George,
It bothers me a lot because the first fire I investigated in 1993 had a rock in the orifice of the sprinkler over the deep fat fryer where the fire started that opened over 80 sprinklers. I have seen significant $ losses when grass (green), asphalt, twigs, and rocks get into the sprinkler system and the domestic equipment (ice maker, dishwasher, hot water heater, and so on) because the underground hasn't been flushed properly. It costs more to rip them out and clean them out then put them in the first time. Our bid documents require the flushing and testing in accordance with 13 and 24 before the sprinkler contractor connects (for our liability and to protect the sprinkler contractor). Unfortunately the AHJ's don't enforce this, the general contractors don't enforce it, and in general the sprinkler systems get connected anyway. In addition, our plan reviews require completed u.g. certificates before the C.O. is completed. The u.g. certificates are rarely furnished. I used to project manage sprinkler and special system installation more than I do now, and it frequently included u.g. I often used the same u.g. contractor throughout the Midwest and he ALWAYS told me, I never flush and test u.g. that way. Every time I'd tell him, you always do for me. Fortunately, my client allowed me to make sure the testing was completed and I would watch every time to see it done. So, apparently the "never flush and test" is the norm, unless someone forces the issue. As usual, enforcement seems to be the missing link. Scott (763) 425-1001 Office (612) 759-5556 Cell -----Original Message----- From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of George Church Sent: Thursday, September 11, 2008 1:28 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Flushing and Testing of UG While many site contractors understand and comply with the flushing requirements of NFPA #24, we routinely encounter some that simply do not understand and/or play dumb as a roofer when we explain the requirements to them. Some of these guys have been in business upwards of 50 years, and from the look on their faces, they've never heard of flows of this magnitude; and they don't understand why the 150 PSI accepted by the water company isn't good enough, after all- it's a water line! We often feel like we're the policing agency and we spend about 40 to 80 hours a year educating these guys and emailing the U Certificate pdf around. The GCs generally understand the need to flush properly and when I explain plugged sprinklers, liability, and negligence issues/impacts to them, and they realize they have a vested interest in seeing that it is done properly, they're on our side. We often, like today, end up with the flushing being added to our contract. Usually its not a big deal; today's is a little unusual since we need to rent a temporary pump (2,000 @ 150) to accomplish it, 6 Hose Monsters, and there are 8 lead-ins for this >800,000 SF building; so it'll be $15~20K. So my question is: Do any of you encounter the same level of ignorance from site contractors as we do? Do you bother getting a U Certificate to attach to you're a Certificate? If you're an AHJ on this Forum, do you enforce and witness flushing and testing of the underground on a regular basis? Either the site guys are playing dumb, or no other sprinkler guy or inspector has explained the requirements to them. Since they don't have the equipment to perform a proper flush, its obvious to us that there must be a host of UG installations that have all the original stones in the UG. Does this bother any of you? I don't feel warm and fuzzy about it. George Church Rowe Sprinkler _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field) _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list http://lists.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum For Technical Assistance, send an email to: [EMAIL PROTECTED] To Unsubscribe, send an email to:[EMAIL PROTECTED] (Put the word unsubscribe in the subject field)
