Sounds exciting. Hopefully the GUI editor will use a browser as the renderer
and be more like live-editing than trying to emulate the browser DOM.
Of course, I could be wrong...
-Alex
On 3/10/20, 4:39 AM, "Piotr Zarzycki" <piotrzarzyck...@gmail.com> wrote:
Hi Guys,
We have plan to add simple GUI IDE to Moonshine which outputs Royale Jewel
type of applications. Be patience and observer Moonshine IDE on GitHub. ;)
Thanks,
Piotr
wt., 10 mar 2020 o 11:05 Carlos Rovira <carlosrov...@apache.org> napisał(a):
> Hi Paul,
>
> the example you posted is easy to do nowadays with current Royale in
> development branch. You can take a try with Jewel or emulation components.
> You'll be surprised of how far Royale is this days :).
>
> Best
>
> Carlos
>
>
>
> El mar., 10 mar. 2020 a las 5:28, Alex Harui (<aha...@adobe.com.invalid>)
> escribió:
>
> > While it may be that someone offers a GUI IDE some day for Royale, there
> > is are some other approaches, one that has been prototyped, and one that
> > wasn't possible with Flash Player.
> >
> > IIRC, one prototype adds some things to your app that allow you to edit
> > the x/y/width/height in your MXML and immediately see the results in the
> > browser.
> >
> > The other approach is to write a bead that can track your MXML from the
> > browser so you can use the browser tools to modify the UI and hit some
> > button that will then update the MXML.
> >
> > There are some limitations to these approaches which is why none are
> > available at this time. The main one is that use of view states greatly
> > complicates these approaches (as it does for a GUI IDE as well). So one
> > question for you, are you using view states (mx:State)?
> >
> > -Alex
> >
> > On 3/9/20, 8:26 PM, "Paul Stearns" <pa...@compuace.com.INVALID> wrote:
> >
> > Regarding a GUI IDE, in one application, one of the larger modules
> has
> > 1,390 lines of mxml code. One of 10 tabs in that module has 29 enterable
> > "fields" another tab has over 50 enterable fields.
> >
> > Attempting to create complex screens which are usable for the type
of
> > data entry these systems are used for would be difficult at best without
> > using a GUI editor. If you are designing traditional web applications
> where
> > everything is stacked and the user scrolls forever then yes you can do
> that
> > without a GUI IDE. If however you want to design highly usable business
> > applications deployed to thin clients (to use an ancient phrase) you
need
> > GUI tools to be productive.
> >
> > My initial test application (very simplistic) for Royale can be
found
> > here, be sure to click everything; (If something doesn't work as
> expected,
> > let me know, no data is stored)
> >
> >
> >
>
https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fflex.yozyo.net%2FTestModule%2Fbin-release%2FMain.html%3Ftest%3D123&data=02%7C01%7Caharui%40adobe.com%7C3973fca8e91b4f4cd67808d7c4e7bd62%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C637194371909967487&sdata=9FwboMWcAlwGX7FtsA8q6%2B1Fb1L1obsoI7VS8ONISCA%3D&reserved=0
> >
> > Some of the The features I am looking for include canvas with x/y
> > placement of items, multiple panels up simultaneously, etc.
> >
> > Paul R. Stearns
> > Advanced Consulting Enterprises, Inc.
> >
> > 15280 NW 79th Ct.
> > Suite 250
> > Miami Lakes, Fl 33016
> >
> > Voice: (305)623-0360 x107
> > Fax: (305)623-4588
> >
> > ----------------------------------------
> > From: Carlos Rovira <carlosrov...@apache.org>
> > Sent: 3/9/20 6:14 PM
> > To: users@flex.apache.org, Paul Stearns <pa...@compuace.com>
> > Subject: Re: [Spam] :Re: Flex 4.16.1 broken for AIR33.1?
> > Hi Paul,
> >
> > many years ago I must say that was completely true, for that reason
I
> > started trying to introduce in my clients and projects Flash and AMF
> in
> > early 2000, first with Flash authoring tool, then with MTASC
(someone
> > remember it? ;)), and then Flex was really what we just needed. That
> > was
> > very disruptive compared with the html/js/css stack at that time.
