. or if you have A-F.  Also be wary of
> >the installation location, a RPZ can not be placed below grade regardless
> >where the DCV is unless a gravity drain capable of handling the discharge of
> >the device when it fouls is present.  Just because a DCV is installed in a
> >pit and has to be changed out does not allow you to place the RPZ in the
> >pit.  DCV and RPZ are NOT the same protection.
> >Sounds like you need to ask politely for the Code section that is being
> >referenced so that you might have it handy for the next project.  If it can
> >be produced, comply.
> >
> >Garth
> >----- Original Message -----
> >From: "GAYLE KNOWLES" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> >To: <[email protected]>
> >Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2007 1:26 PM
> >Subject: RE: Double-check vs RPs
> >
> >
> >
> >Thanks for the info.  I guess what I'm looking for is something that states
> >that all these existing double-check backflows are not a threat and
> >replacing them all with RPZ is a lot of unnecessary extra cost for the
> >owner.  As Matt stated, it may very well be a losing argument as long as it
> >has been "adopted".  The info will be used to fight to keep the existing
> >double-checks.> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:10:20 -0400> From:
> >[EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [email protected]> Subject: RE:
> >Double-check vs RPs> > Gayle, Perhaps our regulations in New Jersey would be
> >of assistance.> > John Drucker, Fire Protection Subcode Official,
> >NJ> ------------------------------------------------------------------------
> > > ------> > STATE OF NEW JERSEY> > DEPARTMENT OF ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION> >
> >BUREAU OF SAFE DRINKING WATER> > SAFE DRINKING WATER ACT REGULATIONS> >
> >(N.J.A.C. 7:10)> > ADOPTED: November 4, 2004> > 7:10-10.4 Installation> >
> >(a) The approved physical connection installation shall be> installed on the
> >customer's side of the water meter on the> pipe(s) conveying the water from
> >the public community water> system into a facility, shall be installed as
> >close to the meter as> is reasonably practicable, and shall be prior to any
> >other> connection, unless such other connection is also protected by> means
> >of an approved physical connection installation. For a> fire service line,
> >the approved physical connection installation> shall be installed prior to
> >the alarm check and siamese> connection.> (b) The approved physical
> >connection installation shall be> installed so as to allow easy access, with
> >adequate space for> maintenance, inspection, and testing. No part of the
> >device> shall be submerged or subjected to freezing temperatures unless>
> >such part is thermally protected.> > (c) The approved physical connection
> >installation shall not> be installed in a pit or vault.> > 1. This
> >subsection shall not apply to any physical> connection installation operated
> >under a current physical> connection permit issued before the operative date
> >of this> chapter until such time as the existing physical connection>
> >installation is replaced or modified> >
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> At 06:48 PM 10/9/2007, GAYLE KNOWLES wrote:
>
> >Not a code violation, just a new code is wanting to come into
> >playGayle Knowles, SET
> >
> >
> > > Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:43:13 -0400> From:
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [email protected]>
> > Subject: RE: Double-check vs RPs> > Gayle,> > Off the top of my
> > head (which means it not nor will be enforceable glc!)> perhaps the
> > installed BFP is an existing code violation ?. Yea it> happens
> > stuff gets approved that shouldn't be. The water purveyor may> have
> > simply caught it. However RPZ's in submersable locations has to
> > the> best of my knowledge been prohibited.> > While we are on that
> > subject, remember a code violation is a violation> forever despite
> > what "approval" you may have in hand. > > John Drucker> Fire
> > Protection Subcode Official> New Jersey > > -----Original
> > Message-----> From: [EMAIL PROTECTED]>
> > [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of
> > GAYLE> KNOWLES> Sent: Tuesday, October 09, 2007 2:26 PM> To:
> > [email protected]> Subject: RE: Double-check vs
> > RPs> > > Thanks for the info. I guess what I'm looking for is
> > something that> states that all these existing double-check
> > backflows are not a threat> and replacing them all with RPZ is a
> > lot of unnecessary extra cost for> the owner. As Matt stated, it
> > may very well be a losing argument as> long as it has been
> > "adopted". The info will be used to fight to keep> the existing
> > double-checks.> Date: Tue, 9 Oct 2007 14:10:20 -0400> From:>
> > [EMAIL PROTECTED]> To: [email protected]>
> > Subject:> RE: Double-check vs RPs> > Gayle, Perhaps our regulations
> > in New Jersey> would be of assistance.> > John Drucker, Fire
> > Protection Subcode> Official, NJ>>
> > ------------------------------------------------------------------------>
> >  > ------> > STATE OF NEW JERSEY> > DEPARTMENT OF ENVIRONMENTAL>
> > PROTECTION> > BUREAU OF SAFE DRINKING WATER> > SAFE DRINKING WATER
> > ACT> REGULATIONS> > (N.J.A.C. 7:10)> > ADOPTED: November 4, 2004> >
> > 7:10-10.4> Installation> > (a) The approved physical connection
> > installation shall> be> installed on the customer's side of the
> > water meter on the> pipe(s)> conveying the water from the public
> > community water> system into a> facility, shall be installed as
> > close to the meter as> is reasonably> practicable, and shall be
> > prior to any other> connection, unless such> other connection is
> > also protected by> means of an approved physical> connection
> > installation. For a> fire service line, the approved physical>
> > connection installation> shall be installed prior to the alarm
> > check and> siamese> connection.> (b) The approved physical
> > connection installation> shall be> installed so as to allow easy
> > access, with adequate space for>> maintenance, inspection, and
> > testing. No part of the device> shall be> submerged or subjected to
> > freezing temperatures unless> such part is> thermally protected.> >
> > (c) The approved physical connection> installation shall not> be
> > installed in a pit or vault.> > 1. This> subsection shall not apply
> > to any physical> connection installation> operated under a current
> > physical> connection permit issued before the> operative date of
> > this> chapter until such time as the existing physical> connection>
> > installation is replaced or modified> >>
> > _______________________________________________> Sprinklerforum
> > mailing> list> [email protected]>>
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> Todd G. Williams, PE
> Fire Protection Design/Consulting
> Stonington, Connecticut
> www.fpdc.com
> 860.535.2080
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-- 
Ron Greenman
at home....
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