On 08/06/10 21:08, nico io wrote:
Hi,
Hi. I don't know why you're suddenly "nico io" after having been "epanda" — and neither name sounds authentic — but I don't mind. I think that your proposal is serious and, as a sign of respect from someone who doesn't share your opinions in this domain, I have taken the time to write a point-by-point rebuttal. Don't take it badly: I think there is room for argument, especially if other people join the debate.
I am currently using Gvim 7.2 rebuild with this new toolbar. I think : 1. Gvim has to improve its visual interface to seduce new users.
I don't think Vim is the kind of software which "seduces" new users by its pretty toolbars. What keeps Vim users faithful is sheer editing power (but it takes time for them to realize just how powerful Vim can be).
I don't know what kinds of toolbars there are in XEmacs, but they could be as sexy as you like, they won't make me switch editors. In general I prefer no-nonsense looks with everything where I need it, to flashy stuff where half of what I need is missing or tucked away. Happily the gvim toolbar, in its present size, doesn't bother me too much so I keep it displayed even though I practically never use it, but if it played too much the game of the frog trying to be a bull, I would quickly add ":set go-=T" to my vimrc.
1.a I suggest the toolbar in 48px size border mixed with the existing menu => Gvim takes a new look AND you can attach your new vimscript plugin to a visual icon
Like Bram, I think that a 48px high toolbar takes up a lot of space. IMHO 32px is a maximum, it might perhaps be possible to make do with 24. This said, if this new toolbar can be installed by the user _instead_ of the "normal" one without recompiling gvim, by adding some statement in the vimrc, then why not? But not as default.
1.b In the futur, to enable a slide feature to this toolbar in order to permit to add dynamically more icons than the toolbar's width permit it.
The only reason you feel that this is necessary is because you've installed huge buttons. Yours take up about 80% of the width, mine about 66 or 70%, and it looks to me like there is room for many more buttons — if desired, which is not obvious.
2. Think that several existing Icon of current gvim 7.2 toolbar are obsolete meanwhile.... .....meanwhile today everybody use usb key..... so I think we have to develop some vimscript around this usb key.
To Vim a USB key is just a place to store files, it is no different from a disk: in today's Unix language it's "a filesystem", in the language I used 40 years ago on Honeywell mainframes it's "a mass-storage device".
Also, if USB drives are so hip, why are you displaying (obsolete) diskettes as the icons for your "Save" and "Save all" buttons? Probably because anyone will recognize that they are disks, which is not necessarily the case with a CD icon...
2. a. Some script to store or retrieve data like vimfiles into/to usb key (see usb key icon), I have done a vimscript
No need for a script. Retrieve with ":e foobar.baz", store with ":w" or ":saveas bazbar.foo". Include paths as needed, or :cd to the USB drive beforehand.
2. b. To develop many features around managing _vimrc and vimfiles to usb key in order to be able to work everywhere with gvim.
I think there is a project about that somewhere, to be able to use "the same" Vim setup on several computers, but it isn't obvious to make it work. You couldn't rasily take advantage of 64-bit processors if you have to keep compatibility with another computer's 32-bit one. And try as you will, a single executable won't work on any two of Windows, Linux and Mac, even if all three have the same Intel processor. Also, self-installers (as used on Windows) and .dmg "disk image" archives (as used on the Mac) have their advantages.
So, I can work for the community to add this new toolbar to Gvim 7.3 release if enough people agree with my thoughts.
Even though there are already a lot of improvements in gvim 7.3a compared to 7.2, it is still a minor release. There were much more important changes between 6 and 7, and yet (with the exception of a tab bar) the look of gvim didn't change at all. I think that if we want a radical change of gvim's look and feel, it would be for Vim 8 at the earliest. Unless, as I said, the present look can be kept as default, with the possibility to change it to yours by some command in the vimrc, or maybe in a colorscheme.
Thank you to see my jpg joined. Epanda. French. Gvim Evangelist
Finally, IIUC, builds of gvim for various OSes borrow their toolbar buttons from the corresponding GUI themes. My toolbar buttons come from Gnome, not from Bram (or rather, Bram wrote the source so that gvim for GTK2/Gnome2 GUI borrows its buttons from Gnome): for instance, the button "Choose a Vim script to run" for the "Toolbar.RunScript" menu is a smaller but exact copy of the "cogwheels" button on my Gnome taskbar, whose tooltip says "Run an application by typing a command or choosing from a list".
Best regards, Tony. -- -rwxr-xr-x 1 root 24 Oct 29 1929 /bin/ed -rwxr-xr-t 4 root 131720 Jan 1 1970 /usr/ucb/vi -rwxr-xr-x 1 root 5.89824e37 Oct 22 1990 /usr/bin/emacs -- You received this message from the "vim_dev" maillist. Do not top-post! Type your reply below the text you are replying to. For more information, visit http://www.vim.org/maillist.php