> >
> > Currently that's not true. Near 2020, js is like the bytecode in
> Flash
> > and
> > Royale is the current Flex. So it's clear that you don't need to go
> > very
> > "low level", but if you needed, you can do it! (and that's good).
But
> > Royale should allow you to develop without the need to go that
route.
> > and
> > just use good proven patterns like Flex did. We're working towards
> > that...and I think we're already got it. :)
> >
> > About GUI IDE, although I think is something very cool to have
> > something
> > like that, I abandoned that kind of tools many years ago. Maybe in
> the
> > future I could be working in something like that, just for pleasure,
> > but
> > for now there's still many work to do in Royale in things more
> needed.
> > Maybe others could drive that effort... But I really think the
> current
> > Royale coding is very straight forward to do. As well examples like
> > Tour De
> > Jewel has a lot of code to see how things should be used and learn
> > from it
> > a lot of good practices.
> >
> > El lun., 9 mar. 2020 a las 22:48, Paul Stearns ()
> > escribió:
> >
> > > What attracted me to Flex initially was that it ran in its own
> > > environment, completely separate from the html, web browser and
> their
> > > multitude of DOMs. I used to write apps in ASP/HTML, and every
> other
> > week a
> > > new version of a browser would break something.
> > >
> > > For the type of applications I write & support, having a GUI IDE,
a
> > > defined language (like as3 & mxml) and an engine which which
> provides
> > > consistent results across platforms are the most important
> features.
> > At
> > > this point the weakness I see in Royale is there isn't a GUI IDE,
> > and since
> > > it doesn't have its own engine, it relies on the vicissitudes of
> > javascript
> > > and how the particular browser it is running in implements its
DOM.
> > >
> > > This is why I shied away from .NET, and PHP in the past except for
> > more
> > > traditional websites with a bit of user interaction. Javascript
> > frameworks
> > > just hide the ugliness, they don't make it go away.
> > >
> > > Having said all of the above, I am taking a chance on Royale to
see
> > what
> > > the level of effort will be to convert to it.
> > >
> > > Paul R. Stearns
> > > Advanced Consulting Enterprises, Inc.
> > >
> > > 15280 NW 79th Ct.
> > > Suite 250
> > > Miami Lakes, Fl 33016
> > >
> > > Voice: (305)623-0360 x107
> > > Fax: (305)623-4588
> > >
> > > ----------------------------------------
> > > From: Carlos Rovira
> > > Sent: 3/9/20 4:55 PM
> > > To: Paul Stearns
> > > Cc: users@flex.apache.org
> > > Subject: Re: [Spam] :Re: Flex 4.16.1 broken for AIR33.1?
> > > Hi Paul,
> > >
> > > I suppose you refer to Java Applets, hope other could give more
> info
> > about
> > > this, but although you're in part right, I think Flash Player is
> > more well
> > > integrated in Browsers and Applets never had the power of Flash.
> But
> > it's
> > > ok, you can enable in browsers... anyway, we 're in 2020 and seems
> > things
> > > will continue its course, so nothing we can do to revert that.
> > >
> > > I always be a great advocate of the Flash platform, but I found in
> > Royale
> > > something better that what we had with Flash. IMHO, we have the
> best
> > of
> > > both worlds. From Flex/Flash I wanted the "development
> productivity",
> > > languages (AS3, MXML), compiler, AMF, and many other things. From
> > web I
> > > always liked things like CSS (that's far superior than what we had
> > in Flex
> > > for sure), and the fact that we are not constraint to a plugin and
> a
> > > sandbox, so it's more easy to do things for the web.
> > >
> > > We have both combined now in Royale, and that's for me amazing. As
> > we get
> > > components with clear API definitions, and access to latest
> browsers
> > > features, we are getting the same productivity that we had in
Flex,
> > and as
> > > well we are removing the complexity in Browsers where you need to
> > test in
> > > each browsers or lost time solving browser compatibility problems.
> We
> > > finally can have things like IoC (Inversion of Control), DI
> > (Dependency
> > > Injection), Metadata, MXML, Routing (Deep Linking), LocalStorage
> > (like old
> > > Local SharedObject), just to name a few.
