I think the problem is, that you look too much at unimportant information.
First we must decide which of the information is imortant and which is
unimportant.
Also we must see if there is any important information missing. (This is
the most difficult part)
If nothing is missing, then we have all necessarry information.
The important information is: There is no superheated steam because
inside the ecat is everything almost at boiling temperature. For
superheated steam you need an extra heater that heats the steam and
there is none.
Because the temperature inside the e-cat is above 100 degrees the
boiling temperature inside must be above 100 degrees and therefore the
pressure inside the ecat must be above 1 bar.
However this all doesnt matter. Outside of the ecat the pressure is 1
bar (respective the overpressure is 0 bar) and equals air pressure and
the boiling point is about 100 degrees.
Because the e-cat and the hose has thermic isolation against the ambient
it cannot loose thermic energy.
So all thermic energy must come out of the end of the hose.
Unfortunately the temperature at the end of the hose is not measured.
But fortunately we know the boiling point at air pressure, this is 100
degrees and so we can assume the output temperature is 100 degrees
because we have water and steam at the output.
The volume of water at end of hose is measured and fortunately this
equals the mass of water.
So we know input water mass-flow and output water mass-flow at air
pressure and we know, the system is isolated and cannot loose energy
inbetween and we know all input and output temperatures and from (input
flow - output flow) we know the amount of steam mass-flow at output and
from this we can calculate the energy.
You can ignore anything between input and output if the system inbetween
has thermic isolation because energy cannot been created out of nothing
and it cannot vanish into nirvana.
This is the key for understanding and calculation (in my humble opinion)
Best,
Peter
Am 16.09.2011 19:36, schrieb Alan J Fletcher:
I'm still trying to figure out what's going on!
The outlet port is very high on the unit ... if it was just the
overflow from a kettle boiler then there wouldn't be any room for steam.
I might have to go back to thinking of it as a Tube boiler, where the
flow of the steam carries the water with it.
But in the early stages of the process the overflow water clearly
pulses, just a fraction of a second later than the sound of the pump.
That implies it's directly connected to the incoming water. It's a
kettle again.
I've put up a few of my calculator results at
http://lenr.qumbu.com/rossi_ecat_sep11_b.php
It's clearly producing SOMETHING ... but how MUCH?
How does it get the 130C at the instrument port and 50% fluid water at
the outlet?
I think there are three ways of reaching 130C.
a) The internal pressure is 3 Bars, and the quality is 0.5. The water
and the steam are in equilibrium at 130C.
As the 130C steam leaves the system the pressure drops to 1 Bar
and the temperature drops to 100C
(adiabatic expansion -- a vertical line on the temperature-enthalpy
diagram) -- and it might start condensing.
But the 130C water would probably flash into steam, and in the
process cool down to 100C.
So do we end up with MORE or LESS water than we had inside the eCat?
b) The internal pressure is 1 Bar (atmospheric, plus a little
back-pressure), as a single chamber.
In this case, the only way you can reach 130C is for ALL the water
to evaporate, and for the steam to be super-heated.
The 130C 100% Dry superheated steam leaves the eCat. But to get
the observed 50% fluid water, this has to cool and condense in about
10cm.
I don't think you can get rid of enough heat that quickly : it
need nucleation sites, which will be available only on the wall of the
tube.
c) The eCat is structured as TWO chambers : the first is a kettle
boiler at 100C (1 Bar). Any excess fluid overflows directly, at 100C.
The steam component then goes into a second chamber, where it is
superheated to 130C at 1 Bar. Because it is a separate chamber
it does not have to be in equilibrium with the water.
Note : this separation of boiler and superheater is very common in
traditional boiler design.
WARNING : needs a non-proportional font like courier !!!
Port
| |
*------------------------------* *----*
| Superheated 1 Bar | | |
| Steam 130C ==> | | outlet hose
95% Dry | *------------------------
1 Bar 100C | ^ *=====================* Superheated steam =====>
Steam | | | CORE | 130C
|~~~~~|
|~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~ overflow fluid 100C
| | | *---------* ~ *-----
| *=====================* | | ~ |
~~~~~ ====| Water | | ~ |
Inlet | Boil 100C | Water
Trap 100C
*--------------------------------------*
This 130C steam also exits through the hose, and may (but need not)
condense.
It does not have time to reach equilibrium with the 100C overflow
fluid over the 10cm distance.
The main reason I DON'T like this is that the outlet is so high on
the eCat.
Missing measurements:
a) Pressure at the instrument port (to confirm it is 1 Bar)
b) Temperature of the overflow fluid water -- should be 100C
c) Temperature of the steam exiting the eCat -- if it was
superheated at 1 Bar then it should still be at 130C
I can't figure out the "dumping" of the water at the end, either. Is
it 100C water, or is it 130C water? 1 Bar or 3 Bars ?
I've never seen 25L of boiling water dumped through a tap, so I don't
know what it should look like.
The general argument is the same as for the hose outlet -- 130C water
would flash VERY rapidly.
ps -- This is a first///// second draft of what I'm thinking. I'll
change my mind again tomorrow!
