... This forum delights in American-bashing as
though Darth Vader was born out of wed-lock from George Bush mating with
Clinton's whore
What???
You are being obnoxious.
--even when many articles sight the work of
counter-influence groups such as the Sierra Club. Thank heavens the
real people are not at all like the images being portrayed and since
this is an international forum, the comments further influence hostility
instead of promoting peace and offering solutions.
Nonsense. Please spare us this ridiculous idea of yours that turning
a blind eye on difficulties and problems will solve them. Not even
Pollyanna believed that. And also that *not* turning a blind eye as
you like to do is "negative". The opposite is the truth of it.
Peggy, you're not a newcomer here, and by now it's more than a little
suspect the way you ignore huge screeds of content - by far the
mainstream in fact - in order to prosecute stuff like this. As I told
you before, you really do need to ask yourself a few direct and
straightforward questions. Not grinding an axe, are you, hmm?
Thanks for caring. There are quite a few million people that live in
America who also care.
Okay, that does it.
What this list has ALWAYS done, since long before you joined, and
continues to do, is to make a very clear distinction between
"America" and "Americans". To prevent any confusion, when we discuss
"America", usually something to do with US foreign policy, it's
"Washington" we speak of. Many people here, Americans and
"foreigners" (!), have noted that while there's great and worldwide
resentment of the first, it does NOT extend to the second - to
Americans themselves, who are still liked and welcomed even by those
their government has brutalised. It's been noted with sadness and
regret how more recent events have been changing that. I've said
repeatedly, and I'm not alone in this, that notwithstanding the
"election" results, notwithstanding the poll results that show such
huge ignorance on the part of the majority of Americans (eg, the WMD
were found), that a great many Americans are not fooled, that they
not only "also care" but are doing something about as they may, and
I've expressed the belief that, rather than just your "quite a few
million" they could well be the majority.
That is and always has been the tenor of this list. Obfuscating this
clear distinction and lumping it all together as "America-bashing" is
spurious in the extreme. People who call us America-bashers and
America haters and so on are, simply put, liars. We've told them to
provide references and instances to support their accusations, and
all we've ever had is ever-louder protests and resentment accompanied
by NO references and NO instances. Finally, locked in their denial,
they depart. Too bad.
So what are you going to do, Peggy?
Of course the other thing you're trying to obfuscate with your talk
Americans who also care is to distract attention from what's done
abroad in America's name and with Americans' assent. This is of much
longer standing than the current neocon insanity.
See, for instance, among an embarrassment of riches:
http://infoarchive.net/sgroup/BIOFUEL/41438/
An Interview with William Blum - The Granma Moses of Radical Writing
http://members.aol.com/superogue/homepage.htm
Rogue State: A Guide to the World's Only Superpower, by William Blum
http://members.aol.com/bblum6/American_holocaust.htm
Killing Hope: U.S. Military and CIA Interventions Since World War II,
by William Blum
If you're going to respond to this Peggy (and actually you're
required to) I'd advise against your usual style of not checking the
links and ignoring everything that's inconvenient to your argument.
Make it a direct and forthright reply for once, eh?
And, also for once, puh-leaze try to refrain from telling me what
Journey to Forever *really* means!
Keith Addison
Journey to Forever
KYOTO Pref., Japan
http://journeytoforever.org/
Hello Luc,
And by the logic expressed about "Americans" then one might assume that
all Irishmen have red-hair. This forum delights in American-bashing as
though Darth Vader was born out of wed-lock from George Bush mating with
Clinton's whore--even when many articles sight the work of
counter-influence groups such as the Sierra Club. Thank heavens the
real people are not at all like the images being portrayed and since
this is an international forum, the comments further influence hostility
instead of promoting peace and offering solutions.
Because I live and work in rural America I see the bulk of the people as
hard-working individuals who mind their own business, and live
frugally--more frugally every day. Everyone is concerned about how to
pull out of the Bush dilemma and a new vote for a President or leader
would bring many varying options today that were not evident six months
ago. Ugly rudeness turned many people away from even listening to
reasonable alternatives. And so is it with any meanness. If the US did
not have this antiquated two-party system we would most likely have to
vote and vote and vote, but then we would come up with a better
political product. The best effort would be to return power to state
and community levels. But then, we may not all be perceived as being
equal. Ha! One party is no better than the other and the first thing
the noblest of politicians learns when entering service is graft then
greed. And most likely this is true of most every political figure in
most every country.
Here is a repeat of a standard social study comment: In a two party
system, if 49% of the public supports one candidate and 45% supports
another who has the greatest power? The answer is the remaining 6%.
This time around in the voting, there were no real choices. The
revolution has to start on a grass-roots level where self-sufficiency
and rural economic development eliminate the need for national controls.
When I was growing up, the Republican party represented "States Rights"
which meant that the state ultimately controlled their own people. That
all changed to aid good projects like social integration Social
integration that tried to destroy diversity and other ideas like
socialized health care which now exists in the form of "insurance
benefits" and Medicare/ Medicaid that reduces personal choice, informed
alternatives, or individual attention. We become like cattle in a
feedlot when following a government agenda. And as everyone knows,
feedlots are akin to slums even when we build and live in a faŤade of
false wealth.
Understanding the importance of "belief changes" also applies to the
poverty campaigns of other nations. Their battle is just as valid and
corrupt. And the philosophical concepts that bind any person or culture
are BELIEFS!!! Change beliefs and the world changes as well. Thanks
for promoting a new world-view based on valid reconstructive effort and
not blaming others.
When my mushroom friend, Paul Staments wanted to make a difference in
the war effort, he thought of the idea of sending aid to the people in
pasteboard boxes that contained instructions like the following: after
you remove the contents of this box, fill the box with dirt and water it
with two cups of water every week. Having implanted the boxes with
organic seeds that could support the recipient who took enough time to
fill the box with dirt and water it weekly, he provided a source of
food. Every plant also offered the ability to be a source of new seeds
thereby offering continued sustenance.
Most every community has a place where diligent people can drop seeds
into the earth and grow a vegetable garden. Even window boxes in
apartments can grow food. But most people expect food to come from
someone else's efforts--even in poverty conditions.
Thanks for caring. There are quite a few million people that live in
America who also care.
Best wishes,
Peggy
<I can still see that image in my mind's eye and it always troubles me
deeply. When the words "colateral damage" is applied to Americans at
home after they get into a war with Russia and/or China over global
control of natural resources I wonder just who is going to be feeling
anything for them ... anything at all. Won't be the warmongers that are
slaughtering the innocent that much is certain. They will reap what
they have sown and there will be none to deliver. What was once a brave
group of men and women are now reduced to nothing short of barbaric
pirates. All for the "glory of God" no doubt... NOT !
Luc
See also:
http://www.commondreams.org/views05/0128-24.htm
Published on Friday, January 28, 2005 by CommonDreams.org
Why the Children in Iraq Make No Sound When They Fall
by Bernard Chazelle
---------
http://www.commondreams.org/views05/0128-35.htm
Published on Friday, January 28, 2005 by the National Catholic Reporter
What the Rest of the World Watched on Inauguration Day
<snip>
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