> > >
> > > But even more, since the bead/strand Arquitecture is really
> > powerful, and
> > > Apps build with royale are more easy to build that even was in
> > Royale. And
> > > the most important: Performance: The apps built with Royale has an
> > > outstanding performance. Apps migrated from Flex use to be many
XX%
> > faster
> > > in Royale.
> > >
> > > I must say, I'm very happy with what we're getting with Apache
> > Royale :)
> > >
> > > Carlos
> > >
> > > El lun., 9 mar. 2020 a las 20:46, Paul Stearns ()
> > > escribió:
> > >
> > > > I am investing Royale, but haven't seen any results yet.
> > > >
> > > > I am showing my ignorance here, but, my confusion is, will Java
> > still be
> > > > deployable via web browsers? If so, what is the difference
> between
> > using
> > > a
> > > > web browser to deploy a Java app, and a Flash app?
> > > >
> > > > Why couldn't Adobe/Harmon changed Flash to use the methodology
> > Flash uses
> > > > for deployment?
> > > >
> > > > Paul R. Stearns
> > > > Advanced Consulting Enterprises, Inc.
> > > >
> > > > 15280 NW 79th Ct.
> > > > Suite 250
> > > > Miami Lakes, Fl 33016
> > > >
> > > > Voice: (305)623-0360 x107
> > > > Fax: (305)623-4588
> > > >
> > > > ------------------------------
> > > > *From*: Carlos Rovira
> > > > *Sent*: 3/9/20 3:31 PM
> > > > *To*: users@flex.apache.org, Paul Stearns
> > > > *Subject*: [Spam] :Re: Flex 4.16.1 broken for AIR33.1?
> > > > Hi Paul,
> > > >
> > > > must say don't know what's the actual support of Adobe for Flash
> > Player,
> > > > or if it will left to Harman as part of the AIR deal, maybe
> Andrew
> > can
> > > give
> > > > some light on this. Since Flash will be just present on AIR, and
> > not in
> > > any
> > > > other place, that could have sense. But that will mean more
> > maintenance
> > > > effort and people needed by Harman.
> > > >
> > > > Anyway, donating to Apache has no sense at all, since Flash
> Player
> > has
> > > > many licensed closed source parts that can't be open source, or
> at
> > least
> > > > that's what they always says. But again...donating Flash Player
> and
> > > making
> > > > it OS, if it could be something doable at some point (let's go
> > utopic ;),
> > > > does not change anything, since Browser vendors are closing
> plugin
> > doors.
> > > > So even in that case, it continue to be a death end.
> > > >
> > > > I think Apache Royale is this days in a very good shape, and is
> > better
> > > > each day... so I maybe people should give a try and consider it
> as
> > an
> > > > option for the future.
> > > >
> > > > Thanks
> > > >
> > > > El lun., 9 mar. 2020 a las 20:04, Paul Stearns ()
> > > > escribió:
> > > >
> > > >> Has Adobe stopped supporting it, and has not turned it over to
> > Apache?
> > > >> Now that is just unconscionable.
> > > >>
> > > >> Paul R. Stearns
> > > >> Advanced Consulting Enterprises, Inc.
> > > >>
> > > >> 15280 NW 79th Ct.
> > > >> Suite 250
> > > >> Miami Lakes, Fl 33016
> > > >>
> > > >> Voice: (305)623-0360 x107
> > > >> Fax: (305)623-4588
> > > >>
> > > >> ----------------------------------------
> > > >> From: Carlos Rovira
> > > >> Sent: 3/9/20 1:28 PM
> > > >> To: users@flex.apache.org, Paul Stearns
> > > >> Subject: Re: Flex 4.16.1 broken for AIR33.1?
> > > >> Hi Paul,
> > > >>
> > > >> not bad idea, but don't know a browser that will support Flash,
> > and the
> > > >> problem is Adobe is stopping supporting flash player as a
> plugin,
> > so I'm
> > > >> afraid that's not possible.
