HEY! I still have and use that ladder without incident. Rickety must have been user error! And I'd never have loaned it out for such questionable endeavors!
From: Gary McDaniel [mailto:scar...@gmail.com] Sent: Wednesday, August 26, 2009 1:52 AM To: SS Cc: Cavers Texas Subject: Re: [Texascavers] Climbing Cave Entrances Back in '93 or '94 a close friend (I'll not name him here) and I "cleaned" the Cub overhang (with the assistance of Joe and Linda's extraordinarily rickety 30ft extension ladder) of all those ugly 'biners and 'draws and and used the leavings to subsidize my early caving career. I certainly don't mean to suggest any other young caver undertake the same endeavor. T'would be a shame for a few climbers to lose some gear as to allow a young caver to save a few extra dollars for powdered potato fueled south'rn Mexican expeditions..... A sin I tell 'ya! -Gary MacDaniels Da Junk, Coloraddy On Tue, Aug 25, 2009 at 11:34 PM, SS <back2scool...@hotmail.com> wrote: Ahh..but at the end of the day.aren't all those unsightly marks just an eyesore for us humans occupying this mere blink the geologic eye.. At the end of the day there really is nothing we can do to harm a cave since it is not the same place today that it was ten thousand years ago and it will not be the same place in ten thousand years from now as it is today. In fact, we may not even be around in ten thousand years. So technically..all this really boils down to present day human perception of what "Impact" is on a cave. I'm sure no indigenous person ever trashed a cave or wrote graffiti on the walls or left their garbage lying around.. Oh wait.they did. But since it was over a hundred years ago its considered "Historical"... So wait a hundred years and those holes and chalk marks will be historical not unsightly! Amazing how time cures all! Father Time _____ From: Mark Minton [mailto:mmin...@caver.net] Sent: Tuesday, August 25, 2009 12:18 PM To: 'Cavers Texas' Subject: [Texascavers] Climbing Cave Entrances David Locklear said: I think what I am trying to say is that cavers need to draw the line somewhere, when it comes to a bunch of rock-climbers rigging and naming various bolted routes all over the pits. In parts of the West where lava tubes are common, some had become favorite spots for rock climbers. Some tubes were heavily bolted with routes going up across the ceilings of the tubes. The climbers also left lots of unsightly white marks from the chalk they use on their hands. It got so bad in some areas that the federal agencies involved with land management (BLM, USFS) banned the practice. That was several years ago. I haven't heard much about it recently, so maybe it has become less common. Mark Minton You may reply to mmin...@caver.net Permanent email address is mmin...@illinoisalumni.org -- ~Gary McDaniel Grand Junction, CO
