robert and benita rabello wrote:
rabr> I am certainly not afraid of reasoned debate on the subject of rabr> religion. I've said this before, but it obviously needs to be repeated: if you mean reasoned in the sense of rational, why shouldn't religious claims be subject to the same standards of scrutiny as any other assertion? rabr> ... including those of atheists, toward whom I maintain respect that rabr> only develops from understanding. How magnanimous of you to tolerate people who refuse to blindly accept unsubstantiated and - to put it mildly - highly implausible claims as being the Ultimate Truth. rabr> While I don't agree with some of what the author claims, for the most rabr> part he presents a pretty compelling connection between the extremists rabr> who call themselves Christians (but are not) and fascism. If by "Christian" you mean someone who literally believes that Jesus of Nazareth was fathered by a supernatural being without the aid of sexual intercourse and that he possessed magical powers, then the extremists are Christians. If you mean someone who believes and follows what is generally perceived to be the teachings of the New Testament, then they most certainly are not. If you genuinely and sincerely believe in and live by those principles - which seems to be the case - then with my blessings, so to speak. But I don't think a belief in supernatural or metaphysical entities in necessary in order to live morally and ethically. I have to say that I strongly object to your implication that one has to develop an "understanding" of atheists in order to respect them. I have a strong sense of morals, and I'm an active member of Amnesty International (roughly half of our local group are atheists). The comparison to fascism is apt. Someone once said "When fascism comes to America it will be wrapped in the flag and bearing a cross". And the Islamic counterpart is just as fascistic. rabr> There is a rabr> very compelling allure to power among people who feel their values have rabr> long been trampled by the larger, secular society. Like it or not, the rabr> western world in general, and America in particular, are comprised of rabr> secular people and controlled by secular institutions. (The secular rabr> nature of American government is clearly enshrined in the rabr> Constitution!) I'm not at all clear as to what you mean here. A secular society is one in which state and religion are kept separate. What values does this separation trample on? rabr> To those who have felt like outsiders, Outsiders? I don't know what the figures are for Canada, but the overwhelming majority of Americans are religious and believe that atheists are not suited to hold a public office. I don't have a reference to hand but I can find one if you insist. rabr> ridiculed for rabr> their beliefs Pointing out that religious claims are not supported by any evidence is not ridicule, it's a statement of fact. rabr> and shouted down by movements promoting minority rights This would seem to imply that religious people are opposed to minority rights. Why else shout them down (if indeed that actually happens)? _______________________________________________ Biofuel mailing list Biofuel@sustainablelists.org http://sustainablelists.org/mailman/listinfo/biofuel_sustainablelists.org Biofuel at Journey to Forever: http://journeytoforever.org/biofuel.html Search the combined Biofuel and Biofuels-biz list archives (50,000 messages): http://www.mail-archive.com/biofuel@sustainablelists.org/
