Re: [TruthTalk] Believers in bondage to sin?

[Judy Taylor]

 

 

On Sat, 11 Mar 2006 07:55:04 +0000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

You quote scripture that appeals to your bias and conveniently leave off those passages that demand a  broader opinion of sin and sinning than the one you insist upon.   And there is a host of scripture , not to mention the personal testimonies of lives lived  (even here on TT) and the "unrepented" sins of so many in the scripture  ..   men of faith such as Noah, Abraham,  Isass, Samson, Peter and Paul.   You ignore the fact that a carnal believer is a "babe in Christ "  (and, hence, alive in Christ) or that the old man is still present as the new man increases  (Eph 4:20-24) or that we all are falling short of the glory of God  or that Christ died for us while we were yet sinners  --   a statement that enhances the teaching that Christ did not come for the "righteous."

 

What do we have above JD, six excuses?  To begin with there is no such thing as a "carnal believer" that is

the construct of doctrines that do not conform ppl to godliness and holiness. Why did Paul turn that man in

Corinth over to the devil for the destruction of the flesh?  After all he was probably just a baby believer ... The

flesh is to be reckoned dead and there are/were no righteous for Christ to come for so that is a moot point.

 

You ignore your own rebellion (as per the Adamic reality) and preach a gospel devoid of hope for those who are lost.   You have nothing to say to the addicted and that has been made clear time and time again , here on TT.  

 

I deal with my own Adamic reality daily JD. I hate ALL sin and this includes me. Jesus has a lot to say to the

addicted and he is their ONLY hope even though AA may buy them a brief stay of execution.

 

Shall we continue in sin that grace may abound?   When was the last time someone confused your teaching with that questioning?   I know the answer .  Never !!   And when was the last time someone asked me that question, in one way or the other?  It happens often  -- 

 

I have asked you this question in the past JD, but you don't receive it in the same way because of your bias.

 

which tells me that I am on the same page as Paul.   They confused his doctrine of sin and grace with license. 

 

The doctrine of sin and grace you promote is all yours JD, please don't put it off on Paul because you are

most definitely not on his page.  He wrote Eph 2:1-6 and the sin is always past tense - they WERE children of

wrath who walked in the lust of the flesh fulfilling the desires of the flesh and of the mind (just like addicts do)

 

That never happens with your teaching, Judy . And why?   Because your teaching is nothing like Paul's !!!  

Think about it...If we are not fighting the same battles as Paul, for example,  we are not teaching the same things

as Paul.

 

Paul is teaching the same thing as Jesus and the apostle Peter; he does not have a new message JD.

It is your message that is the aberration, sin is an enemy that should not be tolerated in any form or fashion.

 

 

 

 

From: Judy Taylor <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

Note: Free people are not in bondage; those walking in the victory of Calvary are not in bondage

It is those who have been overcome (and not by Christ)  who have been brought into bondage.

 

All very tricky and very twisted JD - this is not the faith ONCE DELIVERED TO THE SAINTS.

However, Jesus says "Whoever commits sin is the servant of sin and the servant abideth not in the house for ever

but the son abideth ever. If the son therefore SHALL MAKE YOU FREE, ye shall be free indeed" (John 8:34,35)

 

Jesus told those he ministered to "Go and sin no more lest a worse thing come upon you"

 

Peter said: "For whom a man is overcome, of the same is he brought in bondage" (2 Peter 2:19)

 

 

On Sat, 11 Mar 2006 04:15:59 +0000 [EMAIL PROTECTED] writes:

Believers in bondage to sin

Married Bachelors

Square circles     KD

 

Lk 18:27  --  what is impossible for man is possible with God.

Mk 9:23  --   all things are possible with God.

 

Now that I have my proof-texting urge nurtured, let me say this  ----   an addicted believer is not in bondage to sin !!!   What is the telltale mark of bondage if it is not death.........and death has been swallowed up in victory.   What Satan hopes to accomplish with addiction   --  death  --   has been replaced with the promise of life.   The glory of the cross is the fact that in Christ we have been reconciled to God  (Col 1:19-23).  There is no biblical reason for us to believe or teach that we are fully free from the affects of sin the moment we are converted and have received the Spirit.   And we know this to be true because sanctification is a process  (the process of maturing in Christ).   The Hebrews writer puts it this way,  "For both He who sanctifies and those who are being sanctified are all of one, for which reason He is not ashamed to call them brethren"  ( Heb 2:11). 

 

Shame is a reasonable consideration, in this passage,  because it speaks of the Christ (sinless as He stands before us) and the brethren, who are only in the process of BEING sanctified  (and are , therefore , not yet perfected).   But He is not ashamed of the relationship He has with those who are not yet as He is. 

 

The cross,  presenting that sacrifice delivered once and for all time,  gives the addicted believer all the time in this world to get the job done because he is ALREADY reconciled to God in Christ.  

 

And why are there only a few addicted believers?   Because they have been told a lie by the FAther of Lies.   DON'T TRY because TRYING IS NOT GOOD ENOUGH  !!!   CHRIST DEATH HAS NO MEANING FOR YOU IF YOU CANNOT BE LIKE HIM  !!  HIS VICTORY IS NOT SOVEREIGN !!

 

Lance's friend understands that we who are in Christ are no longer defined by the Adamic situation.   The addicted believers are defined by the One in whom they have faith AND NOT THEIR SIN.    It is to their own Master that they stand or fall AND THEY WILL BE MADE TO STAND   (Romans 14:4).   Praise God for the hope we have in Christ.  

 

Pastor Smithson

Bishop of Love and Understanding

Minister of Patient Grace

Overseer of the Gospel of Victory in Christ

Joint Heir in Christ

A son of God 

 

 

 

 

 

 

-------------- Original message --------------
From: Kevin Deegan <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>

Believers in bondage to sin

Married Bachelors

Square circles

Lance Muir <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:

I've a friend who runs a group home. He works the streets in the toughest area of one of Canada's largest cities. He is presently heading up a small group of believers, newer and older, including some seminarians, who are addicted to pornography and homosexuality Comments?

 

 

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