None of this stuff matters. The reality is if 150% isn't there, it doesn't mean you somehow have to come up with it. Its how you test WHEN AND IF YOU HAVE IT. if you have only what you need to meet the system demand, that's fine- and all you need.
Todd, you have prime candidate for Clarke's PLD. If its a big enough engine, and likely is, the PLD is coming out 3rd or 4th Q 2009 for the tier III's. If it's not big enough to fall into the tier II requirements, the old sensing line version available for years will work. They have variable speed PLD-ready Tier III's available for shipment now, we just installed one and will be retrofitting this 526 HP monster with PLD when the PLD hits mkt after apvl process is completed and production starts. The PLD should be able to allow you a LOT more flexibility in picking a pump, you'll have 170 discharge until the pump + residual drops below 170 and the engine runs at full speed, does what its supposed to, and you'll be in compliance with 03 restriction of truncating supplies with main relief valve that has to be one of the best-kept secrets in the industry. We're pricing up retrofit of a Dec 2008 installation of a big ESFR warehouse supply diesel, churns at 205, and -well, the sprinkie went under and I guess if you're still reading '99 #20 or not reading it at all, then you go out of business like these guys did. Being a young outfit and 2/3 everyone else's price also will put u outa business. $.78/SF for K22 system in >40' bldg, what were they thinking? This was bid before the economy plummeted. My aurora rep is well-versed in PLDs, anyone sharp and who can get a Clarke diesel on their pump should be able to help. PLD calculator to see if engine speed works with your pressure particulars is on Clarke's website if you end up investigating over the weekend. I'll be working some of it, rest of it I'll be having fun and drinks with a friend I met on the Forum and cemented the relationship- at AFSA conventions! Glc TGIF -----Original Message----- From: [email protected] [mailto:[email protected]] On Behalf Of Ralphy Henderson Sent: Friday, August 28, 2009 2:00 PM To: [email protected] Subject: Re: lack of suction volume But can NFPA 25 be invoked since this is a new fire pump going in and not an existing one? --- On Fri, 8/28/09, Michael O'Brian <[email protected]> wrote: From: Michael O'Brian <[email protected]> Subject: Re: lack of suction volume To: "[email protected]" <[email protected]> Date: Friday, August 28, 2009, 5:54 PM Todd One that comes to mind was an old warehouse that the fm found with inadequate sprinkler density for plastic storage The incoming water could not flow 150% so it was tested to 100 % and the insurance was okay, the fm just wanted to make sure he could fall back on code. Case was made on options and why 150 couldn't be achieved Michael O'Brian Code Savvy Consultants www.codesavvyconsultamts.com www.inspector911.com Office: 313-618-6401 Cell: 810-459-0116 On Aug 28, 2009, at 1:27 PM, Todd Williams <[email protected]> wrote: > I am working on a warehouse which presently has very inadequate > protection. One of the improvements needed is a fire pump. I have two > options: a 1500 at 95 or a 2000 at 80. We can't go over the 95 psi or > we end up with a churn pressure over 175 psi. However, the flow drops > to 20 psi at 2400 gpm. The ESFR system I am recommending requires > about 1950 gpm, including hose streams (the fire pump will have to > supply hose streams as well). I want to use the 2000 gpm pump because > it gives me better hydraulics, however, I can't test to 150% flow. > NFPA 25 says "If available suction supplies do not allow flowing of > 150 percent of the rated pump capacity, the fire pump shall be > permitted to operate at maximum allowable discharge." Has anyone > successfully presented this to an insurance company and Fire Marshal > on a new installation and got them to go along? Any hints on how to > present it? > > Todd G. Williams, PE > Fire Protection Design/Consulting > Stonington, Connecticut > www.fpdc.com > 860.535.2080 > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing list [email protected] http://fireball.firesprinkler.org/mailman/listinfo/sprinklerforum
