On 08/07/2013 03:14 AM, Tom Davies wrote: > Hi :) > Brilliant. Larger file-size is a better test and some of those comparisons > were really interesting. So.doc loads and saves much more slowly. > > I dont know how they do it but the docs team write each chapter of the guides > separately and then combine them into 1 book at the end. Master documents > perhaps? > Regards from > Tom :) Hi Tom,
Hmmm! Very interesting idea. I don't know why the idea of writing each chapter separately was not brought to my mind. Maybe because I didn't know how Master documents work. Or maybe because the original .doc template had not used Master document. But I had seen different chapters combining together in .tex template of my university, and I was aware of that capability in LaTeX but not in LO Writer. Anyway I have currently written many parts of my work in a huge document and I must cope with it. I really don't expect LO Writer to do magic for me, especially that I've seen that MS Office is slow too in loading heavy files. But I think that MS Office is still much faster in loading and saving huge files partly because it fully uses multiple cores of a CPU, partly because it doesn't load whole of a file at once (e.g. you can read and edit first parts of a doc while it's loading further parts if needed) and partly because it can save the file while you can scroll. Anyhow, it's very important for LO to support multi-threading because number of cores in upcoming CPUs is continually increasing and without using multi-threading LO won't be able to use the vast performance power of future CPUs. I also believe that shifting LO source code from Java to C++ could be a good idea, because Java and its virtual machine have considerable overhead which could slow down the performance specifically during the work with large files. Best, Sina Momken > > > > > >> ________________________________ >> From: Sina Momken <digi...@gmail.com> >> To: users@global.libreoffice.org >> Cc: Tom Davies <tomdavie...@yahoo.co.uk>; Kracked_P_P---webmaster >> <webmas...@krackedpress.com>; users@global.libreoffice.org >> Sent: Tuesday, 6 August 2013, 22:41 >> Subject: [libreoffice-users] Re: start up speed >> >> >> I also think that start up time for LO Writer and MS Office and many >> other programs is small enough. But opening an empty document in under 3 >> secs is not a huge win too! >> I believe that LO Writer is catastrophically slow in opening heavy >> documents. For proving my claim, I've done some experiments. Also these >> manual experiments are not accurate enough to be a precise benchmark but >> can show you some approximate slowness of LO Writer. Let see how long LO >> Writer takes to open or save a heavy (~185 pages thesis) document: >> >> >From clicking document to being able to edit @ .odt: 2'17" >> Completing "Opening document..." bar @ .odt: 1'25" >> >> >From Ctrl+S to being able to edit again @ .odt: 3'00" >> Completing "Saving document..." bar @ .odt: (another try): 1'40" >> >> >From clicking document to being able to edit @ .doc: 5'26" >> Completing "Opening document..." bar @ .doc: 3'14" >> >> >From Ctrl+S to being able to edit again @ .doc: 3'20" >> Completing "Saving document..." bar @ .doc: 3'17" >> >> >> Other minimized software: >> - Another heavy (~186 pages) document open in LO Writer >> - Thunderbird 17.0 with 5 accounts minimized >> - XChat with many channels open minimized >> - GoldenDict with many dictionaries minimized >> - FreeU proxy software minimized >> - No browser open >> >> File size: >> - A ~185 pages thesis in either .doc and .odt formats >> - .doc file size: 6.8 MBytes >> - .odt file size: 5.6 MBytes >> >> Software spec: >> - Linux Mint Debian Edition Update Pack 6 (latest version and repo) >> - XFCE 4.8 Desktop Environment >> - LibreOffice 3.5.4.2 >> - Thunderbird 17 (minimized) >> - XChat 2.8.8 (minimized) >> >> Hardware Spec: >> - Laptop: Dell Latitude D830 >> - CPU: Intel Core2Due T7500 Dual Core @2.2GHZ >> - RAM: 4GB @677MHz >> - GPU: NVidia quadro NVS 140m >> - HDD: 500GB @5400 RPM >> >> >> This experiment shows that LO Writer is very very slow (at least 1'30") >> when it deals with heavy documents. It's specially not acceptable when I >> realized that LO Writer always use ONLY 1 core of my CPU and it's why LO >> Writer works better on my Pentium4 @2.8GHz single core computer than my >> dual core @2.2GHz laptop. Being single-threaded for such a heavy >> software is not acceptable in a world of multi-core CPUs. >> >> Another limitation of LO Writer is that when it saves a document it >> blocks the whole software and you have to wait until completion of >> saving. This issue is solved in MS Word because MSO is a multi-threading >> software. Because I must save my document at least each 30min therefor I >> have to rest each 30min for at least 2min because LO Writer takes this >> amount of time when it saves my huge document. >> I'm not pleased with save and open operations of LO Writer at all. >> >> Regards, >> Sina Momken >> >> >> >> On 08/05/2013 05:47 PM, Andrew Brown wrote: >>> Gents >>> >>> Kracked, a good reply. If I may add my two cents worth to performance of >>> start-ups here. >>> >>> This is my system hardware top of the range in December 2007, and still >>> hops today. The only things updated since 2008 was the video card and >>> the SATA III hard drives, and the O/S's. >>> >>> Windows 7 Ult. x64 / Ubuntu 13.04 Raring Ringtail Dual boot, Intel Core2 >>> Duo 6850 3GHZ, MSI X-38 Diamond mobo, Asus ATI EAH5770 CUcore 1GB Video, >>> SuperTalent 6GB DDR3 1333MHZ, Seagate 7500RPM SATAIII 500GB (Windows >>> Boot), Seagate 7500RPM SATAIII 2TB (Data), Seagate 7500RPM SATAIII 500GB >>> (Linux), Thermaltake Toughpower 750W PSU >>> >>> Also my analogy of a well tuned and clean system, will run top gun for >>> many years compared to cutting edge modern hardware today getting bogged >>> down with willy nilly installed and unmaintained software (but again if >>> this is maintained it will remain a top gun from it's day of purchase >>> and clobber my hardware performance). I see and read too many who throw >>> good money at high end systems only to have them slow a few months >>> later, and many who poer poer the idea of cleaning a system (registry >>> and boot processes), and defragging it. So here's my tested speeds of >>> this system above. >>> >>> PC switch on to ready state to use (Windows 7 64bit, with a dual boot >>> menu selection and the login screen) = 40 seconds >>> PC switch on to ready state to use (Ubuntu 13.04 64bit, with a dual boot >>> menu selection and the login screen) = 20 seconds >>> >>> LO Writer from click on icon to ready to type / menu clicks (Windows 7 >>> 64bit) etc. - 3 seconds >>> LO Writer from click on icon to ready to type / menu clicks (Ubuntu >>> 13.04 64bit) etc. - 3 seconds >>> LO Calc from click on icon to ready to type / menu clicks (Windows 7 >>> 64bit) etc. - 3 seconds >>> LO Calc from click on icon to ready to type / menu clicks (Ubuntu 13.04 >>> 64bit) etc. - 3 seconds >>> LO Impress from click on icon to ready to type / menu clicks (Windows 7 >>> 64bit) etc. - 3 seconds >>> LO Impress from click on icon to ready to type / menu clicks (Ubuntu >>> 13.04 64bit) etc. - 3 seconds >>> >>> All the above to load a file directly i.e click on the data file which >>> loads the appropriate app (and I chose files of around 5MB - 4 seconds >>> for Writer, 5 seconds for Calc and 5 seconds for Impress in both O/S's. >>> >>> PC shutdown, from time to click on shutdown options to cold and dark >>> (Windows 7 64bit) = 15 seconds >>> PC shutdown, from time to click on shutdown options to cold and dark >>> (Ubuntu 13.04 64bit) = 5 seconds >>> >>> My LO splash logo on both O/S's is displayed in under 1 second and the >>> scroll bar in the splash logo takes under 1 second to show it's loading >>> state, the balance of the time in the 3 seconds is loading the app, and >>> I don't use the quickstarter option and have never done. I have supplied >>> the times for clicking on the data file to load the app. >>> >>> Regards >>> >>> On 05/08/2013 02:10 PM, Tom Davies wrote: >>>> Hi :) >>>> With MSO the splash screen appears immediately and keeps doing things >>>> to make it clear it is doing something. >>>> >>>> With LO it is ages before the splash screen appears so it looks like >>>> it hasn't reacted at all. >>>> >>>> So people don't trust it and they think that more time passes. It >>>> might be good to video the same system starting each up in turn. Also >>>> i think the Windows version is a lot slower to start up than the >>>> Ubuntu one. >>>> >>>> LO is getting better but it just doesn't look like it is. Perception >>>> is often more important than reality with things like this. >>>> Regards from >>>> Tom :) >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>> >>>>> ________________________________ >>>>> From: Kracked_P_P---webmaster <webmas...@krackedpress.com> >>>>> To: users@global.libreoffice.org >>>>> Sent: Monday, 5 August 2013, 12:49 >>>>> Subject: Re: [libreoffice-users] start up speed >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> For me, I do not use the Quickstart option. Their are some hassles with >>>>> upgrading some extensions if that is "on" all the time. I find that >>>>> without using that option, I have the package load up and usable for >>>>> editing quickly enough for my needs. It is faster than many other >>>>> packages I use. >>>>> >>>>> The "boot" time for LO is much faster now that in the past. Also, >>>>> compared to MS Office, it is still faster. >>>>> >>>>> There is one other "time" that needs to be measured. The time it takes >>>>> for you to be able to start editing. Sure you can