Atlanta's job market sucks... most of the jobs listed on Monster and other such boards have been there for ages, they aren't filled because the employer isn't filling them, not due to a lack of qualified developers. I know many extremely qualified developers who either aren't working or are working for far less than they are worth because they have to get a pay check. I am glad that your job market is so good Ilya, but I don't think you can speak for the economy in general.
-----Original Message----- From: James Mitchell [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: Friday, March 28, 2003 1:45 PM To: Struts Users Mailing List Subject: RE: [OT] Contract Work: Going Rate? On Fri, 2003-03-28 at 13:34, Sterin, Ilya wrote: > Not sure about why all are ranting about this economy, but there are more > than enough jobs available in IT. It's qualifications what set the ones > with a job apart from the ones without. There are still over 100,000 > reported unfilled jobs in the IT sector, as well as if you go to > monster.com, jobs.perl.org, and many other sites, you'll see daily postings > of jobs. So there are jobs, I guess the question is whether the developers > we are speaking of are qualified for those jobs. Oh, well that must explain why I can't find a job in Atlanta. I'm not qualified....I see. > > Ilya > > -----Original Message----- > From: apachep2 > To: 'Struts Users Mailing List' > Sent: 3/28/03 7:50 AM > Subject: RE: [OT] Contract Work: Going Rate? > > Have you guys ever think of a situation, when a developer loses his job > for a while, he will take whatever contract it is and being paid > whatever the employer will offer? In this economy condition, supply of > developers always exceeds demanding. I see seniors applying for an entry > level job. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Sterin, Ilya [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: March 28, 2003 9:04 AM > To: 'Andrew Hill '; 'Struts Users Mailing List ' > Subject: RE: [OT] Contract Work: Going Rate? > > I'm still not understanding why you are having problems believing those > rates? > > Here, an average IT employee salary for full time staff employee, is > $30+/hour. An employer, spends about another 20% on benefits, madical, > dental, etc... So the employer, really faces about a $36-$40 average > expense on an employee. Now, if this contract is say 1 year or less, > then > there is a drawback of having someone stay, when they are not needed > after > the work is done. > > Now, $40 dollars, is just per employee expense. Now, each employer has > to > pay FICA tax, for each on staff employee, which is about 15% more. So > now > were are up to about the $50 round about figure per hour. Lets see, > then > there is office expenses, etc... so the figure is getting higher and > higher > and that's just the average. > > Now, an average rate for a contractor is about $50, which actually saves > the > company money, for outsourcing it, then also allows them to only be > billed > for hours as needed, so if one week there is a break, and no work is > done, > there is no bill, at least some of the time, since as we know, > consultants > always find ways to bill:-) > > Now, getting to higher figures of say $75/hour-$150/hour, those are > usually > for expert consultants. Say, I know people who've written books on the > subject, and they have the credibility to charge that much, etc... Also > past experience, thorough knowledge of technology, being a core team > developer of this particular technology or similar ranking. Also, most > of > those rates are for shorter term projects. > > I hope this helps you understand this a bit better. An averag > McDonald's > employee is costing the company about $25/hour, so if the burger flipper > was > smart, he or she would break a deal of $20/hour and call it a day:-) > > Ilya > > > -----Original Message----- > From: Andrew Hill > To: Struts Users Mailing List > Sent: 3/27/03 9:02 PM > Subject: RE: [OT] Contract Work: Going Rate? > > Half right. :-) > > I guess low is a distinctly relative term. Especially when comparing > apples & oranges (or salary & contract) ;->. > > Rates here may be low compared to US or UK contract rates (are they > really so high? - still have trouble believing those figures!), but as > for those in India, Russia, etc... they would get a fraction of the > going rate here, and there are probably folk doing the same stuff > elsewhere who get even less. > > -----Original Message----- > From: Scott Barr [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Friday, 28 March 2003 07:44 > To: Struts Users Mailing List > Subject: RE: [OT] Contract Work: Going Rate? > > > > Yeah, but we both (i think Andrew is an Aussie) live in Australia. Land > of low wages > > Scott > www.exergonic.com.au > > On Fri, 2003-03-28 at 06:26, Sterin, Ilya wrote: > 30*3000 is more than your whole entire career earnings? Where are you > from? > India? Russia? > > In US that's an average developer contract salary, and $30/hour is a > charge > that most contractors will laugh at here. > > Ilya > > -----Original Message----- > From: Andrew Hill > To: Struts Users Mailing List > Sent: 3/27/03 1:32 AM > Subject: RE: [OT] Contract Work: Going Rate? > > These are USD per HOUR? > > Crikey! You could retire after a couple of years on that! > Nah that cant be right. I did a bit under 3000 hours last year, multiply > by > 30 and convert to local currency adds up to more than Ive earned in my > whole > working life (4+ years). A lot more... > > Are those fair dinkum rates or are you just having us on? > > Five weeks holiday??? OT pay??? > > Yeh. Thought so. Its a joke. hehe. You had me going there mate! > > -----Original Message----- > From: Simon Kelly [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] > Sent: Thursday, 27 March 2003 16:08 > To: Struts Users Mailing List > Subject: Re: [OT] Contract Work: Going Rate? > > > These are some going full time rates for a London based e-learning > company, > for an average of 1880 hrs worked in one year (Five weeks holiday not > included in the figures, but you'd get the same rate). The company pays > OT > on projects that need it, but actually limit the number of hours in a > week > that an employee can be in the office. (Something about a work/life > balance, > whatver than means :-) > > All in US dollars (converted from blighty pounds) > > Grade one (Whipping boy) - 30$ > Grade two (Code monkey) - 40$ > Grade three (Designer) - 55$ > Grade four (Architect) - 90$ > Grade five (Senior Architect) - 150$ > > These don't include the options and bonuses (last xmas bonus ranged from > 500$ to 6000$) and the OT isn't in there (Usually 1.5*hourly > week-day/sat -- > 2*hourly sun). > > Contractor have to pay all the insurance and stuff, so I'd dap about > 22-40% > on top of each of these + a little extra if your gonna have to live in > an > expensive part of town. > > NOTE to the lawer. It only becomes illegal if it can be proven that we > have > set a level of pay *and* have all agreed to follow this level. If > you've > been on here long enough, you'd know *noone* ever agrees about > anything!! > =]:0) > > Good luck with the job, I hear California is nice this time of year!! > > Cheers > > Simon > > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > > --------------------------------------------------------------------- > To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] > For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] -- James Mitchell Software Developer/Struts Evangelist http://www.open-tools.org --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] --------------------------------------------------------------------- To unsubscribe, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED] For additional commands, e-mail: [EMAIL PROTECTED]
