Re: [TruthTalk] Re:John 16:13,14

[Lance Muir]

How 'bout the children/hell thingy? Speculation of the first order! ----- Original Message ----- From: Judy Taylor To: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Cc: TruthTalk@mail.innglory.org Sent: July 22, 2005 14:10 Subject: Re: [TruthTalk] Re:John 16:13,14 Lance why don't you check the scriptures first before running off at the mouth and labelling everything and everyone who dosent' align themself with the heresy you endorse?  Do you know what Paul said about marriage between believer and non-believer in the NT and their children?   On Fri, 22 Jul 2005 14:02:04 -0400 "Lance Muir" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> writes: Wow! What a load of....well...speculation in that second paragraph. May we be blessed with OT & NT scriptures which explicitly teach what you just 'taught'? From: Judy Taylor Yes, I do believe we all come into this world with an "inheritance" in and a natural "propensity" toward sin which is why it is our responsibility not to waste any time in training our children in the ways of God - it's not long before their rebellious little sin natures would take the place if they are not restrained and retrained.   ATST I don't believe that all babies automatically go to hell because God is merciful and He is a God of covenant which is what Paul takes into consideration when he speaks of believer md to unbeliever and so long as they remain together their children are "holy" (because of the godly influence in that home). I don't think we completely understand these issues of sin and righteousness - like we should.  jt   From: ShieldsFamily Judy, it seems that you believe that being born with a fleshly human nature is what defiles us.  I believe it does not: it simply gives us the Propensity to sin.  We are not defiled unless/until we actually sin.  (Which Jesus obviously did not do.) That is why it does not bother DM or me to believe that Jesus was born with a human-prone-to-sin-in-all-ways-that-we-are nature, which He overcame to show us that we can also if we walk in the Spirit as He did.    You seem to see us as born already defiled.  You seem to believe that a pre-born or newborn baby that dies would go to hell.  I don’t think we are defiled/unclean when we are born.  I think that is the critical difference between our thinking on this.  Do you? Izzy   From: [EMAIL PROTECTED] [mailto:[EMAIL PROTECTED] On Behalf Of Judy Taylor You are the one who adds "in all respects" JD - I don't see this in scripture. What I see is "likeness" which I read as physical likeness. IOW he had a body like ours. There is a moral dimension to flesh - it is not body image only When Job says "who can bring a clean thing out of an unclean" (Job 14:4) he is speaking of this moral dimension or moral cleanness and purity. This is the difference between us in the flesh and Christ's humanity.  He has always been clean and pure As a race we never have been and this is what put him on the cross.