-----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- Hash: SHA1 On Fri, 13 Jun 2008 13:28:05 -0300 "Cody A.W. Somerville" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
> On Fri, Jun 13, 2008 at 12:43 PM, John Botscharow > <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > -----BEGIN PGP SIGNED MESSAGE----- > > Hash: SHA1 > > > > On Fri, 13 Jun 2008 11:34:20 -0300 > > "Cody A.W. Somerville" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote: > > > > > I've read every post thus far. > > > > Whew, then I don't need to bore everyone by repeating myself. :-) > > > > > > The reason I ask why you're getting so frustrated is because each > > > and every one of you are *enabled* to do your part to market > > > Ubuntu. Some might say they lack authority but let me put that > > > concern to bed - just say "I want to do this. If you're > > > interested in helping me, help me.". Some people will be critical > > > and others will think your idea is the best thing since sliced > > > bread. Work with the latter group and remove the doubt from the > > > former group by showing that your idea was and is a good idea by > > > being successful in executing it. > > > > And I got criticized for doing just that - the negative comments > > about off list discussions about developing a leadership proposal. > > > Unfortunately there will always be people who disagree with you. You > just have to roll with it :) Understood and assimilated. TY. > > > > > > > > And yes, I would like to help you. Contact me directly and let me > > know what you need help with. This will go a long way toward > > helping me learn the ropes here. More on this below. > > > > > > For example, John, someone (I can't remember who) was upset that > > > you put your personal articles on the wiki as a resource. You > > > took them off because of that person's complaints. If you felt > > > you were doing the right thing, you should have just left them > > > there after clearly explaining your rationale or if you realized > > > that there was a better place to put them then move them. If an > > > edit war broke out, you could have asked someone like myself to > > > intervene. If that didn't work then you could take it to the > > > community council. > > > > This is the main source of my frustration. I had no idea when that > > happened whether I really had the right to put them there or not. No > > one explained to me how things work, all they said was just do it > > and every time I did, I got criticized. I had no idea who to ask > > whether I really had to take them down. No one said, "John, it's > > your decision and here's what you do to deal with any negative > > feedback. > > > > As far as explaining my rationale for putting them there, I thought > > I did. > > > > At the time, I had no idea you even existed :-) I had no clue who to > > ask and given the way I felt at the time, I was not going to ask on > > this list. > > > > A suggestion: develop a guide for new people to the community that > > explains in simple terms - Ubuntu community for dummies - how things > > work, who to ask for advice, and don't say anyone on this list, > > because that did not work for me. More below. > > > There is material on the wiki but unfortunately even if we had every > piece of information written down it would still be difficult for > newcomers such as yourself to digest it. Joining a new community, > starting a new job, etc. is *always* a challenge. I will see if I can find it and take a look at it. Maybe I can figure out a way to make it more accessible to new people. > > > > > > > > > > There is no gurantees that you'll get help from others on your > > > project. Don't let that discourage you. If you honestly believe in > > > your idea, go for it! *Just* *do* *it*. If it is a super horrible > > > idea, you'll get flamed. If it is a good idea, you'll get > > > admiration and respect and you'll have an oppertunity to be a > > > leader. I don't have a problem doing it on my own, if need be. It would be nice to have some help, but not necessary. Given how I felt a couple of days ago, I would have preferred to just do it on my own and not say anything to anyone about it, but decided to try it the "FOSS" way, just to see what would happen. > > > > I never set out to be a leader. I took it on because no one else > > did. I have no need for power personally, but this team needs to > > get some direction and some structure and that direction and > > structure needs to be laid out clearly and plainly so someone > > unfamiliar with how things work can get real help, not just go do > > it. That works fine if you kbow HOW to do it, but if you don't, and > > no one really explains it you then that leads to frustration. > > > I understand how you feel. I used to be in the same boat with wanting > to get Xubuntu off the ground. It took me several years to get to > where I am today > - comfortable. I will try to be patient but I reserve my right to split :-) > > > > > > And, I have tried to just do it - see > > https://wiki.ubuntu.com/JohnBotscharow/Android and I posted a > > request for help - suggestions, comments, feedback - and all I got > > was one somewhat negative comment because either the person reading > > the page misunderstood what I was talking about or I need to > > clarify things a little better. I AM going to go see if I can make > > it clearer that this IS about marketing Ubuntu and not something > > else. > > > > All of this boils down to accountability and responsibility. Some > > constructive criticism, Cody. Your the only team administrator > > currently active. So you alone are ultimately accountable for and > > responsible for this team, in my opinion. We can not market > > effectively if we work like a bunch of guys on a basketball court, > > each with their own ball and each running around the floor with no > > coordination while trying to beat the Chicago Bulls back when they > > were the world champions all those years. There has to be a game > > plan and a playbook that everyone uses and buys into. But that > > playbook and game plan is not the responsibility of the individual > > players to design, there has to be a coaching staff to do that. > > > Maybe if we stopped thinking of the marketing team as the > be-all-is-all structure, we'll get somewhere. Maybe the said "team" > could be a few individuals working on a marketing project they > believe in (such as yourself and other individuals interested in your > Android project). That team/project will gather momentum as it finds > success (or will die out although not always in lack of a good idea) > and would probably grow into the "official" marketing team as people > realize they're the people getting stuff done - you get labelled as > the "goto guy" (or gal). The marketing TEAM may not be the be-all and end-all, but for me at least, marketing is. :-) I gave up marketing 2 1/2 years ago because I could not find something to market that fit my ethical standards. I think Ubuntu fits the bill. I am very passionate about marketing, and I take it VERY seriously. > <snip> [old header and signature stuff] > > > > So bottom line. You think your Android idea is a good one? Then do > it! :) There is nothing stopping you and if you're right then it'll > naturally turn this marketing team into what it seems you're looking > to foster! All great things! I thoroughly intend to. > > So don't let a bit of negative feedback stop you! Do something > great! :D When you're new on the job, you take what your co-workers say to heart. I've learned not to so much now. > > Cheers, > - -- Peace! John -----BEGIN PGP SIGNATURE----- Version: GnuPG v1.4.6 (GNU/Linux) iD8DBQFIUqjlsTN+hz1Fu7URAmumAJwPSyWV4nXL35FjktjpIXOMPpD/jgCff5MN 8RWnNCfEEWeJnKl23oqaDCw= =PuRj -----END PGP SIGNATURE----- -- ubuntu-marketing mailing list ubuntu-marketing@lists.ubuntu.com Modify settings or unsubscribe at: https://lists.ubuntu.com/mailman/listinfo/ubuntu-marketing
