On Monday 25 July 2005 16:06, [EMAIL PROTECTED] wrote: > > From: Grimer > > > > I've been re-reading one of Puthoff's old papers > > from 1986, which was recenly referred to on Vortex, > > viz, > > ... > > > ===================================================== > > ABSTRACT > > > > We show here that, within the stochastic electrodynamic > > formulation and at the level of Bohr theory, the ground > > state of the hydrogen atom can be precisely defined as > > resulting from a dynamic equilibrium between radiation > > emitted due to acceleration of the electron in its > > ground-state orbit and radiation absorbed from zero-point > > fluctuations of the background vacuum electromagnetic > > field, thereby resolving the issue of radiative collapse > > of the Bohr atom. > > ===================================================== > > > > and the tail end of the discussion, > > > > >========================================================== > > > > Finally, it is seen that a well-defined, precise quantita- > > tive argument can be made that the ground state of the > > hydrogen atom is defined by a dynamic equilibrium in > > which collapse of the state is prevented by the presence of > > zero-point fluctuations of the electromagnetic field. This > > carries with it the attendant implication that the stability > > of matter itself is largely mediated by ZPF phenomena in > > the manner described here, a concept that transcends the > > usual interpretation of the role and significance of zero- > > point fluctuations of the vacuum electromagnetic field. > >========================================================= > > Putoff's theory, on the surface, possesses an elegant symmetry to it, not > that I'm really in a position to challenge it. There remains, however, a > nagging question that gnaws at me. > > According to my own provincial understanding of QM theory it's considered > somewhat of an embarrassment that the electron doesn't seem to collapse > into the nucleus of the hydrogen atom - due to the fact that it should be > emanating energy - due to the fact that it is costantly 'accelerating' > around the hydrogen nucleus. Clearly, this ain't happening! > > Now, according to Putoff's model, ZPE fluctuations, more or less, > instantaneously re-supply the departing energy that according to QM should > be emanating from the orbiting electron. IOW, ZPE fluctuations conveniently > prevent the orbiting electron from collapsing into the nucleus, which > incidentally saves the universe as a secondary benefit. > > Never the less there remains, in my view, a HUGE unsolved mystery: > > If energy is being "emitted" only to be re-supplied by ZPE fluctuation that > STILL doesn't explain WHAT HAPPENED to the original energy emitted from the > electron. > > Can someone explain where it all went? > > Regards, > Steven Vincent Johnson > www.OrionWorks.com
Of course, as my limited understanding of it from memories of my university days, the Bohr atom is a statistical model with the locations of the electrons given by a probability analysis ala Schroedinger, typically a second order differential equation similar to that for vibration and resonance analysis. The electron can be anywhere in this right circular cone/ semi-sphere with the vertix at the nucleus.....until you look! Accepting for the moment what Puthoff stated about electron behavior, then the electron is constantly losing energy to the surroundings equal, supposedly, to the energy it is gaining from the ZPE. Practitioners of thermo are always talking about vague things like the 'surroundings' as one of my old Professors, a Dr Thorne, used to talk about in my thermo class. When they are not talking about that, they are saying things like: "You never get out of a process what you put in!". The good doctor said a good deal more, but he was a brilliant man and it was difficult for we third year engineering students to follow him as we was always venturing into partial differential equations....a few courses above us... for proofs to his ideas. My humble take on it will be that the ZPE supplies the energy that keeps the universe running. If an electron loses an energy quanta, say 'e' whilst in orbit, then the ZPE supplies an energy (e + delta[e]) to keep it at or above ground state.....efficiencies approach unity assymptotically. This excess energy is not lost, however; and neither does it return to the ZPE. Therefore it must be lost to radiated heat or electrical energy potential however small. From this it then devolves that the ZPE is losing energy to all matter great and small. It also suggests an idea to extract energy in large amounts from the ZPE. That is to depress that electron and remove the ZPE energy as it appears, a process which may be more easily said than done unless this is just 'up his alley' for Randall Mills and his Black Light Power. Yep, the same site with all the slow downloading PDF's. There has to be a limit for ZPE extraction, else black holes could not exist. At least not stable ones. Standing Bear