have a package start >>>>> up fast and show its "page view", but it does no good if you cannot >>>>> start working with the package if it take another minute or so to allow >>>>> you to start working with it. >>>>> >>>>> Take Writer or Word. You start the package by double-clicking the icon >>>>> in the menu or on the screen. Then you get a splash screen. After that >>>>> the document or a new one is seen in the "page view" window. Now, how >>>>> long does it take from there to be able to click on a menu or start >>>>> typing editing the document? That is where I had a problem with MSO >>>>> 2003. Sure that is ten years out of date, but it was the last version >>>>> of MSO I actually work with on a regular basis. Since 2010 I have been >>>>> a "Linux" person with Ubuntu as my default desktop OS. So I have not >>>>> tried the newest version of MSO. But, with Writer, the time ti takes >>>> >from opening of the page view window to being able to edit or click on >>>>> the menus has been reduced by a large percentage since I started using >>>>> LO in its early days. >>>>> >>>>> That is the real question. How much wait time do you have between >>>>> clicking on the icon to the print of being able to work with the >>>>> package. No package is as fast as people would like, i.e. click and >>>>> edit in a matter of a 2 or 3 seconds. Right now, with 2 browser windows >>>>> open, this email package and 3 utilities on the screen, my Ubuntu >>>>> install on a mid-range quad core desktop from Feb. 2010 , takes about 7 >>>>> seconds from click to editing. That is fast enough for me. I have run >>>>> packages that take 15 to 30 seconds to open up to the point of using >>>>> it. In this day of wanting things as quick as possible, 15 to 30 >>>>> seconds may be too long for some people. >>>>> >>>>> Yet, for those of you who have been using PCs since its early days of >>>>> DOS or even Windows 95, these start up times are super fast compared to >>>>> those older systems, even with the less powerful packages that we used, >>>>> like PC-Write for word processing. >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> On 08/04/2013 07:21 PM, Tom Davies wrote: >>>>>> Hi :) >>>>>> You could have either of them use their Quickstarter but it's a pain >>>>>> and kinda blocks having the other one on your machine at the same time. >>>>>> Regards from >>>>>> Tom :) >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>> >>>>>>> ________________________________ >>>>>>> From: Tim Lloyd <tim.ll...@gmx.com> >>>>>>> To: "users@global.libreoffice.org" <users@global.libreoffice.org> >>>>>>> Sent: Monday, 5 August 2013, 0:15 >>>>>>> Subject: [libreoffice-users] start up speed >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Hi All, >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I saw a question on the Fedora Forum regarding the "boot" speed of LO >>>>>>> which is impressive especially compared to old versions of OOo. >>>>>>> >>>>>>> I think this has been discussed here in the past but I can't find any >>>>>>> specific posts. Is there anything running in the background which >>>>>>> makes >>>>>>> LO start up faster? >>>>>>> >>>>>>> Cheers >>>>>>> >>>>>>> -- >>>>>>> To unsubscribe e-mail to: users+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org >>>>>>> Problems? >>>>>>> http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ >>>>>>> Posting guidelines + more: >>>>>>> http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette >>>>>>> List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ >>>>>>> All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot >>>>>>> be deleted >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>>>> >>>>> >>>>> -- >>>>> To unsubscribe e-mail to: users+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org >>>>> Problems? >>>>> http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ >>>>> Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette >>>>> List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ >>>>> All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot >>>>> be deleted >>>>> >>>>> >>>>> >>> >>> >> >> >> >> -- >> To unsubscribe e-mail to: users+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org >> Problems? >> http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ >> Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette >> List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ >> All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be >> deleted >> >> >> -- To unsubscribe e-mail to: users+unsubscr...@global.libreoffice.org Problems? http://www.libreoffice.org/get-help/mailing-lists/how-to-unsubscribe/ Posting guidelines + more: http://wiki.documentfoundation.org/Netiquette List archive: http://listarchives.libreoffice.org/global/users/ All messages sent to this list will be publicly archived and cannot be deleted
