That sounds very cool Piotr! :) El mar., 10 mar. 2020 a las 12:39, Piotr Zarzycki (< piotrzarzyck...@gmail.com>) escribió:
> Hi Guys, > > We have plan to add simple GUI IDE to Moonshine which outputs Royale Jewel > type of applications. Be patience and observer Moonshine IDE on GitHub. ;) > > Thanks, > Piotr > > wt., 10 mar 2020 o 11:05 Carlos Rovira <carlosrov...@apache.org> > napisał(a): > > > Hi Paul, > > > > the example you posted is easy to do nowadays with current Royale in > > development branch. You can take a try with Jewel or emulation > components. > > You'll be surprised of how far Royale is this days :). > > > > Best > > > > Carlos > > > > > > > > El mar., 10 mar. 2020 a las 5:28, Alex Harui (<aha...@adobe.com.invalid > >) > > escribió: > > > > > While it may be that someone offers a GUI IDE some day for Royale, > there > > > is are some other approaches, one that has been prototyped, and one > that > > > wasn't possible with Flash Player. > > > > > > IIRC, one prototype adds some things to your app that allow you to edit > > > the x/y/width/height in your MXML and immediately see the results in > the > > > browser. > > > > > > The other approach is to write a bead that can track your MXML from the > > > browser so you can use the browser tools to modify the UI and hit some > > > button that will then update the MXML. > > > > > > There are some limitations to these approaches which is why none are > > > available at this time. The main one is that use of view states > greatly > > > complicates these approaches (as it does for a GUI IDE as well). So > one > > > question for you, are you using view states (mx:State)? > > > > > > -Alex > > > > > > On 3/9/20, 8:26 PM, "Paul Stearns" <pa...@compuace.com.INVALID> > wrote: > > > > > > Regarding a GUI IDE, in one application, one of the larger modules > > has > > > 1,390 lines of mxml code. One of 10 tabs in that module has 29 > enterable > > > "fields" another tab has over 50 enterable fields. > > > > > > Attempting to create complex screens which are usable for the type > of > > > data entry these systems are used for would be difficult at best > without > > > using a GUI editor. If you are designing traditional web applications > > where > > > everything is stacked and the user scrolls forever then yes you can do > > that > > > without a GUI IDE. If however you want to design highly usable business > > > applications deployed to thin clients (to use an ancient phrase) you > need > > > GUI tools to be productive. > > > > > > My initial test application (very simplistic) for Royale can be > found > > > here, be sure to click everything; (If something doesn't work as > > expected, > > > let me know, no data is stored) > > > > > > > > > > > > https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fflex.yozyo.net%2FTestModule%2Fbin-release%2FMain.html%3Ftest%3D123&data=02%7C01%7Caharui%40adobe.com%7C2d118f114b934f5c2b7f08d7c4a2d308%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C1%7C637194075912239790&sdata=iA9Av%2FhjDmDmMqdRVgsb2wb33Eqq8G7VVpbQ1cQDJ%2Bg%3D&reserved=0 > > > > > > Some of the The features I am looking for include canvas with x/y > > > placement of items, multiple panels up simultaneously, etc. > > > > > > Paul R. Stearns > > > Advanced Consulting Enterprises, Inc. > > > > > > 15280 NW 79th Ct. > > > Suite 250 > > > Miami Lakes, Fl 33016 > > > > > > Voice: (305)623-0360 x107 > > > Fax: (305)623-4588 > > > > > > ---------------------------------------- > > > From: Carlos Rovira <carlosrov...@apache.org> > > > Sent: 3/9/20 6:14 PM > > > To: users@flex.apache.org, Paul Stearns <pa...@compuace.com> > > > Subject: Re: [Spam] :Re: Flex 4.16.1 broken for AIR33.1? > > > Hi Paul, > > > > > > many years ago I must say that was completely true, for that > reason I > > > started trying to introduce in my clients and projects Flash and > AMF > > in > > > early 2000, first with Flash authoring tool, then with MTASC > (someone > > > remember it? ;)), and then Flex was really what we just needed. > That > > > was > > > very disruptive compared with the html/js/css stack at that time. > > > > > > Currently that's not true. Near 2020, js is like the bytecode in > > Flash > > > and > > > Royale is the current Flex. So it's clear that you don't need to go > > > very > > > "low level", but if you needed, you