Luke Hansen wrote: > Thanks for the input Darryl, > > It saddens me to read about the two failed van > conversions, as my van has quite a bit of sentimental > value to me, and the block cracked in our big freeze a > month ago (quite rare so close to the coast, but we > all know that anthropogenic climate change is just a > creation of our liberal media). It could just be > expansion (freeze) plugs, but I don't feel like > dropping the engine just to find out.
Uh-huh. I had the 3/4-ton version for many years. Nothing enjoyable about the space around that engine for working. Still, a lot less work than an electric conversion. Besides, you're going to have to drop the engine anyway as part of the conversion exercise. > Granted, the van is one heavy piece of detroit steel, > but what exactly is the hang-up? Voltage? Total > weight? I'm guessing that most of the batterys' charge > is used in overcoming inertia, right? The weight is the starting point for the issues. IIRC, this van weighs about 4,000 pounds empty. To get any kind of performance (say 0-30 mph in under 20 seconds) is going to take a lot of watts. Voltage doesn't matter - watts matter. (Watts is voltage times amps.) You will need a very large electric motor, something in the order of 40 hp continuous rating. Think mine locomotive, not golf cart. Everything gets heavier as a result. Heavier cables, heavier safety devices, heavier batteries, and they cycle keeps feeding on itself. The inertia should not be your biggest loss unless you are starting and stopping four times a mile. The GM van has the aerodynamics of a brick, so travelling at speed should be your biggest loss. > > *sigh* 'tis a daunting task at hand...but like the > good doctor says, "when the going gets weird, the > weird get professional." > > So, sounds like I can safely rule out the use of a > starter motor for a drive motor. > > Why did the van projects die in progress? Variety of factors. First is that most of these vans came with automatic transmissions. Adapters from an electric motor to the automatic tranny / torque converter were challenging. Then there is the issue of how to mount the motor in the engine space so it is braced against torque rotation, but not solidly locked to the frame. Getting a motor big enough was a factor. (500-amp starter generators were not up to the job.) Then there is the cost of 1,000 to 2,000 pounds of deep cycle batteries, mounting them securely, and beefing up the suspension to take the weight. Oh, and something to actually control the electricity from the pack to the motor is handy - also not cheap. Essentially, it just ends up expensive for disappointing returns. Best to learn on something cheaper. Another conversion did get onto the road. It mysteriously caught fire shortly after going into service. The owner was never satisfied with how it performed in the short time it was operational. There have been professional conversions of this platform as well. Look for Lucas-Chloride Bedford van electric conversions (probably the best) and the Magna G-Van conversions for more on how it was done when folks had big budgets. Check the specs. Then downrate everything by at least 50% to allow for doing things on the cheap and learning on the go. That's about the best you can hope for. > > > > --- Darryl McMahon <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > >> I think I might be able to contribute something on >> the subject. >> >> I strongly recommend you visit my Web site first. >> You might find >> something of interest starting at: >> http://www.econogics.com/ev/evindex.htm >> >> Some other folks have said kind things about the >> material there over the >> years. >> >> As to the specific points in your post. >> >> Forget the 1/2 ton van. Too heavy = too expensive >> to accomplish >> anything of value. I have personally watched two >> Chev van conversion >> projects die incomplete. >> >> 96 volts is pretty conventional, there's lots of >> components available >> there. However, it's not going to work with >> aircraft starter generators. >> >> Standard automotive batteries (starting, lighting, >> ignition: SLI) will >> not survive long in a deep-discharge application. >> There is plenty of >> experience to prove this out. Automotive starter >> motors as propulsion >> devices will die even faster. They are designed for >> short-term >> operation (seconds) and a small load (turning the >> engine); not >> continuous operation or the load of moving the >> vehicle. I have driven a >> small car on its starter motor in an emergency >> situation. Went a few >> hundred metres at about 5 km/h. The starter motor >> failed shortly >> thereafter. >> >> If this is to be an educational experience, I highly >> recommend starting >> with something smaller, that can still be useful. >> For example, >> electrify a bicycle, a garden tractor or other yard >> appliance, convert a >> motorcycle or scooter, or build an Electrathon >> vehicle. You will learn >> the same electrical and mechanical fundamentals, but >> on a much smaller >> budget, and likely end up with something you will >> actually use afterward. >> >> Darryl McMahon >> (owner - 1973 Porsche 914 electric conversion, 1973 >> General Electric >> Elec-Trak E12 tractor, homebrew electric bicycle >> based on hub motor, >> 1999 Spincraft EB-1 solar electric boat and too many >> past, current and >> future projects to mention). >> >> Luke Hansen wrote: >>> I'm thinking of attempting a conversion on my 1976 >>> Chevy 1/2 ton van. Maybe a simple 96-volt >>> system...series wire eight 12V car batteries that >> I >>> find lying around. The range would suck, but this >> is >>> more just for shits and giggles anyways. Also, >> feel >>> free to shoot me down here, but I've heard of >> folks >>> using their starter motors as drive motors for the >>> cars themselves...anyone care to comment? >>> >>> Thanks, >>> Luke >>> -- Darryl McMahon It's your planet. If you won't look after it, who will? The Emperor's New Hydrogen Economy (now in print and eBook) http://www.econogics.com/TENHE/ _______________________________________________ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
