On Tuesday 20 January 2009 08:55, Daniel Cheng wrote:
> On Tue, Jan 20, 2009 at 4:16 PM, Ancoron Luciferis
> <ancoron at chaoslayer.de> wrote:
> > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE-----
> > Hash: SHA1
> >
> > Hi there,
> >
> > I knew that the french law goes further than any other country in europe
> > nowadays regarding anti-piracy and stuff like that but I didn't knew
> > that you can be held guilty for something you didn't do (neighbor hacked
> > in WLAN). That's like being held guilty for the damage someone makes
> > that stole your car. I can't really believe that, because that would
> > negate the base assumption: everyone is innocent as long as his/her
> > guilt has not been proven.
> 
> This is not "held guilty" in the legal sense. They are just disconnect
> you before bring to court. This is a proactive measurement to prevent
> further "harm" -- just like what have been doing for, for example,
> child abuse and violent to spouse.
> 
> Yes, piracy issue is as serious as (if not more important then) trying
> to kill your wife or child.

Obviously, since it costs more money to the economy! Also IIRC there *are* 
appeals and (quasi-?)judicial processes for child protection cases. This 
nonsense is a classic case of creeping corporatism - the megacorps speak 
louder than the individuals or the smaller companies. I'd be surprised if it 
was upheld by the ECHR, but we'll see ... 

In my country they tried to introduce such nonsense, the ISPs refused to 
indemnify the media companies for lawsuits arising from the media companies 
mistakes, so the government is going to make ISPs legally responsible for 
copyright infringements committed via p2p on their networks some time in the 
next few years. :<

The other issue in France is that some people have claimed that the DADVSI 
does in fact make Freenet illegal, at least developing it. This has not been 
tested in court as far as I know, but let me know if you hear of any 
prosecutions under it, especially if they relate to filesharing software... 
as a professional Freenet developer I have decided that visiting France 
presents an unacceptable risk for the foreseeable future...

My advice is to exercise your right as an EU citizen to live in any EU state 
where you can find employment. However...

At the european level, IPRED2 would make it a serious criminal matter to 
attempt, aid and abet, incite, or commit, violation of copyrights or 
trademarks which are "intentional" and "on a commercial scale"; clarifying 
language according to wikipedia (which seems out of date) is "willful, 
commercial or intentional" and not for "personal and not for profits 
purposes". If we're lucky this means that inciting people to distribute the 
Fishman Affidavit won't be an imprisonable offence... but whether it's any 
protection for myself, a paid Freenet developer, is an open question. It 
passed first reading in Parliament on March 2007, and is listed as awaiting 
first reading in Council; in theory it could be adopted immediately by the 
Council, but it often drags out into second and third readings...

Since this is an arbitrary, and probably illegal under ECHR, executive action, 
where no liability has been proven, I can in fact discuss your original 
question...

> >>>>>>> On Monday 19 January 2009 15:28, 3BUIb3S50i 3BUIb3S50i wrote:
> >>>>>>>> There is a break in the sanctions of french law Hadopi. Hadopi 
allow
> >>>>>>>> censured users to use television, telephone and maybe anothers
> >>>>>>>> payables services. So, victims will have a lot of censured ports,
> >>>>>>>> but
> >>>>>>>> not all. Some ports will continue to run. Can we found a method to
> >>>>>>>> override this censorship (with freenet)? e.g. encapsulate traffic
> >>>>>>>> into
> >>>>>>>> VoIP. This is very difficult: ISP can limit traffic only from/to 
its
> >>>>>>>> servers. What do you think? It's very important for french users.
> >>>>>>>> French users risk to left freenet soon... like Batosai. For 
example,
> >>>>>>>> I
> >>>>>>>> do not want to risk losing my Internet connection. The french
> >>>>>>>> community is afraid by this law. Some users have requested TCP
> >>>>>>>> support
> >>>>>>>> for hide freenet traffic in https, http etc. ISP will spy their
> >>>>>>>> users,
> >>>>>>>> so Darknet will not be sufficient.

If limits only apply to specific proscribed individuals, then they can be very 
harsh - severe monthly traffic limits, NATing lots of them together to 
prevent incoming connections, completely denying them access to computers 
and/or the Internet, etc. If your question is how do we avoid detection, the 
question is how much effort will the ISPs and media companies invest in 
finding people. It is possible to identify peer to peer traffic even if it is 
protected in steganography, by analysing the connection patterns between 
customers. If customers are ideal consumers, for example, they would only 
ever connect to central business-run sites! Traffic flow analysis is however 
somewhat expensive (we hope), so perhaps it will be avoided for a while ... a 
cheaper but more disruptive solution may be to simply prohibit all 
connections between customers; Skype would probably fallback to relaying over 
central servers, at a latency cost; SIP-based VoIP and non-centralised online 
gaming would be disrupted...

In the medium term, approximately 1.0 era, Freenet will have support 
for "transport plugins", which will enable Freenet traffic over TCP, HTTP, 
VoIP-like packets etc etc. In the long term, Freenet *may* have support for 
high latency transports such as sneakernet (exchange of USB keys etc), fast 
transfers when physical rendezvous, and harder forms of steganography (which 
mimic timing as well as protocol). However, there is no consensus in the 
project in favour of this, and no clear idea of how to assign routing 
locations on a high latency network. Wireless may also help, but bear in mind 
that vast seas of omnidirectional antennas, especially if they are at rooftop 
level, do not scale well and while they may provide the large numbers of 
short links needed, they will not provide the small number of long links that 
Freenet also needs.
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