can do it! (and that's good). > But > > > Royale should allow you to develop without the need to go that > route. > > > and > > > just use good proven patterns like Flex did. We're working towards > > > that...and I think we're already got it. :) > > > > > > About GUI IDE, although I think is something very cool to have > > > something > > > like that, I abandoned that kind of tools many years ago. Maybe in > > the > > > future I could be working in something like that, just for > pleasure, > > > but > > > for now there's still many work to do in Royale in things more > > needed. > > > Maybe others could drive that effort... But I really think the > > current > > > Royale coding is very straight forward to do. As well examples like > > > Tour De > > > Jewel has a lot of code to see how things should be used and learn > > > from it > > > a lot of good practices. > > > > > > El lun., 9 mar. 2020 a las 22:48, Paul Stearns () > > > escribió: > > > > > > > What attracted me to Flex initially was that it ran in its own > > > > environment, completely separate from the html, web browser and > > their > > > > multitude of DOMs. I used to write apps in ASP/HTML, and every > > other > > > week a > > > > new version of a browser would break something. > > > > > > > > For the type of applications I write & support, having a GUI > IDE, a > > > > defined language (like as3 & mxml) and an engine which which > > provides > > > > consistent results across platforms are the most important > > features. > > > At > > > > this point the weakness I see in Royale is there isn't a GUI IDE, > > > and since > > > > it doesn't have its own engine, it relies on the vicissitudes of > > > javascript > > > > and how the particular browser it is running in implements its > DOM. > > > > > > > > This is why I shied away from .NET, and PHP in the past except > for > > > more > > > > traditional websites with a bit of user interaction. Javascript > > > frameworks > > > > just hide the ugliness, they don't make it go away. > > > > > > > > Having said all of the above, I am taking a chance on Royale to > see > > > what > > > > the level of effort will be to convert to it. > > > > > > > > Paul R. Stearns > > > > Advanced Consulting Enterprises, Inc. > > > > > > > > 15280 NW 79th Ct. > > > > Suite 250 > > > > Miami Lakes, Fl 33016 > > > > > > > > Voice: (305)623-0360 x107 > > > > Fax: (305)623-4588 > > > > > > > > ---------------------------------------- > > > > From: Carlos Rovira > > > > Sent: 3/9/20 4:55 PM > > > > To: Paul Stearns > > > > Cc: users@flex.apache.org > > > > Subject: Re: [Spam] :Re: Flex 4.16.1 broken for AIR33.1? > > > > Hi Paul, > > > > > > > > I suppose you refer to Java Applets, hope other could give more > > info > > > about > > > > this, but although you're in part right, I think Flash Player is > > > more well > > > > integrated in Browsers and Applets never had the power of Flash. > > But > > > it's > > > > ok, you can enable in browsers... anyway, we 're in 2020 and > seems > > > things > > > > will continue its course, so nothing we can do to revert that. > > > > > > > > I always be a great advocate of the Flash platform, but I found > in > > > Royale > > > > something better that what we had with Flash. IMHO, we have the > > best > > > of > > > > both worlds. From Flex/Flash I wanted the "development > > productivity", > > > > languages (AS3, MXML), compiler, AMF, and many other things. From > > > web I > > > > always liked things like CSS (that's far superior than what we > had > > > in Flex > > > > for sure), and the fact that we are not constraint to a plugin > and > > a > > > > sandbox, so it's more easy to do things for the web. > > > > > > > > We have both combined now in Royale, and that's for me amazing. > As > > > we get > > > > components with clear API definitions, and access to latest > > browsers > > > > features, we are getting the same productivity that we had in > Flex, > > > and as > > > > well we are removing the complexity in Browsers where you need to > > > test in > > > > each browsers or lost time solving browser compatibility > problems. > > We > > > > finally can have things like IoC (Inversion of Control), DI > > > (Dependency > > > > Injection), Metadata, MXML, Routing (Deep Linking), LocalStorage > > > (like old > > > > Local SharedObject), just