John, so that's pretty much the reason I asked this question; there's no compartment but I do have 4 contiguous sprinklers that are open to the elements. If this were a '13 system I think it would be cut and dry since the compartment requirement goes away - being a 13R system it's a bit of a gray area, however, I just calc all four of them and call it a day but it kind of sucks when you're forced to increase a lot of main from 1 1/4" to 1 1/2" in a building w/ little room for install, consisting of TJI construction and ceilings being installed tight to the underside of them.
<https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail&utm_term=icon> Virus-free. www.avast.com <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail&utm_term=link> <#DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2> On Tue, Mar 10, 2020 at 7:48 AM John Denhardt via Sprinklerforum < [email protected]> wrote: > That's my point. Calculated the sprinklers that are on any single > balcony. If the balconies are continuous, keep adding sprinklers to a > maximum of 4 sprinklers. However, if there are separations between the > balconies, do not extend just to reach 4 sprinklers. > > The issue i have is the typical balcony is not considered a compartment as > no walls exists. So, in accordance with NFPA 13R, where is the compartment? > > Thanks. > John > John August Denhardt, PE > *Vice President, Engineering and Technical Services* > > *American Fire Sprinkler Association* > m: p: 301-343-1457 > 214-349-5965 ext 121 > w: firesprinkler.org > <https://www.facebook.com/firesprinkler.org/> > <https://twitter.com/afsa/status/1039528345367732224> > <https://www.linkedin.com/company/american-fire-sprinkler-association-afsa-/> > <https://www.instagram.com/firesprinklerorg/> > > *Grow your business with ITM.* > > Professionalize the role of your inspection team with AFSA’s comprehensive > 20-month ITM Inspector Development program that provides a blended learning > environment teamed with robust curriculum created by top industry leaders. Now > enrolling <https://www.firesprinkler.org/itm> for Spring 2020. > > > On Tue, Mar 10, 2020 at 4:31 AM Fpdcdesign via Sprinklerforum < > [email protected]> wrote: > >> First, even if it is not required by the standard, you would calculate it >> as if it was. >> >> Second, is the design such that a single balcony requires 4 or more >> sprinklers? >> >> >> On Mar 10, 2020 at 12:23 AM, <J H via Sprinklerforum >> <[email protected]>> wrote: >> >> I don't doubt their efficacy or necessity - my question is essentially >> how do you calculate an area that is not required to be sprinklered by the >> standard in the first place and does not meet w/ the definition of a >> compartment? I'll just go ahead and do a four head calc for this balcony >> like I always do but I was wondering what others were doing. My second >> thought would be to just size the piping to the balcony sprinklers using >> the same interior pipe sizes without calculating it as it's own >> compartment. We've had similar situations arise when jurisdictions required >> limited attic protection in 13D systems and didn't give any guidance on how >> to calculate the required quick response sprinklers they were requiring at >> the ridge. >> >> >> <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail&utm_term=icon> >> Virus-free. >> www.avast.com >> <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail&utm_term=link> >> <#m_2146389310944593343_m_-6760020793219401511_DAB4FAD8-2DD7-40BB-A1B8-4E2AA1F9FDF2> >> >> On Fri, Mar 6, 2020 at 4:33 PM Bruce Verhei via Sprinklerforum < >> [email protected]> wrote: >> >>> >>> >>> https://www-dailyherald-com.cdn.ampproject.org/c/s/www.dailyherald.com/amp-article/20200221/news/200229736/ >>> >>> Balcony fire, spk head. >>> >>> On Mar 6, 2020, at 13:11, Pete Schwab via Sprinklerforum < >>> [email protected]> wrote: >>> >>> We only calculate the single balcony in question. >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> Peter Schwab >>> >>> VP of Purchasing and Engineering technologies >>> >>> >>> >>> Wayne Automatic Fire Sprinklers Inc. >>> >>> 222 Capitol Court >>> >>> Ocoee, Fl 34761 >>> >>> >>> >>> *Mobile: (407) 468-8248* >>> >>> Direct: (407) 877-5570 >>> >>> Fax: (407) 656-8026 >>> >>> >>> >>> www.waynefire.com >>> >>> >>> >>> <image001.jpg> >>> >>> >>> >>> <image002.png> >>> >>> >>> >>> *I sleep in a sprinklered home, do you? * >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> *From:* Sprinklerforum <[email protected]> *On >>> Behalf Of *J H via Sprinklerforum >>> *Sent:* Friday, March 6, 2020 3:52 PM >>> *To:* [email protected] >>> *Cc:* J H <[email protected]> >>> *Subject:* How are you guys handling calcs for 13R balconies? >>> >>> >>> >>> I was wondering how you guys are handling calculations for 13R balconies >>> since the sprinklers aren't even required per 13R but are mandated by the >>> IBC? Treating it as a compartment in this case means I have to do a 4 head >>> calc when the rest of the project only requires 2 heads calculated due to >>> compartmentalization. It's not a big deal but kind of a bummer when you can >>> have really small pipe sizes for a project if it weren't for those pesky >>> guys on the balcony! >>> >>> >>> >>> J >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> >>> <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail&utm_term=icon> >>> >>> Virus-free. www.avast.com >>> <https://www.avast.com/sig-email?utm_medium=email&utm_source=link&utm_campaign=sig-email&utm_content=webmail&utm_term=link> >>> >>> >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Sprinklerforum mailing list >>> [email protected] >>> >>> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org >>> >>> _______________________________________________ >>> Sprinklerforum mailing list >>> [email protected] >>> >>> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org >>> >> _______________________________________________ Sprinklerforum mailing >> list [email protected] >> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org >> >> _______________________________________________ >> Sprinklerforum mailing list >> [email protected] >> >> http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org >> > _______________________________________________ > Sprinklerforum mailing list > [email protected] > > http://lists.firesprinkler.org/listinfo.cgi/sprinklerforum-firesprinkler.org >
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