Hi Steve,
On 21 January 2000 at 10:14:07 GMT -0800 (which was 18:14 where I
live) [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote and made these points:
<sigh> I really didn't want to get into this. :-(
>> Replies on *this* list are usually to the individual making the
>> original posting.
SL> Other lists are different?
What, all lists are the same?
>> The TB name munging, although repugnant to some, works perfectly to
>> promote very sensible and legible conversation.
SL> No it doesn't. The fact that the replies are there does that.
SL> The munging adds nothing but confusion.
Not from my POV, however. My name is "Marck D. Pearlstone". When this
message comes back out of the list, it will request that replies be
sent to TBUDL rather than [EMAIL PROTECTED] That may not be my
*usual* address, but it certainly is the address at and from which I
am engaging in this conversation. I am perfectly happy about this,
because I am accustomed to the conventions of this list and other
lists of which I am a subscriber.
When I have a conversation on a list, I don't implicitly invite an
off-list conversation of any sort but I certainly *do* invite comments
to be addressed to me personally within the list. TB supports this
happening automatically. I like that. It adds to the community feel of
a group of individuals, each of whom has something to say and usually
something to say to another individual within the community. It gives
a far greater human feel to it for me.
When I want to reply to *anyone* sending me a mail, I am talking to a
person at an address. That person probably has a real name. If it was
stated at all, the real name will be found in who the message was from
- the "From" header. If it was stated, then it is certain that that
person wishes to be spoken to using that name. If that same person has
requested that I send replies to an address that is *not* their normal
address by using a different "Reply-To" address in their original
message then IMHO it is a politeness and courtesy to combine the two
headers in exactly the way TB does it. In the case of TBUDL, we have
the list configured to direct replies back to the list. This is where
the real bone of contention arises.
If I receive a land mail from a friend who asks me to write to them at
a holding address, I will do exactly that. I will put my friend's name
on the envelope and follow it with the holding address. It would be
ridiculous to leave my friend's name off that envelope just because it
is not going to their normal address.
I feel exactly the same about e-mail and nothing you can say will
convince me that you're right here Steve. I agree, that it's soggy
technology but, heck it's human. I can understand how it works and how
it will work and stop it if it's about to do something embarrassing.
Usually, it doesn't and I'm perfectly happy with exactly what it wants
to do. Sorry you don't like it that way :-( (genuinely). I much prefer
agreeing with you.
>> I can tell when someone has replied to one of my postings and zoom
>> in on it as a point of interest.
SL> You can do that with threading
I read via the ticker virtual folder. The thread is in my base folder.
I can't see it. :-(
SL> or having a filter search for your MSGID identifier and mark the
SL> message as high, or copy it into another folder.
Why should I want to expend the energy to set that up when it already
works *exactly* how I want it to. I have more than enough to do.
Truly.
>> IMHO I would recommend reverting to default behaviour for TBUDL
>> replies - unless you can come up with a *really* good reason to
>> keep it the way it is (beyond the techno-puritanical "don't munge
>> the address" argument).
SL> I recommend not doing it. "Techno-pritanical", to me, seems
SL> to be used in an offensive manner.
It may have possibly come over that way. However, what I mean by that
is "pure-in-the-technical-sense". Perhaps it would have been better
said as "techno-purists". It is my acknowledgement that 1) I would
have you to answer to for this particular (and strange) pet point of
view I hold ;-) and 2) that I recognize that I am not on the
technically pure side in this conversation.
SL> First off, don't munge the address without a damned good reason.
SL> This is not a damned good reason.
Matter of opinion. I think that politeness in list based conversation
is a plenty good enough reason. (However, I believe that you don't
think that a *good enough* reason).
SL> Secondly, I do *NOT* want my name attached with the email
SL> address for the list. My address is [EMAIL PROTECTED], not
SL> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
I have hand massaged your name into something that now correctly
represents the fact that the e-mail address in the To: field of the
message is not yours. Does that make you feel any less aggrieved? No,
probably not :-(. Well, I tried, all right? <g>
SL> Thirdly, since one can add addresses to the address book
SL> from the TO field having someone's name attached with an address
SL> that isn't theirs, especially on mailing lists other than TBUDL
SL> causes massive confusion.
... which is why I have made the habit of only recording From
addresses with the automated add facility :-). It stopped confusing me
after one mistake (which I deleted immediately without using and went
hunting for a message *from* that individual). This isn't exactly
difficult stuff, you know.
SL> There is not a single legitimate argument for it.
I have presented a few. Top of my list are politeness, clarity and
flow. I take it you don't consider these legitimate. If so, that's a
shame.
SL> It is one of those things in TB!, along with RE counting, that
SL> *NEVER* should have been implemented, *MUST* be removed and,
SL> damned all to hell, some people think is a really swell idea.
Since they're all options - one of which I like and one of which I
don't - what's the problem?
SL> No doubt they want bright pink text on a yellow background, with
SL> blink, as well. Geez.
I did use that once from an OE message. It had the desired effect on a
friend who was already suffering from a stomach bug <g>.
--
Cheers,
.\\arck
Marck at TBUDL, Consultant Software Engineer
Co-moderator TBUDL / TBBETA
www: http://www.silverstones.com
PGP key: <mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED]?Body=GET%20MARCKKEY>
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