to name a few. > > > > > > > > But even more, since the bead/strand Arquitecture is really > > > powerful, and > > > > Apps build with royale are more easy to build that even was in > > > Royale. And > > > > the most important: Performance: The apps built with Royale has > an > > > > outstanding performance. Apps migrated from Flex use to be many > XX% > > > faster > > > > in Royale. > > > > > > > > I must say, I'm very happy with what we're getting with Apache > > > Royale :) > > > > > > > > Carlos > > > > > > > > El lun., 9 mar. 2020 a las 20:46, Paul Stearns () > > > > escribió: > > > > > > > > > I am investing Royale, but haven't seen any results yet. > > > > > > > > > > I am showing my ignorance here, but, my confusion is, will Java > > > still be > > > > > deployable via web browsers? If so, what is the difference > > between > > > using > > > > a > > > > > web browser to deploy a Java app, and a Flash app? > > > > > > > > > > Why couldn't Adobe/Harmon changed Flash to use the methodology > > > Flash uses > > > > > for deployment? > > > > > > > > > > Paul R. Stearns > > > > > Advanced Consulting Enterprises, Inc. > > > > > > > > > > 15280 NW 79th Ct. > > > > > Suite 250 > > > > > Miami Lakes, Fl 33016 > > > > > > > > > > Voice: (305)623-0360 x107 > > > > > Fax: (305)623-4588 > > > > > > > > > > ------------------------------ > > > > > *From*: Carlos Rovira > > > > > *Sent*: 3/9/20 3:31 PM > > > > > *To*: users@flex.apache.org, Paul Stearns > > > > > *Subject*: [Spam] :Re: Flex 4.16.1 broken for AIR33.1? > > > > > Hi Paul, > > > > > > > > > > must say don't know what's the actual support of Adobe for > Flash > > > Player, > > > > > or if it will left to Harman as part of the AIR deal, maybe > > Andrew > > > can > > > > give > > > > > some light on this. Since Flash will be just present on AIR, > and > > > not in > > > > any > > > > > other place, that could have sense. But that will mean more > > > maintenance > > > > > effort and people needed by Harman. > > > > > > > > > > Anyway, donating to Apache has no sense at all, since Flash > > Player > > > has > > > > > many licensed closed source parts that can't be open source, or > > at > > > least > > > > > that's what they always says. But again...donating Flash Player > > and > > > > making > > > > > it OS, if it could be something doable at some point (let's go > > > utopic ;), > > > > > does not change anything, since Browser vendors are closing > > plugin > > > doors. > > > > > So even in that case, it continue to be a death end. > > > > > > > > > > I think Apache Royale is this days in a very good shape, and is > > > better > > > > > each day... so I maybe people should give a try and consider it > > as > > > an > > > > > option for the future. > > > > > > > > > > Thanks > > > > > > > > > > El lun., 9 mar. 2020 a las 20:04, Paul Stearns () > > > > > escribió: > > > > > > > > > >> Has Adobe stopped supporting it, and has not turned it over to > > > Apache? > > > > >> Now that is just unconscionable. > > > > >> > > > > >> Paul R. Stearns > > > > >> Advanced Consulting Enterprises, Inc. > > > > >> > > > > >> 15280 NW 79th Ct. > > > > >> Suite 250 > > > > >> Miami Lakes, Fl 33016 > > > > >> > > > > >> Voice: (305)623-0360 x107 > > > > >> Fax: (305)623-4588 > > > > >> > > > > >> ---------------------------------------- > > > > >> From: Carlos Rovira > > > > >> Sent: 3/9/20 1:28 PM > > > > >> To: users@flex.apache.org, Paul Stearns > > > > >> Subject: Re: Flex 4.16.1 broken for AIR33.1? > > > > >> Hi Paul, > > > > >> > > > > >> not bad idea, but don't know a browser that will support > Flash, > > > and the > > > > >> problem is Adobe is stopping supporting flash player as a > > plugin, > > > so I'm > > > > >> afraid that's not possible. > > > > >> > > > > >> El lun., 9 mar. 2020 a las 17:40, Paul Stearns () > > > > >> escribió: > > > > >> > > > > >> > Better yet, how about supporting a browser whose main > feature > > > is the > > > > >> > support of Flex? > > > > >> > > > > > >> > My applications are 99.9% flex. The main things I use the > > > browser for > > > > is > > > > >> > application deployment, file upload/download and displaying > > PDF > > > > files.. > > > > >> > > > > > >> > Paul R. Stearns > > > > >> > Advanced Consulting Enterprises, Inc. > > > > >> > > > > > >> > 15280 NW 79th