If you have the patience, this CalTech Electric Field Applet can be used to set up a simulation of the charged apparatus, the ion charges and the putative excess negative charge of the earth and the positive ionosphere.
http://www.cco.caltech.edu/~phys1/java/phys1/EField/EField.html My rough calculations before embarking on "flying" the 1.5 kg VDG plus a 2 kg 12 volt battery pack plus a 0.5 kg inverter and 0.5 kg heavy gauge aluminum foil atop a well isolated 10 kg capacity digital scale, indicates that a lift of 3 kg can be attained with a potential of 1.5 million volts on a device with the negative charge pumped from the inner sphere to the surrounding outer sphere by the VDG. But don't bet on it. :-) Fred > [Original Message] > From: Michel Jullian <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: <vortex-l@eskimo.com> > Date: 2/15/2007 3:34:23 AM > Subject: Re: [Vo]: Re: Fred's Van de Graaff Antics > > > ----- Original Message ----- > From: "John Berry" <[EMAIL PROTECTED]> > To: <vortex-l@eskimo.com> > Sent: Thursday, February 15, 2007 9:59 AM > Subject: Re: [Vo]: Re: Fred's Van de Graaff Antics > > > > >> You can calculate i*d/2E-4 (i current in A, d gap in m) for yourself can't > >> you? Well that's the ion wind's contribution to the thrust in N. Measure > >> more thrust than that in a device, and then you'll have found evidence of > >> something else contributing, until then you're an idiot ion wind skeptic :) > > > > > > I haven't really done any lifter experiments (not one light enough to take > > off anyway) and math isn't my strong suit, > > It doesn't have to take off, you can measure the decrease in apparent weight. As for the maths, it boils down to: > > Ion wind contributed thrust in grams = 0.5*i*d with i in mA and d in mm > > Is this simple enough for you? > > > I'm basing the statement on > > something I read about a NASA (Nasa Ain't a Space Agency, or Not A Space > > Agency) mathematician, I believe it was saying that ion wind was not > > sufficient to account for the thrust, and honestly when you look at the > > different things that have been done to reduce or apparently rule out ion > > wind, well they paint a far more convincing picture, especially since as I > > said ion wind doesn't account for other embodiments of Brown's work hardly > > at all. > > Hearsay, beliefs, you'd better see for yourself. Whatever the device, > > > Why when there is more evidence for a real effect do you choose to brush it > > aside in preference of a less likely mundane explanation, just consider the > > implications of such technology if it can be made effective. > > In fact if you think there is even a chance that there might be something in > > it you should realize it is too valuable to dismiss. > > Unless of course you are in reality a skeptic > > No, I speak of experience, I have done experiments and measurements at all kinds of voltages and currents. As I said, you're the ion wind skeptic: > > skep·tic also scep·tic > n. > 1. One who instinctively or habitually doubts, questions, or disagrees with assertions or generally accepted conclusions > > > in which case what are you doing here? > > Wasting my time on someone who doesn't have a clue. > > > ... > >> >> Beware though that high voltages (25kV for a typical computer screen > >> power > >> >> supply) at any sizeable current (more than a few mA) can be lethal, and > >> hurt > >> >> a lot in the very least (feels a bit like having your arm caught in a > >> meat > >> >> chopper I was told). > >> > > >> > > >> > Actually the only thing you feel is a pin point burn and the smell of > >> > burning skin, plus a buzzing. > >> > If it wasn't for the burn it's not painful though possibly irritating. > >> > >> The friend who made that description of the pain plays with high voltages > >> at the kW level, do you? :) > > > > > > No, not kW levels, in fact you can get what I described from a 12w flyback > > that powers a plasma globe. > > How cute, is this what you tried to fly your lifter with? :) You can get what my friend Xavier (fka Saviour) from Blazelabs described from the 1kW multi-flyback shown on his site (a supply I know quite well :). > > > Honestly you seem to know very little about electricity in theory or > > practice. > > lol :) > > Michel