> > > >>
> > > >> El lun., 9 mar. 2020 a las 17:40, Paul Stearns ()
> > > >> escribió:
> > > >>
> > > >> > Better yet, how about supporting a browser whose main feature
> > is the
> > > >> > support of Flex?
> > > >> >
> > > >> > My applications are 99.9% flex. The main things I use the
> > browser for
> > > is
> > > >> > application deployment, file upload/download and displaying
> PDF
> > > files..
> > > >> >
> > > >> > Paul R. Stearns
> > > >> > Advanced Consulting Enterprises, Inc.
> > > >> >
> > > >> > 15280 NW 79th Ct.
> > > >> > Suite 250
> > > >> > Miami Lakes, Fl 33016
> > > >> >
> > > >> > Voice: (305)623-0360 x107
> > > >> > Fax: (305)623-4588
> > > >> >
> > > >> > ----------------------------------------
> > > >> > From: Carlos Rovira
> > > >> > Sent: 3/9/20 10:09 AM
> > > >> > To: users@flex.apache.org
> > > >> > Subject: Re: Flex 4.16.1 broken for AIR33.1?
> > > >> > Hi Andrew,
> > > >> >
> > > >> > When Dec, 31th arrives, Flex will be out of browsers, so just
> > allowed
> > > >> using
> > > >> > AIR. Maybe AIR could have an option to bundle Apache Flex
with
> > each
> > > >> version
> > > >> > that ensures all work right. I mean, in 2021, Apache Flex
will
> > not
> > > have
> > > >> > sense with AIR right? so why not to think in something that
> > ease even
> > > >> more
> > > >> > AIR+Flex marriage? Of course a version without Flex should
> have
> > sense
> > > >> too
> > > >> > for people that does not use Flex at all.
> > > >> >
> > > >> > Make that sense?
> > > >> >
> > > >> > Thanks
> > > >> >
> > > >> > Carlos
> > > >> >
> > > >> > El lun., 9 mar. 2020 a las 14:45, Frost, Andrew ()
> > > >> > escribió:
> > > >> >
> > > >> > > Hi
> > > >> > >
> > > >> > > We'd be happy to add things like this geometry API change -
> > but it's
> > > >> then
> > > >> > > going to be version-dependent so it would need to be
> compiled
> > > against
> > > >> the
> > > >> > > later AIR SDK and would only run on the later AIR runtime..
> > > >> > >
> > > >> > > I'm not sure whether there are other changes that would
> really
> > > impact
> > > >> the
> > > >> > > Flex SDK itself. So perhaps we can consider these on a
> > case-by-case
> > > >> > basis.
> > > >> > >
> > > >> > > The one thing I keep coming back to though, is that it
seems
> > to be a
> > > >> very
> > > >> > > painful process for (a) people to download and start using
a
> > new AIR
> > > >> SDK,
> > > >> > > and (b) people who then have to combine a Flex SDK with an
> > AIR SDK!
> > > >> So we
> > > >> > > should perhaps address this in the first instance (and from
> > our QA
> > > >> folk,
> > > >> > > having a simple way to ensure you get back to a clean
> version
> > of
> > > >> one/both
> > > >> > > of these SDKs would be good too!)
> > > >> > >
> > > >> > > Any other thoughts on missing features or things that would
> be
> > > useful,
> > > >> > > please send them in!
> > > >> > >
> > > >> > > thanks
> > > >> > >
> > > >> > > Andrew
> > > >> > >
> > > >> > >
> > > >> > > -----Original Message-----
> > > >> > > From: Piotr Zarzycki
> > > >> > > Sent: 09 March 2020 13:01
> > > >> > > To: users@flex.apache.org
> > > >> > > Subject: [EXTERNAL] Re: Flex 4.16.1 broken for AIR33.1?
> > > >> > >
> > > >> > > Hi Andrew,
> > > >> > >
> > > >> > > This kind of situation may occur more often in the future
if
> > Air
> > > would
> > > >> > > have more and more features. Is there any plan to someone
> > from your
> > > >> Team
> > > >> > > simply add missing stuff to Flex? Any thoughts on this
> > approach?