Ct. > > > > >> > Suite 250 > > > > >> > Miami Lakes, Fl 33016 > > > > >> > > > > > >> > Voice: (305)623-0360 x107 > > > > >> > Fax: (305)623-4588 > > > > >> > > > > > >> > ---------------------------------------- > > > > >> > From: Carlos Rovira > > > > >> > Sent: 3/9/20 10:09 AM > > > > >> > To: users@flex.apache.org > > > > >> > Subject: Re: Flex 4.16.1 broken for AIR33.1? > > > > >> > Hi Andrew, > > > > >> > > > > > >> > When Dec, 31th arrives, Flex will be out of browsers, so > just > > > allowed > > > > >> using > > > > >> > AIR. Maybe AIR could have an option to bundle Apache Flex > with > > > each > > > > >> version > > > > >> > that ensures all work right. I mean, in 2021, Apache Flex > will > > > not > > > > have > > > > >> > sense with AIR right? so why not to think in something that > > > ease even > > > > >> more > > > > >> > AIR+Flex marriage? Of course a version without Flex should > > have > > > sense > > > > >> too > > > > >> > for people that does not use Flex at all. > > > > >> > > > > > >> > Make that sense? > > > > >> > > > > > >> > Thanks > > > > >> > > > > > >> > Carlos > > > > >> > > > > > >> > El lun., 9 mar. 2020 a las 14:45, Frost, Andrew () > > > > >> > escribió: > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > Hi > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > We'd be happy to add things like this geometry API change > - > > > but it's > > > > >> then > > > > >> > > going to be version-dependent so it would need to be > > compiled > > > > against > > > > >> the > > > > >> > > later AIR SDK and would only run on the later AIR > runtime.. > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > I'm not sure whether there are other changes that would > > really > > > > impact > > > > >> the > > > > >> > > Flex SDK itself. So perhaps we can consider these on a > > > case-by-case > > > > >> > basis. > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > The one thing I keep coming back to though, is that it > seems > > > to be a > > > > >> very > > > > >> > > painful process for (a) people to download and start > using a > > > new AIR > > > > >> SDK, > > > > >> > > and (b) people who then have to combine a Flex SDK with an > > > AIR SDK! > > > > >> So we > > > > >> > > should perhaps address this in the first instance (and > from > > > our QA > > > > >> folk, > > > > >> > > having a simple way to ensure you get back to a clean > > version > > > of > > > > >> one/both > > > > >> > > of these SDKs would be good too!) > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > Any other thoughts on missing features or things that > would > > be > > > > useful, > > > > >> > > please send them in! > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > thanks > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > Andrew > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > -----Original Message----- > > > > >> > > From: Piotr Zarzycki > > > > >> > > Sent: 09 March 2020 13:01 > > > > >> > > To: users@flex.apache.org > > > > >> > > Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: Flex 4.16.1 broken for AIR33.1? > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > Hi Andrew, > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > This kind of situation may occur more often in the future > if > > > Air > > > > would > > > > >> > > have more and more features. Is there any plan to someone > > > from your > > > > >> Team > > > > >> > > simply add missing stuff to Flex? Any thoughts on this > > > approach? > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > Thanks, > > > > >> > > Piotr > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > On Mon, Mar 9, 2020, 1:49 PM Frost, Andrew > > > > >> > > wrote: > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > Hi Olaf > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > I think it would be nice if any AIR updates would be > > > compatible > > > > >> with > > > > >> > > > > the > > > > >> > > > latest Flex SDK > > > > >> > > > Yes completely agree, this was an error on our part to > not > > > > consider > > > > >> > > > the fact that overrides of the APIs that we were > changing > > > would > > > > have > > > > >> > > > been affected. The changes were reverted, and we have > > > > re-implemented > > > > >> > > > the new functionality within additional APIs/methods so > > that > > > > >> existing > > > > >> > > > apps will now compile/run without any changes on the > > > 33.1.1.63 > > > > >> release. > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > We definitely intend that there is still full > > compatibility > > > > between > > > > >> > > > Flex and any changes we make with AIR.. so thanks to > > > leokan23 and > > > > >> Alex > > > > >> > > > for bringing this to our attention! > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > thanks > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > Andrew > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > -----Original Message----- > > > > >> > > > From: Olaf Krueger > > > > >> > > > Sent: 06 March 2020 20:30 > > > > >> > > > To: users@flex.apache.org > > > > >> > > > Subject: [EXTERNAL] RE: Flex 4.16.1 broken for AIR33.1? > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > Hi, > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > I didn't follow the entire discussion, but I'd like to > > > mention > > > > that > > > > >> I > > > > >> > > > am not sure if we still have enough volunteers which are > > > willing > > > > to > > > > >> > > > work on a new Flex release. > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > That said, I think it would be nice if any AIR updates > > > would be > > > > >> > > > compatible with the latest Flex SDK... as long as it's > > > possible. > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > Thanks, > > > > >> > > > Olaf > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > -- > > > > >> > > > Sent from: > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fclicktime.symantec.com%2F3T23VtMr4Dz6j6DqBbgaf5T7Vc%3Fu%3Dhttp%253A%252F&data=02%7C01%7Caharui%40adobe.com%7C2d118f114b934f5c2b7f08d7c4a2d308%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C1%7C637194075912239790&sdata=VNLYBUe1LJaLdwUrgqOC6YZsYufcwhlivkiljxQTyE8%3D&reserved=0 > > > > >> > > > %2Fapache-flex-users.2333346.n4.nabble.com%2F > > > > >> > > > > > > > >> > > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > -- > > > > >> > Carlos Rovira > > > > >> > > > > > > > https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fabout.me%2Fcarlosrovira&data=02%7C01%7Caharui%40adobe.com%7C2d118f114b934f5c2b7f08d7c4a2d308%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C1%7C637194075912239790&sdata=M2iILzk8UGcWyJ6WHBJPaFpVk%2B7f%2Bg2V2O4dD3RHtTc%3D&reserved=0 > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > > >> > > > > >> -- > > > > >> Carlos Rovira > > > > >> > > > > > > https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fabout.me%2Fcarlosrovira&data=02%7C01%7Caharui%40adobe.com%7C2d118f114b934f5c2b7f08d7c4a2d308%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C1%7C637194075912249784&sdata=QQrsLW%2B%2BScKRSe4vFxghzris7E1zv5ZLoRhe0KGJp%2Fo%3D&reserved=0 > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > >> > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > > Carlos Rovira > > > > > > > > > > > https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fabout.me%2Fcarlosrovira&data=02%7C01%7Caharui%40adobe.com%7C2d118f114b934f5c2b7f08d7c4a2d308%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C1%7C637194075912249784&sdata=QQrsLW%2B%2BScKRSe4vFxghzris7E1zv5ZLoRhe0KGJp%2Fo%3D&reserved=0 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > > Carlos Rovira > > > > > > > > > > https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fabout.me%2Fcarlosrovira&data=02%7C01%7Caharui%40adobe.com%7C2d118f114b934f5c2b7f08d7c4a2d308%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C1%7C637194075912249784&sdata=QQrsLW%2B%2BScKRSe4vFxghzris7E1zv5ZLoRhe0KGJp%2Fo%3D&reserved=0 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > > Carlos Rovira > > > > > > > > > https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fabout.me%2Fcarlosrovira&data=02%7C01%7Caharui%40adobe.com%7C2d118f114b934f5c2b7f08d7c4a2d308%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C1%7C637194075912249784&sdata=QQrsLW%2B%2BScKRSe4vFxghzris7E1zv5ZLoRhe0KGJp%2Fo%3D&reserved=0 > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > > -- > > Carlos Rovira > > http://about.me/carlosrovira > > > > > -- > > Piotr Zarzycki > > Patreon: *https://www.patreon.com/piotrzarzycki > <https://www.patreon.com/piotrzarzycki>* > -- Carlos Rovira http://about.me/carlosrovira
