Re: [TruthTalk] Did God hate or love Esau?

[Lance Muir]

ï Now, now Judy! Tsk tsk you little meanie1 That last comment was uncalled for.   As I said re:hatred and, it's meaning, shall we just move on to other things? It could be that someone other than myself could make him/herself understood to you but, that's about the best I can do.     ----- Original Message ----- From: Judy Taylor To: [EMAIL PROTECTED] Sent: November 07, 2004 14:58 Subject: [TruthTalk] Did God hate or love Esau?   From: "Lance Muir" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> God and THE BIBLE do not mean the same as God and His Word. Not to me. jt: Then where do you find God's Word Lance?  Do you see God's Word as some mystical and ethereal person who you call Christ?  The one Jonathan has such a passion for?   [EMAIL PROTECTED]> Judy: Just WHAT DISTINCTION DO YOU THINK I AM MAKING? Let's clear that part up then, move on.   jt: I have no idea Lance, because you never explain. You give one word answers or sometimes one liners that are easy to misunderstand. Were you saying that you do believe that God and His Word are one when you wrote:    [EMAIL PROTECTED]> God and the 'Scriptures' are not identical.   Maybe it is time that you yield a little more in the way of explanation Lance...     From: "Lance Muir" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> I do.  I believe that you've forgotten that this conversation took place only recently so that I see no need to have it take place all over again.   jt: You mean by this that you separate God and His Word? you see a division IOW?   It matters not that you fail to understand the distinction.   jt: Or is it you Lance who fail to understand the relational aspect of God and His Word?    It matters only that you live what you believe the Scriptures to teach. As one possessing just a pinch of discernment, I'd say you do.           [EMAIL PROTECTED]> God and the 'Scriptures' are not identical. jt: OH!  Says who? How do you separate a man from his word .... Think about it, IYO is God schizophrenic?. From: "Lance Muir" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> Were we to apprehend 'the heart of God' through all of the Scriptures on all matters, God would still be more than our 'apprehension'. Why? God is God and we're  us.   jt: IOW the secret things belong to the Lord, but what has been revealed is for us and for our children?   As to 'contradictions': they may well exist within (1) the Scriptures themselves (possible)?   jt: No.. God does not contradict himself.    (2) our 'readings' of them (certain).Logic, formally understood, cannot always be used as an arbiter of apparent contradictions.   jt: What has logic got to do with anything? You really should let go of that Greek mindset Lance and allow your mind to be transformed by the washing of the Word. (John 3 'VS' Romans 9). Provisionally, I believe that John 3:16  more closely reflects the 'heart of God' than the 'reading' of Romans 9. As Beretta used to say: 'dats da name of dat tune''   jt: You and Beretta just may be dancing to your own tune Lance ... :) Yes, God loved the world so much that his only begotten son was as a lamb slain before it's foundation.  However, he does not have stupid stamped across his forehead (if indeed he has one) and his righteous judgment which can be found from Genesis to Revelation consistently states that "everyone will reap as they sow" and that "a man is judged according to what HE does" - (not what Jesus has done) because those who are righteous DO RIGHTEOUSNESS. (1 John 3:7,10)   John 3:16 and Romans 9 are not contradictory - another truth you will find if you dig a while is that God loves those who love him and the ones who seek him early find him. Following the fall when men could care less and continued to become ever more evil God's spirit quit striving with them and he killed all but 8 of them. Same with the Amorites when their cup of iniquity became full and but for Moses intercession Israel would have been replaced also.  The Pharoah and Esau are cut from the same cloth. God gave that Pharoah as many chances as there were plagues to repent and he kept hardening his heart. Someone has used Esau's name as an acronym for Every Sensual Appetite Unleashed. Truth is he cared for a bowl of lentils more than the birthright which is from God and which is what Jacob coveted and at the end of the day God loves those who love Him.   judyt