Hi The interesting point about “who said what” is that Autodesk people stated *after* the acquisition that the Eagle license model would not change … That’s one of the reasons I’d like to wait a bit and see what those same people say now.
Bob > On Jan 21, 2017, at 9:43 AM, paul swed <paulsw...@gmail.com> wrote: > > What can I add to this thats not been said. > This is how software is moving and it did start with Autodesk who sacked > there original license model for the subscription approach and is making a > ton of money that way. Its annuity. A gift that keeps on giving. Meanwhile > they add bloat-ware for the sake of trying to appear to add some value.... > I can go on but as all of you have observed it is what it is. Sitting back > and griping will not change it. Its a major corporate direction change > especially if a company was acquired. Its really not going to change. When > a company is acquired what ever had been stated positions no longer matter. > Its not the same company any longer, just the same name. > So exploring alternates as you are all doing is great and helpful. > Regards > Paul > WB8TSL > > On Fri, Jan 20, 2017 at 4:42 PM, Bob Camp <kb...@n1k.org> wrote: > >> Hi >> >> >>> On Jan 20, 2017, at 12:44 PM, Chris Albertson <albertson.ch...@gmail.com> >> wrote: >>> >>> It could be what they are doing is purposely trying to "blow off" >>> their less desirable customers. >>> >>> I explained this to someone I know who was upset at a large bank she >>> deals with. She said she would move "all her money out of the bank" >>> all $5,000 of it. I explain to her that was EXACTLY what the bank >>> wanted and the reason for the policies she experienced. Small >>> customers with $5K deposits are not profitable. So Autodesk is >>> selling subscriptions for $500 and offering "one on one" sport. >> >> The last time they played this game they found that reducing the >> subscriber base 1000:1 >> at $500 a year was not as good as 10:1 at $50 a year. That’s why I >> suggest that people >> wait a bit and see what happens over the next few months. Eagle does not >> have what it takes >> to compete as a PCB program for the big guys. There is no great big block >> of licenses at the Fortune >> 500 to milk in this case. The user base is large. It is made up of the >> small, price sensitive guys. Each >> time the Eagle license stuff has been fiddled in the past, it’s been a >> disaster because of that. >> >> The Eagle “per customer” cost is nearly zero ( unlike a bank ). It’s >> really all about how much money they >> bring in each year. Their costs scale more on a per bug …. errr … per >> feature basis rather >> than by the customer (at least for the hobby customer). They will charge >> what they can as long as >> people keep signing up. If nobody signs up … they will adjust. >> >> Bob >> >>> >>> Apple has a neat business model too. They have like about 18% of the >>> world's cellphone market but make the MAJORITY of the profit. What >>> they do is take the one in five most profitable customers. >>> >>> Maybe Autodesk is looking to do the same thing, take only the most >>> rich customers and let the others go elsewhere. >>> >>> In the end nicad might be the best for the hobby market. >>> >>> Autodesk is looking to offer the integrated solution where the PCB and >>> case that it lives in are designed together by a team that is >>> geographically distributed. >>> >>> On Fri, Jan 20, 2017 at 8:58 AM, Bob Camp <kb...@n1k.org> wrote: >>>> Hi >>>> >>>> I completely agree that their spin at acquisition and the reality of >> what just came out >>>> is completely amazing. They said they would never do this and that. >> What they are doing >>>> is exactly what they said they would not do. >>>> >>>> It’s a rare board that I do in < 4 layers. It’s also quite normal to >> have designs above >>>> 160 CM^2. If I have 4 layers, there *will* be signals on all those >> layers. That puts me >>>> squarely in the $500 / yr subscription. A month ago that put me in a >> perpetual license >>>> that I paid < 1/2 that for. >>>> >>>> It is not just that the cost has gone up. A number of license >> “categories” have vanished. >>>> The free version is still there, and just as useless for what I do. >> That’s about the only >>>> one that is rational at this point. >>>> >>>> So yes, I’m at least as bothered by this as anybody else. What I would >> suggest is to >>>> take a deep breath, sit back, yell at them a bit (along with everybody >> else that has >>>> a license) and see what they do. It is abundantly clear that they have >> a major disconnect >>>> between this and what they have said. There is a lot of explaining for >> them to do. Part of that >>>> could easily be another couple license categories. I’m certainly in no >> hurry to switch >>>> packages. >>>> >>>> Right now Fusion 360 is something I use a LOT more than I use Eagle. >> This week (month .. year) >>>> it is free for me to do that. Why is Fusion free to a basement guy and >> Eagle pay? >>>> That’s not at all clear. Fusion is buggy as can be. Eagle needs some >> updates. Both >>>> have a lot of development $$$ that they will be sucking up. Yes that >> has to get paid >>>> for. It’s not clear that a revenue stream based on hobbyists paying >> $500 a year >>>> is rational. My guess is Autodesk will figure that out. They may >> abandon the whole >>>> basement thing, they may not …. we’ll see. >>>> >>>> Bob >>>> >>>> >>>>> On Jan 19, 2017, at 10:52 PM, Richard (Rick) Karlquist < >> rich...@karlquist.com> wrote: >>>>> >>>>> Off topic, but probably a lot of disgrunted Eagle users on this list. >>>>> Its official, you will now have to pay $500 per year for a >>>>> professional license from Autodesk. The spin meistering of the >>>>> announcement would make George Orwell proud. I don't see any way they >>>>> can keep me from just using the license I currently own, at least >>>>> on the OS's it supports. (Parenthetically, like many users, I >>>>> am also digging in my heels in terms of staying at Windows 7). >>>>> >>>>> Still, the question arises: are there any affordable alternatives? >>>>> Don't have to be entirely free. I am looking for any trends out >>>>> there as to what tool will attract a critical mass of users in >>>>> the future. There is strength in numbers. >>>>> >>>>> Comments? >>>>> >>>>> Rick N6RK >>>>> _______________________________________________ >>>>> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >>>>> To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/ >> mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >>>>> and follow the instructions there. >>>> >>>> _______________________________________________ >>>> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >>>> To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/ >> mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >>>> and follow the instructions there. >>> >>> >>> >>> -- >>> >>> Chris Albertson >>> Redondo Beach, California >>> _______________________________________________ >>> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >>> To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/ >> mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >>> and follow the instructions there. >> >> _______________________________________________ >> time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com >> To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/ >> mailman/listinfo/time-nuts >> and follow the instructions there. >> > _______________________________________________ > time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com > To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts > and follow the instructions there. _______________________________________________ time-nuts mailing list -- time-nuts@febo.com To unsubscribe, go to https://www.febo.com/cgi-bin/mailman/listinfo/time-nuts and follow the instructions there.