Re: init()

[Max Rydahl Andersen]

i'm talking about doing something like throw  
VelocityRuntimeException(someexception); instead
of logging it silently.
/max

On 3/8/06, Max Rydahl Andersen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
On Tue, 07 Mar 2006 19:38:33 +0100, Will Glass-Husain <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
wrote:

> Hey Max--
>
> Appreciate the specific feedback.  We've also done a pass at #2.  In
> particular, any RuntimeException from a plugin, event handler,  
resource
> loader, etc is now passed through to the application.
>
> Are there other type of exceptions you were thinking of?

how about normal exceptions ? :)

that doesn't especially help. :)  we can't throw them without
declaring them in method signatures and that forces everyone to catch
them or declare them.  that's a burden either way and something i
think Velocity already does too much of without good, specific
justification.  so i'm definitely not into that as a general practice.
 and, of course, we're constrained to backwards compatibility in our
public API for the current version.

but seriously, if there are events that were logged and not thrown
that you think should be changed, i'd love to hear some specifics that
we can look at.  don't feel like you have to dig them up now; next
time you notice one, just pop us a note.

/max


>
> WILL
>
> On 3/7/06, Max Rydahl Andersen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>>
>> On Tue, 07 Mar 2006 18:48:45 +0100, Will Glass-Husain  
<[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> wrote:
>>
>> > Or Hibernate.  I haven't checked lately, but I seem to remember
>> hundreds
>> > if
>> > not thousands of DEBUG lines at startup.  Not a big deal.  If we  
move
>> > more
>> > of Velocity log messages to DEBUG, this seems similarly
>> inconsequential.
>>
>> There are two things wrong with velocity logging:
>>
>> 1. the level is often wrong (apparently fixed recently)
>>
>> 2. alot of the logs should default to be exceptions instead of  
ignored.
>>
>> /max
>>
>> > cheers,
>> > WILL
>> >
>> > On 3/7/06, Nathan Bubna <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> >>
>> >> you think Velocity's output is hard-to-use?  try reading the  
output
>> of
>> >> commons-digester at debug level. ;-)
>> >>
>> >> anyway, i've been fiddling with logging extensively in 1.5-dev,
>> >> lowering levels, improving the API, etc.  so i would really love  
more
>> >> specific feedback if you've got any!
>> >>
>> >> On 3/7/06, Max Rydahl Andersen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> >> > On Tue, 07 Mar 2006 01:48:54 +0100, Will Glass-Husain
>> >> <[EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> >> > wrote:
>> >> >
>> >> > > You could auto-init Velocity but log a message stating that  
you
>> are
>> >> doing
>> >> > > that...
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > ...now I understand how velocity's log output has grown to such  
a
>> huge
>> >> > amount
>> >> > of hard-to-use lines. ;)
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > /max
>> >> >
>> >> > >
>> >> > >
>> >> > > On 3/6/06, Max Rydahl Andersen <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> >> > >>
>> >> > >> On Tue, 07 Mar 2006 01:39:15 +0100, Will Glass-Husain <
>> >> [EMAIL PROTECTED]>
>> >> > >> wrote:
>> >> > >>
>> >> > >> > Sure, why not?
>> >> > >>
>> >> > >> because then users who like to know if a subsystem is  
configured
>> >> > >> before using it will not get a warning/exception.
>> >> > >>
>> >> > >> I would rather say that all the static singleton  
functionallity
>> >> > >> should be ripped out of velocity since it is a Bad Thing.
>> >> > >>
>> >> > >> /max
>> >> > >>
>> >> > >> >
>> >> > >> > On 3/6/06, Nathan Bubna <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> wrote:
>> >> > >> >>
>> >> > >> >> hey guys,
>> >> > >> >>
>> >> > >> >> here's another idea i've only half-thought through... :)
>> >> > >> >>
>> >> > >> >> why do we require users to manually init() Velocity?  are  
our
>> >> default
>> >> > >> >> settings that useless?
>> >> > >> >>
>> >> > >> >> i know most users will still want and need to do  
init(props),
>> so
>> >> it
>> >> > >> >> ultimately isn't a big deal either way.  but i think it  
could
>> >> be a
>> >> > >> >> nice convenience to automatically call init() when someone
>> tries
>> >> to
>> >> > >> >> use Velocity, especially for those using  
Velocity.evaluate().
>> >> as
>> >> it
>> >> > >> >> is, we (sometimes) throw IllegalStateExceptions if  
someone is
>> >> trying
>> >> > >> >> to use Velocity and RuntimeInstance.isInitialized()  
returns
>> >> false.
>> >> > >> >> why not just call init() instead of barking at the user?
>> >> > >> >>
>> >> > >> >> feedback appreciated. :)
>> >> > >> >>
>> >> > >> >>
>> >>  
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>> >> > >> >>
>> >> > >> >
>> >> > >> >
>> >> > >> > --
>> >> > >> > _______________________________________
>> >> > >> > Forio Business Simulations
>> >> > >> >
>> >> > >> > Will Glass-Husain
>> >> > >> > phone (415) 440-7500 x89
>> >> > >> > mobile (415) 235-4293
>> >> > >> > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> >> > >> > www.forio.com
>> >> > >>
>> >> > >>
>> >> > >>
>> >> > >> --
>> >> > >> --
>> >> > >> Max Rydahl Andersen
>> >> > >> callto://max.rydahl.andersen
>> >> > >>
>> >> > >> Hibernate
>> >> > >> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> >> > >> http://hibernate.org
>> >> > >>
>> >> > >> JBoss Inc
>> >> > >> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> >> > >>
>> >> > >>
>> >>  
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>> >> > >
>> >> > > --
>> >> > > _______________________________________
>> >> > > Forio Business Simulations
>> >> > >
>> >> > > Will Glass-Husain
>> >> > > phone (415) 440-7500 x89
>> >> > > mobile (415) 235-4293
>> >> > > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> >> > > www.forio.com
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> >
>> >> > --
>> >> > --
>> >> > Max Rydahl Andersen
>> >> > callto://max.rydahl.andersen
>> >> >
>> >> > Hibernate
>> >> > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> >> > http://hibernate.org
>> >> >
>> >> > JBoss Inc
>> >> > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> >> >
>> >> >
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>> >
>> >
>> > --
>> > _______________________________________
>> > Forio Business Simulations
>> >
>> > Will Glass-Husain
>> > phone (415) 440-7500 x89
>> > mobile (415) 235-4293
>> > [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> > www.forio.com
>>
>>
>>
>> --
>> --
>> Max Rydahl Andersen
>> callto://max.rydahl.andersen
>>
>> Hibernate
>> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>> http://hibernate.org
>>
>> JBoss Inc
>> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
>>
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>>
>
>
> --
> _______________________________________
> Forio Business Simulations
>
> Will Glass-Husain
> phone (415) 440-7500 x89
> mobile (415) 235-4293
> [EMAIL PROTECTED]
> www.forio.com



--
--
Max Rydahl Andersen
callto://max.rydahl.andersen

Hibernate
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://hibernate.org

JBoss Inc
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

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--
--
Max Rydahl Andersen
callto://max.rydahl.andersen

Hibernate
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
http://hibernate.org

JBoss Inc
[EMAIL PROTECTED]

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