On 10/06/2009 02:36 AM, John Kaufmann wrote:
...
...OO's handling of a hierarchical list changes
depending on whether the list has some level-indicating character
(numbers, letters, bullets, ...) or whether 'None' is selected in the
style "Options" > "Numbering". In the latter case, which is used in your
"_Annotated_list" style (which otherwise does what I wanted), an
essential aspect of hierarchy is lost: the relationships of nodes and
branches, or level with sub-points. Unless there is some such character,
the "Bullets and Numbering" toolbar does not automatically appear in the
list context - and even if that toolbar is manually invoked, the options
to promote/demote/move_up/move_down /with subpoints/ (which IMHO should
always be the default behavior) are missing.
But say we add numbering or bullets of some sort to the list style. Now
there is a difference between those two approaches: The hierarchical
structure (promote/demote/move_with_subpoints) is lost if we use the
table approach for annotation, but not if we use the 'plain numbered
paragraphs' (with numbers or bullets). IOW, the underlying hierarchical
structure is lost if we impose a list style on a table, or a table on a
list.
Does this sound like a bug, or is there a rational design explanation
for this behavior?
Excellent points and right on the money--thanks for bringing it up. I
noticed that the toolbar wasn't available, but I had not got so far as
to realize the implications.
As far as I can see, you're exactly right: The list in a table
arrangement isn't practical if you need to rearrange the list. The B&N
toolbar functions for moving items just won't move list items between
table cells.
The missing B&N toolbar is a bug[1]. I reported it--you'd think I would
have remembered the problem before now!
To workaround the problem and get the B&N toolbar in the plain paragraph
arrangement, there are a couple of strategies I can think of:
* Change the list style to include a bullet of some sort, but make the
bullet "invisible".
* Use "unnumbered" entries for the list items.
The first strategy definitely works, although I can't see any reasonable
way to get a truly invisible bullet character. About the best I could
come up with is something thin and white. ... Oh yeah, you could use a
regular bullet, colored white, and right-aligned: That will preserve the
indent spacing; the bullet width will be effectively zero.
I suppose you could use a "web bug"--a 1-pixel, transparent image; maybe
it's possible to arrange for a zero-width image, but I can't think of
one off the top of my head.
You could use a zero-width space as the bullet character, but there's no
way to do it from the normal interface. You can specify any character as
the bullet, but the "Insert > Special Character" dialog only deals with
printing characters. Writer seems to be fine with a zero-width space as
the bullet, but you have to dive in and edit the document xml to get it.
Hardly practical.
You can configure a custom character style for the bullets that
specifies "hidden" text. That normally makes the characters disappear
entirely, but not when used on bullets or numbering.[2]
The second strategy, unnumbered entries, seems like it should do the
job, but doesn't.
First, it's a chore to add items to the list: You have to use the
"Insert Unnumbered Entry" button, then type the item. Second, and more
important, the list hierarchy functions (move with subpoints) don't work
properly on lists made of unnumbered entries. They either do nothing or
jumble the list. Playing with it a little, it seems that what Writer
calls an "unnumbered entry" is something else entirely--it definitely
does not act like a normal entry having no number.
So it seems that the plain paragraph approach, with some kind of bullet
that's as invisible as you care to make it, is the only fully-functional
approach.
<Joe
[1] Numbering toolbar not shown when numbering type is "None"
http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=61651 Target: OOo Later
[2] 'Hidden' text visible
http://qa.openoffice.org/issues/show_bug.cgi?id=61651 CLOSED as WONTFIX
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