Hi, James,
I didn't mean to throw cold water on any good ideas, I just didn't
see "My Dream App" as a productive route to reach the goal of an
integrated set of WO development tools to replace Apple's offerings.
As I mentioned, it might be more productive in its side effects (i.e.
PR) if we tried it, however.
On Aug 24, 2006, at 8:14 AM, James Cicenia wrote:
Jerry -
You are probably correct.
I am an Eclipse user and love it for Java development. Haven't
moved up to the latest version. I am waiting for a rev on the new
Powerbooks as I rarely buy a rev1 Apple product. I figured that
would be a good time to make my transition.
However, maybe, we should put together our own little competition?
Maybe mirror Apples and try to ride the publicity train?
A worthy thought.
I realize more and more that this is the end of WOBuilder. Yes I am
one who loves dragging and dropping, bindings, command-1 for my
bindings list, etc., HOWEVER, with all the talk and chatter on the
lists, I truly believe we must productize the communities
offerings. And as such maybe we should lobby Apple for a one time
grant of money, etc, where all the contributors can be financially
awarded, and even given some Apple help.
Until I hear what Apple announced at WWDC, I can't even intelligently
respond to this. However, like you, I LOVE using visual tools for
components of a system that are more effectively visualized than read
about (e.g. EOModels/ERModels, Web pages, rule sets). Although I do
it, I think the need to drop back to manually editing raw HTML or
EOModel plists represents an indictment of the tool set.
It reminds me of the days in which we had to munge the assembler code
spewed by early faulty compilers. You just don't DO that anymore and
I feel the same way about the WO graphic tools.
I wrote on the other list and probably insulted people (believe you
me, I have complete respect for anyone who has contributed anything
to WO and eclipse. But, I think we need to look to develop a
completely integrated WebObjects development environment and the
more visual the better. It should be packaged and have its own cool
name. Ruby on Rails just sounds better than WOLips and WOBuilder...
Now Project Wonder sounds great to me.. so I am thinking.. a
complete bundling of Wonder and Eclipse and ??? to form some really
nice and integrated development and testing environment. Maybe even
have one very large download that has and installs eclipse, wonder,
rulemodeler, EOEntityModeler, WonderBuilder, etc.
hmmm, WonderBuilder... sounds not so bad to me.
The names are cute and probably more important than either of us
wants to admit. Speaking of important names, I think the name de jour
for the kind of tool suite that you would like to see is "stack". As
long as we call the latest collection of the tools a stack, we've
already won over 12% of the development community. RoR comes with a
stack. All we have is a bunch of tools.
More than the name, the concept that I, as a developer, can get the
whole "stack" in one download and that every tool in the "stack"
integrates with the other tools in a clean fashion, is inviting. I
have yet to see "stack" defined in such a way, (sounds more like the
crap I have to peruse when my app blows chunks), but that seems to be
the way the term is being used to good effect in the RoR lists.
Regards,
Jerry
James Cicenia
On Aug 24, 2006, at 6:59 AM, Jerry W. Walker wrote:
Hi, James,
My reading of the page you referenced and the page at http://
mydreamapp.com/ says that we submit ideas to:
* a set of judges
* the "Killer App Dream Team"
* the (already 2000) voters
who will collectively decide which idea gets implemented, not by
us, but by the "Killer App Dream Team" developers.
Given that (from my inferences over the last two weeks, and in
lieu of any official communication on this important topic from
Apple to the plebeians who couldn't attend WWDC) Apple just
dropped support of a (almost) working set of WebObjects tools,
what would cause this constituency to agree that a working set of
WO development tools would constitute their idea of a "Killer App"?
Just asking.
On the other hand, it doesn't hurt to try, and if we submit ideas
that reflect what the original tools actually did, perhaps the
submission will help spread the word about what an astounding set
of technology WebObjects already represents. I wouldn't get my
hopes up, however, that the idea would be accepted. I think Apple
wants the community (us) to come up with a set of Open Source
tools that run everywhere, not just on Cocoa.
Regards,
Jerry
On Aug 24, 2006, at 7:13 AM, James Cicenia wrote:
http://news.yahoo.com/s/macworld/20060821/tc_macworld/
mydreamapp20060821_0
Why don't we submit a killer WebObjects development environment
application suite?
- James Cicenia
--
__ Jerry W. Walker,
WebObjects Developer/Instructor for High Performance Industrial
Strength Internet Enabled Systems
[EMAIL PROTECTED]
203 278-4085 office
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