> > > >> > >
> > > >> > > Thanks,
> > > >> > > Piotr
> > > >> > >
> > > >> > > On Mon, Mar 9, 2020, 1:49 PM Frost, Andrew
> > > >> > > wrote:
> > > >> > >
> > > >> > > > Hi Olaf
> > > >> > > >
> > > >> > > > > I think it would be nice if any AIR updates would be
> > compatible
> > > >> with
> > > >> > > > > the
> > > >> > > > latest Flex SDK
> > > >> > > > Yes completely agree, this was an error on our part to
not
> > > consider
> > > >> > > > the fact that overrides of the APIs that we were changing
> > would
> > > have
> > > >> > > > been affected. The changes were reverted, and we have
> > > re-implemented
> > > >> > > > the new functionality within additional APIs/methods so
> that
> > > >> existing
> > > >> > > > apps will now compile/run without any changes on the
> > 33.1.1.63
> > > >> release.
> > > >> > > >
> > > >> > > > We definitely intend that there is still full
> compatibility
> > > between
> > > >> > > > Flex and any changes we make with AIR.. so thanks to
> > leokan23 and
> > > >> Alex
> > > >> > > > for bringing this to our attention!
> > > >> > > >
> > > >> > > > thanks
> > > >> > > >
> > > >> > > > Andrew
> > > >> > > >
> > > >> > > >
> > > >> > > > -----Original Message-----
> > > >> > > > From: Olaf Krueger
> > > >> > > > Sent: 06 March 2020 20:30
> > > >> > > > To: users@flex.apache.org
> > > >> > > > Subject: [EXTERNAL] RE: Flex 4.16.1 broken for AIR33.1?
> > > >> > > >
> > > >> > > > Hi,
> > > >> > > >
> > > >> > > > I didn't follow the entire discussion, but I'd like to
> > mention
> > > that
> > > >> I
> > > >> > > > am not sure if we still have enough volunteers which are
> > willing
> > > to
> > > >> > > > work on a new Flex release.
> > > >> > > >
> > > >> > > > That said, I think it would be nice if any AIR updates
> > would be
> > > >> > > > compatible with the latest Flex SDK... as long as it's
> > possible.
> > > >> > > >
> > > >> > > > Thanks,
> > > >> > > > Olaf
> > > >> > > >
> > > >> > > >
> > > >> > > >
> > > >> > > > --
> > > >> > > > Sent from:
> > > >> > > >
> > > >>
> >
>
https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=https%3A%2F%2Fclicktime.symantec.com%2F3T23VtMr4Dz6j6DqBbgaf5T7Vc%3Fu%3Dhttp%253A%252F&data=02%7C01%7Caharui%40adobe.com%7C3973fca8e91b4f4cd67808d7c4e7bd62%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C637194371909967487&sdata=PPT98XHeRJSRW1aLzQtHGxHjJs61ySTvv4JD4nm7huI%3D&reserved=0
> > > >> > > > %2Fapache-flex-users.2333346.n4.nabble.com%2F
> > > >> > > >
> > > >> > >
> > > >> >
> > > >> > --
> > > >> > Carlos Rovira
> > > >> >
> >
>
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> > > >> >
> > > >> >
> > > >> >
> > > >>
> > > >> --
> > > >> Carlos Rovira
> > > >>
> >
>
https://nam04.safelinks.protection.outlook.com/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fabout.me%2Fcarlosrovira&data=02%7C01%7Caharui%40adobe.com%7C3973fca8e91b4f4cd67808d7c4e7bd62%7Cfa7b1b5a7b34438794aed2c178decee1%7C0%7C0%7C637194371909977480&sdata=abbnnGVvfDmr4a2gq6vSl%2FR2JYKY8jRm%2F%2FeUKXSLH70%3D&reserved=0
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >>
> > > >
> > > > --
> > > > Carlos Rovira
> > > >
> >
>
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> > > >
> > > >
> > >
> > > --
> > > Carlos Rovira
> > >
> >
>
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> > >
> > >
> > >
> >
> > --
> > Carlos Rovira
> >
> >
>
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> >
> >
> >
> >
> >
>
> --
> Carlos Rovira
>
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>
--
Piotr Zarzycki
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